[CP] Azrael - Gameplay Discussion v.2 (Discuss Videos/Combos/Questions/etc.)

[zankoku]

Incidentally for the 5B > 2C > 3D route, I believe you can get 4.8k meterless without the crush trigger, and that route in general is able to carry to the corner from literally middle of the stage (going by Lessons grid).

[Ice Cube]

5A corner:
(UW/LW) 5A > 5B > 2C > 6D/3D, 6A, 5B > TCL, 2D (3.9k) (TCL 2D link is tight on some character e.g Lambda)

5A > 5B > 5BB > 2D > RC > 2B > TCL, 2C > 6D (3.2k)

[Leopold]

Hey guys, not sure if someone covered this up but I found these out.

 

Version one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1czR4eZAjGE

 

Version two:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_du_mvrOdVM

[Ice Cube]

Hey guys, not sure if someone covered this up but I found these out.

 

Version one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1czR4eZAjGE

 

Version two:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_du_mvrOdVM

1st: you can get double weakpoint meterless

5B 2C 3D 6A IAD jC 214D 5A TC 236D

2nd: a more optimal version would be

5B 2C 3D 5B sjCD RC jC 236C(whiff) 46C 236D 66 5C 6B*4 3C 6A 6D/BHS

I found a recently uploaded combo video http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm26124655, plenty of cool stuff

EDIT: A few more metered no weakpoint combos:

5B > 5BB > 2D > RC > 2B > TCL, 6A, 5B > 2C, 5B > jABC jD (4145, gain 2 weakpoints)

5B > 5BB > 2D > RC > 2B > TCL, 6A, 5B > 2C > 3D. 5B > sjBC jD (4493)

5B > 5BB > 236A > RC > 3C > 2B > TCL, 6A, 5B > jABC jD (4319)

5B/2B/5C > 236A > RC > 3C > 2B > TCL, 6A, 5B > 2C, 5B > jABC jD (4606/4686/4906)

5B > 5BB > BHS > RC > TCL, 6A, 5B > 2C, 5B > jABC jD (5822)

[o Nereus o]

1st: you can get double weakpoint meterless

5B 2C 3D 6A IAD jC 214D 5A TC 236D

2nd: a more optimal version would be

5B 2C 3D 5B sjCD RC jC 236C(whiff) 46C 236D 66 5C 6B*4 3C 6A 6D/BHS

I found a recently uploaded combo video http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm26124655, plenty of cool stuff

EDIT: A few more metered no weakpoint combos:

5B > 5BB > 2D > RC > 2B > TCL, 6A, 5B > 2C, 5B > jABC jD (4145, gain 2 weakpoints)

5B > 5BB > 2D > RC > 2B > TCL, 6A, 5B > 2C > 3D. 5B > sjBC jD (4493)

5B > 5BB > 236A > RC > 3C > 2B > TCL, 6A, 5B > jABC jD (4319)

5B/2B/5C > 236A > RC > 3C > 2B > TCL, 6A, 5B > 2C, 5B > jABC jD (4606/4686/4906)

5B > 5BB > BHS > RC > TCL, 6A, 5B > 2C, 5B > jABC jD (5822)

Why are you RC'ing 2D into 2B? that links normally..

 

EDIT: Ooooo.. nevermind. not sure if 4.1k is worth the meter though,.. nonetheless.. good stuff!

[zankoku]

Little idea I had.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFN925LuZ6Y

With both weakpoints in corner,

5B > 2C > 3D > 5D > 214D > 5A > TCL > 5B > j.B > j.C > j.D

5092 damage and resets both weakpoints.

 

Might be able to fit in a 6A after TCL?

[o Nereus o]

Little idea I had.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFN925LuZ6Y

With both weakpoints in corner,

5B > 2C > 3D > 5D > 214D > 5A > TCL > 5B > j.B > j.C > j.D

5092 damage and resets both weakpoints.

 

Might be able to fit in a 6A after TCL?

this wouldn't work if you did 3D > 6D instead? or would it? also.. doesn't 6D do more damage than 5D?

[zankoku]

6D is too slow, you need the bounce to be as high as possible for the 214D to send high enough to pick up from.

[o Nereus o]

Little idea I had.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFN925LuZ6Y

With both weakpoints in corner,

5B > 2C > 3D > 5D > 214D > 5A > TCL > 5B > j.B > j.C > j.D

5092 damage and resets both weakpoints.

 

Might be able to fit in a 6A after TCL?

you can link 5B instead of 5A and the combo does 5.2k. i tried adding a 6A and when i did.. i was only allowed to link either a j.A or j.B and that's it.. they tech out of the rest.

[RentalBlackout]

Azrael Challenge 20(youtube id nakodid)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXRUH5NRc3o

 

EDIT: In circumstances you do TCL(high splat)>6A>5B>j.B>j.C>jc>j.D, you get a bit more damage if you use 6B instead of 5B. You have to high jump cancel though. Easier to jump/high jump cancel 6B in this version, so it's worth it.

