Shinsua Posted July 13, 2009 Posted July 13, 2009 This thread will be dedicated to discussion on how to deal with that damned clone! How dare she stuff us in a sack and shoot us! All we were trying to do was eat her! ((And perhaps some other. . .Japanese Ooze Monster stuff)) Now then! Let us discuss!
Shinsua Posted July 13, 2009 Author Posted July 13, 2009 I need. . .much more assistance on this. . . I cant fight Noel for the life of me. . .and it seems more and more people are picking her up. . . Can someone tell me what exactly happens during her drives? Its as if I cant hit her during the initial start up and I just cry when I perform a successful lick and it turns out nothing happened
skunkfart Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 I need. . .much more assistance on this. . . I cant fight Noel for the life of me. . .and it seems more and more people are picking her up. . . Can someone tell me what exactly happens during her drives? Its as if I cant hit her during the initial start up and I just cry when I perform a successful lick and it turns out nothing happened Okay. After getting hosed by what seemed like nothing more than a button-mashing Noel, I spent a lot of time analyzing her drive. I also was experiencing all my attacks being negated by he standing D, and, moreover, if I try to defend against this blue-hued onslaught I find myself eating an astounding high-low mixup. Her drive is initiated by any of her D attacks. After that, she can press any button + direction to initiate a follow-up attack for up to 5 attacks ( I think). She cannot do the same exact attack twice in a row. Whenever she ends the chain she will pause for a moment and unload some shells, which is when I presume you can punish her. High-Low: If you are going to defend against a drive combo you need to reverse standard procedure and block high. The only drive-mode attack that sweeps is, iirc, forward+d. She can initiate the chain with this low attack or an overhead, so you need to be ready to react to the way she starts it up. After that, block high and watch for forward+c. The way I recognize this ability is that she dashes in with her head furthest in front of her before quickly dropping on the ground and kicking you. As soon as that dash starts, I go low. Common consensus: seems to be that you DO NOT want to block her drive chains. Apparently, if you block a drive attack, you should be able to hit her if she attempts another. Also, this would lead one to believe that "good" Noels won't chain drives if you block it.
Shinsua Posted July 16, 2009 Author Posted July 16, 2009 Theres a slight problem with blocking low though It may have been the Noel I fought was just rather astounding, or I just have terrible reflexes, but it seemed when I blocked the low attack, she'd punish that with the summersault kick I dunno if maybe I was just being cocky and thought it was a good time to attack er what, but it seemed to always hit me from that stand point. . . Ah well. . . Ill need to do some research myself. . . Thank you
Magnet Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 yeah....noels drive has WAYYY more invincibility then it should. just keep the hell away from her until she's cursed. yeah, you have your J-DC B pressure as a method of getting in, but it hurts really freaking bad when you get hit, and it might not be worth the risk. also, In my experience just block the drives as best you can and wait for an opening to escape via warp, as trying to poke out with 2A or 5A->6B can lead to unhealthy consequences. it may not be what you want to hear, but im really iffy on the idea of trying to poke through the drive, i find it better to just use my barrier guard to push her out if possible to get away.. your 2D grub shot, if spaced right, can hit her if she tries to drive from too far away. if it does, you've now cursed her. (clouds also work, though they wont hit her out of her drive.) its once shes cursed i myself will keep FAR away, throw out more crap like clouds and bellbugs, and try to poke her to death with your ranged options. if you do this, I would watch out for her slide move (which i believe can go under clouds) and her ranged shots, which can effectively end your curse if it hits. if you do this keepaway strategy, the basic idea is to wear her down until she's KOed or she gets impatient and tries to rush you if she sees an opening. in this case, just run away (preferably via warping on the ground, id advise against jumping to escape unless your near a wall.) In this matchup you may be able to control the space well, but Noel can get in pretty quick and those drive moves can really force you to block. DO NOT assume that because there is a cloud or bellbug on her when she starts her drive that it will hit her. One last note: in my experience its wiser to run if she tries to jump in from a long distance at you. she has an annoying drive move that can beat out your 5C from the air above you. I guess the Bottom line for this matchup is: be patient and wait for your opportunity. you can rush her down, but why risk it when you can wear her down from far away as long as your careful? well...that's my two cents on Noel. hope it helped, and im also looking for advice regarding this matchup in case I'm doing anything wrong.
