[CS2] Taokaka vs Carl Clover

[Domethieus]

Will edit this once more information is collected. Till then, discuss.

[x AJ x]

I will get this started. If you feel that there is anything wrong or misplaced. Please voice your opinion.

Always pay close attention to Ada! If she is near Carl or on the screen watch for 8D and Con Brio. A smart Carl will look for you to use your drive in the air. Proceed with caution for these could potentially lead to heavy CH combos. However if you can bait them out by using Tao's drive faints you may be able to damage Ada or even land Counter Hit according to the Carl player's skill level.

As for Carl pressure. If possible try to crawl under his 5B and punish afterwards if he is not using Ada for support. If you get caught up in Carl's sandwich pressure. Look for 6D and 5B in his block strings to crawl under. Afterwards jump if possible to punish Carl with a j.C or j.2B. If you ever find yourself blocking Carl and Ada in the corner while you have no meter. look for an opportunity to sticky kitty out of the corner as soon as possible. Be mindful of Carl's 5C as for it will punish pretty much all of your normal's except for 5C and j.C with the right conditions. Lastly you can crawl under j.A keep this in mind.

As for Tao's mix ups in this match up. They all work very well if Ada is not around. Keep in mind that Carl's 6A can stuff out the 2D~B and 236D mix ups. Lastly look for when a Carl user might try and Vivace out of your pressure. These can be easily baited and lead into big CH combos.

[ThaMusli]

Thanks alot for the tip about crawling out of sandwich AJ. Helped me out of Carl pressure so many times, especially crawling under 6D

Something i've picked up vs Carl is that focusing on hitting Nirvana often focuses Carl to engage you plus her gauge gets low. Just watch out for potential punishes from Carl if he notices you are targeting Nirvana. Even if Carl does hit punishes you for attacking Nirvana he cant capitalize that much since the gauge is low.

[x AJ x]

What normal's are you using to punish Ada?

[ThaMusli]

Mostly 5B and 5C. 5b is fast enought to be able to block 4D (thats the move when Nirvana does not get interupted even tho you hit her, right?) and react to if carl jumps in. I use 5C for more range obviously and it keeps me at a more safe distance. Watch out for reaction Rhapsody tho.

[NeoGio0o]

After trolling playing some pretty decent level carl players (ones that can actually do the unblockable reset on a consistent basis) I think I have finally got a good grasp on how I would personally approach this match up.

Carl's pressure- They don't call him the mixup master for nothing when stuck between him and ada his mixup is on a whole different level then from when he is pressuring you by himself. When sandwiched you are at Carl's mercy his pressure is something you just can't sit there and try to block with the help of Ada's 2D (overhead punch) and 3D (ground had rotation) Carl can easily setup unblockables for free damage->100% unblockable reset->more damage->rinse and repeat till tao is dead. Tao's below average health is very advantageous for Carl since he doesn't need to much Ada meter to actually kill her with just a rinse and repeat of his 100% unlbockable reset this gives him freedom to waste a little more Ada meter than normal to control space and close the gap. As far as frame advantage goes you can't mash out of his basic block strings unless he says he you can. You can crawl Carl's 5B and Ada's 6D, but not only will Carl players be looking out for this the risk is insanely high and the punishment for failure is legitimate death. Luckily he needs to position you in between him and ada to gain access to his god like pressure, with tao having the most mobility in the game this is a very hard task for him to do.

Carl's anti air's- 6A( got buff since CS1 and get's the job done),2C(lol probably the worst anti air in the game but it does work once in every 3 blue moons),Ada 8D (not sure whether to count this as an air to air but it will stuff approaches), Ada 4D ( has super armor and cannot be interrupted so I guess it works),623D (Brio is another one of those moves that will just stuff air approaches). 6A is his best option overall and it isn't active for too long so it really need to be timed in order for it to work properly with triple jumps and good C cancels you shouldn't have too much trouble with it outside of punishing due to it recovering pretty fast. Brio is pretty good as well due to it's good hit box, but it's more of a normal that controls space rather than anti air.

Tao's pressure on Carl- Carl has the least amount of defensive options in the game due to his gear super not being fully invincible on startup except during the super flash means he can be hit before the super actually starts and his counter assault is kinda fast but doesn't have much range. Vivace A lost invincibility frames and combined with the instant block nerf has become less reliable for getting out of pressure, but vivace is still pretty handy for dodging air normal's (good amount of head invincibility frames) so stick to ground pressure strings to avoid him from escaping. Carl's backdash is not bad at all, but it's not something that you really have to go out your way to bait out , if you do hit him out his backdash it's important to remember that he is air borne so use 5B/2B hit confirmed into 5C or 6A into j8D-A loop. When you get Carl blocking don't give him any room to breathe he has no DP and needs to heat to get out of tough situations. Though one thing to look out for is that if you are pressuring Carl while in between him and Ada not only is this a tad bit dangerous rapshody of memories(multi punch super) becomes a pretty decent way out of pressure due to the fact that you will hit Carl,but Ada will keep swinging her robotic fist.