 

e.g Corner [uW] 5B>2C>6D>slight delay 5C>TCL>6A>6B>hj.B>j.C>jc j.D gives you 5076 instead of 4935.

Also works for when you end with 22C>5B>j.B>j.C>jc j.D. In certain combos(like in Kinkuli's vid, 3/4 away from corner)it does whiff sometimes if your 22C doesn't land right next to them. Corner distance reliant I guess.

[MangoBlackTea]

btw kinkuli, in your concept video, you did a corner UW combo that was : 5b 5bb rekka 5a 5b 2c 6d 214d 5a ja jb jc dj.d . is this combo character specific ? i cant get 2c to hit on some characters. any help would be appreciated.

[Kinkuli]

I've noticed that as well. I've yet to test it out extensively but on top of my head you could try omiting 5A and doing just 5B 2C? If that won't work then 5A 5B 2C probably is char specific OR you need to have less hits on some chars. 

 

I noticed also that 5D 2B gustaf RC route doesn't work on Nu and lambda, maybe also Mu. HOWEVER if you omit 2B then the route works again. So it could be same case with 5A 5B 2C. 

[Synyster17]

i will say that 5b 2c 6d 214d 5a does combo. i think that might be the problem with some characters maybe?

[RentalBlackout]

It does seem to be character specific, works on Celica, doesn't work on Azrael for example.

 

You can instead do 5B>2C>6D but 214D won't hit them high enough to continue with 5A afterwards.

[MangoBlackTea]

Thanks, ill try that.

[Koopa_Klawz]

Got a chance to try Azrael at MI casuals yesterday. I say he's fine we'll just need to block more.

 

Sentinel Dump really is slower. I can't do OD > 2C > 6/3D > SD anymore. Also I think the hitbox on it got smaller because I try to make the opponent bounce higher with 2C > 6/3D > 5D but it still misses. Idk if SD's that slower or hitbox got smaller. I don't see anyone getting hit by wake up > SD anymore since they have a million years to react to it now.

 

3D (CH) > 6A > 3D doesn't work midscreen anymore. Anyone got any new go to combos for 3D punish?

 

How many Growlers can you do during Valiant Crash?

[zankoku]

Sentinel Dump is definitely slower; I used to be able to do a pseudo-loop (5C > 214C > 5C > 214C) off of pretty much any starter in a Valiant combo, even back throw, but that's no longer the case... Still seems to work from fatal 5C starter.

 

Current 3D punish combo I'm running is

 

(anywhere)

ch 3D > 2C > 3D > 6A > 66 > 5B > j.B > j.C > dj.2D - 4455 damage, LW

ch 3D > 2C > 3D > 6A > 66 > 5B/2B > TCL > BHS - 5793 damage (5747 with 5B pickup)

 

(carry to corner, works from half stage away)

ch 3D > 2C > 3D > 6A > 66 > 5B/2B > TCL > 5B > j.B > j.C > dj.D/2D - 5314 damage (5268 with 5B pickup), UW/LW

 

(UW)

ch 3D > 2C > 3D > 6A > 66 > 5B/2B > TC > Valiant combo - upwards of 6k damage (6013 on simple 5C 5C 5C 5C 214C 3C 5D route)

[Verimeloni]

Current 3D punish combo I'm running is

 

(anywhere) ch 3D > 2C > 3D > 6A > 66 > 5B > j.B > j.C > dj.2D - 4455 damage, LW

ch 3D > 2C > 3D > 6A > 66 > 5B/2B > TCL > BHS - 5793 damage (5747 with 5B pickup)

 

From what I inspected of Zekuso's combo vid you could probably go for IAD j,C Hornet dual weak point finisher after 6A. Also (near corner) the classic ch 3D > 5B > j.BC > j.2D > rekka stuff isn't out of the question, it carries nicely + especially when you can link 6A after Leopard wallstick or even go for 2D, 5A link / Growler RC stuff etc.

 

EDIT: just to clarify, how much does OD BHS do minimum damage? As for Az being able to link bhs > scud, I wish they would've given him a damage incentive to actually do so, like add let's say 500 extra min damage if the opponent has both the weakpoints when bhs hits (currently I think this is not the case).

[zankoku]

I'm really, really bad at the iad j.C 214D timing. I know that you can do the sideswap combo of

ch 3D > TC > Hornet > j.C > j.66 > j.C > 236D > 5B > j.B > j.C > dj.2D

for 4324 plus double weakpoint, for what it's worth.

 

OD BHS is 1480 damage minimum, compared to normal 1200 minimum. OD Scud is 393 damage minimum, I think.

[RentalBlackout]

So, looking at challenge 20(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXRUH5NRc3o), I wondered if it was practical in a real match. Turns out there are situations where it could work, with slight modifications.