Shinsua Posted July 16, 2009 Author Posted July 16, 2009 *Sigh* I guess Noel will be one of the others that Im forced to curse. . . What a bummer. . .
Magnet Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 Yeah....look at the bright side though, once shes cursed, you pretty much control the momentum. if the noels smart, they're going to have to wait it out and try to find a way to get to you, if not, they're going to jump into clouds and bellbugs without guarding, reset your curse meter, and give you plenty of time to run away and start the whole process over again. granted, I'm generalizing, but you get the idea. you may have killer oki stuff with Arakune and his bugs, clouds and such, but noels got an awkwardly powerful reversal, so that is in part why i stress running away so much: even if shes knocked down on the ground, if she techs and does her Greed-saberesque move, you'll get comboed and lose the momentum, and possibly take more damage then you might have otherwise done by rushing her down.
Shinsua Posted July 16, 2009 Author Posted July 16, 2009 Greed-Saberesque? And thats actually what I normally do to Noel ^^; Rush down But. . .I dont. . .use. . .bugs. . .*cough* My original only was Tager Im iffy about Hakumen (only as lure) And now, Id have to go ahead and say Noel is on my Bug Hit List
Magnet Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 oh...my bad. "Greed-Saberesque" means its like Ky Kiske's Greed saber from Guilty Gear. the move Im referring to is the "jumping" drive overhead she does. it seems to go through a lot of ara's stuff, though i still need to experiment with Arakune's 2B, which I've started hearing is pretty good things about. Also, i recommend that you start trying to use bugs in mixups and stuff more. learning to curse with arakune is a major part of his game, and is essential in his less friendly matchups. on a random note, if you want any random basic advice to bug use, id be more then happy to try to write something up in a PM or in a thread.
Shinsua Posted July 16, 2009 Author Posted July 16, 2009 Oh no Im fun with Bugs for the most part But thank you Alittle clarification on how to accurately fire an A & B bug would be nice though ' '; But then again, the accuracy Im talking about, is more along the lines of sniping with bugs ^^; To be perfectly honest, I just find bugs to be an unneeded hassle >.< And ya, sorry I didnt know that I know the move, but I just hate Ky Kiske so I never bothered to learn any of the names of his moves xD
thegame4ever Posted July 18, 2009 Posted July 18, 2009 IB Greed-Sever move allows you to perform 5B(1 Hit)>5D>standard 6C loop combo.
Schank Posted July 18, 2009 Posted July 18, 2009 IB Greed-Sever move allows you to perform 5B(1 Hit)>5D>standard 6C loop combo. True that. Whenever I see that overhead, I instantblock the shit out of it... Same thing I do to Ky. It's really easy especially when you're blocking low and blocking highs only on reaction. With 19 frames of startup on it, it's a good thing to practice IBing (easy).
Magnet Posted July 19, 2009 Posted July 19, 2009 yeah, my difficulty lies in the fact that im not very good at doing 6C loops...for some odd reason, i havent found a reliable way into it. PM me any advice on that if you have it. anyhow, back on topic, I need to try 2B against that greed sever move at some point, as im seeing from some of my matches that it seems to be a good anti-air. heck, ive had it beating out ice cars recently as well. im also finding in this matchup that 5A > 6B isn't as useful as in some other matchups. her drives go through A LOT of stuff.
dragontamer Posted September 1, 2009 Posted September 1, 2009 IB Greed-Sever move allows you to perform 5B(1 Hit)>5D>standard 6C loop combo. Careful. I personally place a frame-trap there (all too often actually >_<. Its kind-of a bad habit, I need to stop doing it). Assuming you instant-block the 2D, you'll be at either +34 frames (if Noel stops to reload), or +7 frames (if Noel plans to continue the combo). If Noel continues the Chain Revolver into 28D (Flash Kick), her startup-invincibility will beat out your 5B and Arakune will eat a standard Noel 6C BC loop :-p. Well, you'll learn quick if the opponent Noel is good enough to do that / has a bad habit of 28Ding everything. In that case, just block the 28D and then punish. Watch for rapid cancel of course.
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