Neutral game/Positioning- Tao's mobility definitely gives her the advantage in terms of neutral game, since Carl cannot run or Cancel his forward dash with barrier (will go in depth later) he has an extremely hard time catching Tao and has to rely on his above average air normal's to try and fish for a counter hit. Truth be told I suggest you polish up how to be annoying with tao because due to Carl being able to actually kill you when he catches you in between him and Ada time out's will be what you are aiming for, simply put get the life lead and run away till the clock run's out there is nothing Carl can safely do to stop you. Generally Carl will be fishing for air normal counter hit's as well as Brio and clap counter hit's all of these can be and should be avoided. Tao should only be fishing for counter hits when she doesn't have the life lead or when Ada is not near her other than those two situations running away and holding a life lead is top priority.

Carl air normal's- Must admit the little guy got some pretty good air normal's, but they are still nothing compared to lol Jin J.B. His J.B,J.A, and lol allegretto are all good at stuffing Tao's drives so spacing yourself is a must his j.A is 5 frames ( fastest on the game?) and is really good at stuffing air grab attempts and stopping you from getting out the corner with drives. J.B has a good hit box and good active frames and can really be tossed out to control air space and occasionally stuff Tao's j.C and j.D. Last but not least is Allegretto do not underestimate it's hit box and active frames that is all besides that it's a poor way to stuff drives without Ada to cover the recovery.

Best tools in the matchup- Your mobility is your best tool in this matchup I am extremely serious when I say go for timeouts not only is it the safest option. Unfortunately for Carl no matter how hard he tries and wishes to Santa clause can never catch Tao. For the most part space your air normal's out and don't get predictable with your approaches (when you don't have the life lead) and you should be fine nothing all that special besides the usual of not getting touched and avoid being sandwiched at all cost.

Getting out of pressure/Things to exploit- Obviously there will come a time in which you get sandwiched when this time comes I suggest you read the following. First things first you can not block an unblockable hence the point of the name so the only real way out it is to wait till he is about to go for one in the middle of a blockstring usually Ada 2D/3D are the Cue's to look out for and simply either jump barrier away or mash out. it is possible to mash out/ jump away out of every one of Carl's unblockable's besides the 100% guaranteed reset one and when your getting hit (Also if Carl does 2B, 2D release, 5B,6B it is both anti mash and unblockable,but the timing is very strict so you don't see it too often) . The only problem with mashing out is you have to pay very close attention to what move ada is doing and you generally need to kinda read/react to it very quickly, but rest assured it is possible. Something you may want to exploit is the fact that Carl cannot cancel his forward dash into neither a normal or barrier block, so he has a lot of problem with barrier defense due to the push back this and the fact that 8D(the clap) is not unblockable anymore now it's air unblockable (must be barrier guarded in the air) and breaks 2 primers which is still deadly, but this really makes his ability to lock people down weaker. Barrier blocking and mashing when you see him froward dashing is also another option but more riskier since smart Carl players will cover the forward dash with Ada and it's not really guaranteed you will avoid being hit by her. Burst early and logically Carl is a very good burst baiter so choose your spots to burst wisely or be punished with death. Never sit on meter always CA, IB hexaedge if you want not really recommended but it is a way out and if you get it to hit you just knocked of 1/3 of Carl's health. If the Carl is not using 3D to stop you from crawling his air normals mid blockstring feel free to Crawl, you can crawl everything besides J.2C which can be canceled into allegretto to reduce it's recover frames but if your feeling risky and got the reactions go for it just know the punishment for failure is death.

Things to look out for- Carl can Cancel his j.2C with allegretto to make this terrible move into an extremely fast cross up that is safe and plus frames on block (even on Instant Block)this is what Carl player will most likely be going for when Ada is right behind them and they are trying to position in sandwich position. Fueco/3D/2D/4D into vivace is another cross up attempt that they might use to get you sandwich so always be prepared to switch the side you are blocking in. Carl can change his air trajectory to descend faster than normal using his glide throw trick be careful as this can be done both backwards and Forward, as well as it's a good way to setup empty jump lows/catch jump outs/close the gap and randomly grab you out an air normal. The last thing to note would probably be that only the first hit of 3D is a low everything else is a mid so keep this in mind when blocking sandwich pressure as you might get caught in a fake unblockable and die for your lack of knowledge.

Final Words- I can not stress how important it is to go for timeouts and to avoid getting sandwiched at all cost, seriously it's an experience I guess most of you all will have to behold first hand in order to understand the importance seeing it is just not enough. If Carl ever catches you sandwiched and you have no burst consider yourself dead because if you get touched with him having at least 50% Ada meter you will get unblockable rest XN until you die Tao's health is just too low thus meaning he requires less Ada meter to actually kill you. Never stop moving around and whatever you do never get gutsy and try to approach him if you already have the life lead please do your best to lame it out as much as possible even if you have negative warning keep running and just let the time run out. Picking good times to jump out of his pressure,know when to mash out as well as proper usage of bursting and CA is key in your survival

As always will edit this post to fix grammar mistakes and for accuracy. More information is definitely needed and any fixes or constructive criticism that you all have for this post is more than welcomed this is just my opinion and collected knowledge of what I presume to be a good way to approach this match.

Edited September 30, 2011 by NeoGio0o
Accuracy