 

Corner [32% HP] [100 meter] [LW] FC 5C>ODC 3D>CT 6D>236236D(sideswaps) 5A>TC>236D>6*5C>6*5C>6*6B>6*6B>6*6B>6*3C>6A>2D BHS 10145 DMG

 

It is character specific though, unfortunately it doesn't seem to work on everyone, 6D hits them too late or something. Could do it on Ragna, Jin, Azrael and the Murakumos(possibly a few others). Also nice to note that you can actually do this still with 62% hp, just that you won't have enough meter to BHS in the end. You could just 5D instead though, for about 9k damage.

 

If you wanna style it up, you could do 5A>TC>Hornet>j.C>Airdash>j.C>236D>... and end in 5D as well(omit the 3C>6A cause of hitstun decay) for about the same damage.

 

I was trying to see if you could ...5A>5B>hj, C>j.D>TK TC>214D>... but my execution got the better of me.

[Verimeloni]

I'm really, really bad at the iad j.C 214D timing. I know that you can do the sideswap combo of

ch 3D > TC > Hornet > j.C > j.66 > j.C > 236D > 5B > j.B > j.C > dj.2D

for 4324 plus double weakpoint, for what it's worth.

 

If I remember correctly that sideswap combo is screen position / character -dependent (if 1.1 rules apply)

[RentalBlackout]

If I remember correctly that sideswap combo is screen position / character -dependent (if 1.1 rules apply)

 

Yeah, you can't be right next to them when Hornet hits, has to be distanced somewhat. However, TC usually spaces them enough if I'm not mistaken.

[c50p]

So what's the optimal normal to do during valiant charger combos? I see some people use 6b, while others use 5c. Also, any tips on timing the hits after each dash? 

[Verimeloni]

So what's the optimal normal to do during valiant charger combos? I see some people use 6b, while others use 5c. Also, any tips on timing the hits after each dash? 

 

In Extend 6B, in older versions 5C. In CPE you can still easy-mode it with 5C but it'll result in less hits/damage. You can also play it safe by having the first hit after charger dash be 5C, I've seen some JP players drop the combo 'cause 6B doesn't reach the opponent after the first dash. In the corner 6B away.

 

The timing basically when the move hits, hit forward and then B. With 5Cs press forward, return the stick to neutral and then press C. It's something that you just have to train at first but later it'll come out naturally.

[RentalBlackout]

Found an almost corner to corner(training mode back against the wall start) carry version of CH 3D, ends with one weakpoint.

 

CH 3D>6A>dash 5B>hj.A>j.B>j.C>jc j.2D>TCL>22C>2C>6D/3D for 4528 damage, UW/LW, and corner to corner carry. Tested on Ragna.

 

On the CH 3D>TC>Hornet>... you can sneak in CH 3D>6A>dash 5B>TC>Hornet>... Nets you 4725 damage and two weakpoints. Doing this brings you away from the corner though, if you started with your back against the wall.

 

If you can however, CH 3D>slight delay 2C>slight delay 3D>6A>IAD j.C>Hornet>5A>j.A>j.C>jc j.2D>TCL(wallstick)>5D gives you the best damage and corner carry. 5467 damage. The slight delay is to prop them up higher, makes it easier to IAD j.C>Hornet, but I still find it hard to do consistently at times. It's harder to do in this situation since sometimes they are too low. If you find you hit them with IAD j.C but you know that Hornet will whiff, you could just end in 5B>hj. B>j.C>jc j.2D and take the 4700ish damage and weakpoint I guess. When you see that they're really low and j.C won't hit, just IAD j.B>5B instead. Overall a very tight combo.

 

The 6D variation is easier, though you do less damage(almost 5K I believe). You could just CH 6D>5C>TC>236D for the same damage though.

 

9 Growlers>6*3C>is possible in a VC combo, maybe a really fast and accurate person could do more, might vary depending on starter.

 

EDIT: All these combos have character specific troubles. CH 3D>6A doesn't work on Tager or Arakune(just like 1.1). Last hit of rekka whiffs on characters like Litchi and Mu, and if you delay it, 22C whiffs instead. On some other characters, after j.2D, walk forward>2B>TCL makes it more stable, on other characters it makes it more unstable(?). Might just be my execution though.

 

For the second combo, on some people like Bang aerial ender can whiff. You might have to change up aerial ender on some characters(high jump instead of jump, etc).  Better off going back to CH 3D>TC>Hornet instead, makes it more stable. 

 

Third combo delay timings are specific for different characters. Seems to be able to work on everyone though, except Rachel, I can't seem to find any timing that works. On Litchi/Kokonoe ...Hornet>5A>j.A j.A j.C>jc j.2D>...makes it more stable. You might have to delay last rekka a little, sometimes this makes wallsplat lower and you have to default to 2D instead of 5D. Other times you end up too far away to 2D, but in these cases you usually can 5D. You could also start rekka a bit later after j.2D, makes it easier to 2D at the end.