Any advice on AC+R's combo system?

[Mr.Ownage]

Hello guys! This is my first time and topic here!

I started playing GGXX AC+R not long ago when I saw videos of it. I was like : omg, these kind of combos and moves are possible? And the characters, wow! I guess I'll get in and have some fun too!

However, I found out it's not that easy at all. I can't really do any non - black BEAT combos which actually maintain variety (like RC-ing combos into fancy things and not SW / D looping or Vapor Thrust looping over and over again).

So, this is why I am posting here. I hope you guys around here could answer my questions about the combo system,and maybe help us all finding variety!

1. Why do I get a black BEAT when I (for example 2H with Millia) launch the opponent and wait a bit for him to fall for other options?

2 : Why does my BEAT turn into black after (for example 2-3 reps of SW) loop into an S or HS  normal?

3: Is there any universal (all chars) way to attack the opponent in a way that I can reach the ground first for a relaunch or just continuing?

4: Is there any way to hit the opponent with S or HS then instant air dash into a combo again? If so, which characters can do so?

5: Are RC-s any useful in regards to combos? (I can only do VV RC at the top then S into Bandit for Sol for example that is good for something)

Any advice is greatly appriciated! (Sorry for misspells)

[Sergeant Dull]

1+2: Black beat is a combo that shouldn't be. That is to say, it was possible to tech out of it.

3: No(t that I know of?)

4: Check the dustloop wiki and player footage for viable options.

5: RCs are the unique mechanic of Guilty Gear, and are absolutely useful, or necessary to use. Again check player footage or the AC+R threads for character specific combos.

 

TLDR: Check out videos, the wiki, and also the AC+R sub-forum.

[ViolaSorel]

1. This usually means you reacted to slow in your combos or missed the timing and your opponent failed to tech out of it.

4. IIRC this isn't possible on the ground and IAD is usually used to cross-up/ mix-up the opponent however, some characters can IAD in air combos to continue combos but I forgot which ones.

5. RCs are useful in combos in the way you stated, but I usually see them as a way for people to save themselves or as a form of mix-up, but the more common way is for them to use FRCs to put the opponent in a stun-lock state or create hard to react situations. For example, sol using his gunflame and FRCing it to create pressure while sol finds a way to break your defense.

[Mr.Ownage]

Thanks guys for the advice but your replies mainly explain the what-s and not the How?-s of the mechanics. It may be my bad, but I forgot to mention that I'm not that much of a beginner( I understand BB (BB= Black Beat here) is invalid combo) but not HOW exactly they happen (Why loops can't have more than 2-3 reps? Why can't I do Millia's j.K into j.D? How is untechable time calcualted / does it have a formula?)

For me, the joy IS in doing combos, but it isn't really unique when everyone else does them online isn't it? I'm mainly asking for technical data / explaination and headers here. Don't get me wrong, the advices were good and useful, but some (like the BB) isn't new to me.

For instance, a Sol combo I've never seen anywhere else online : (optional cr.K), c.S,f.S,5H, (HS)Fafnir, RC, run, Wild Throw into SW loop. (Please rate it )

TLDR: Good pieces of advice but they don't explain WHAT makes combos valid/invalid and what makes them drop and technical data (like can RC-s reset jump options?) Also, am I right in some chars (like Ky's j.S DJC dj.S, dj.HS VT) having only one fixed air combo "finisher"? My key point here was "maintaining variety"

[silverhydra]

Thanks guys for the advice but your replies mainly explain the what-s and not the How?-s of the mechanics. It may be my bad, but I forgot to mention that I'm not that much of a beginner( I understand BB (BB= Black Beat here) is invalid combo) but not HOW exactly they happen (Why loops can't have more than 2-3 reps? Why can't I do Millia's j.K into j.D? How is untechable time calcualted / does it have a formula?)

For me, the joy IS in doing combos, but it isn't really unique when everyone else does them online isn't it? I'm mainly asking for technical data / explaination and headers here. Don't get me wrong, the advices were good and useful, but some (like the BB) isn't new to me.

For instance, a Sol combo I've never seen anywhere else online : (optional cr.K), c.S,f.S,5H, (HS)Fafnir, RC, run, Wild Throw into SW loop. (Please rate it )

TLDR: Good pieces of advice but they don't explain WHAT makes combos valid/invalid and what makes them drop and technical data (like can RC-s reset jump options?) Also, am I right in some chars (like Ky's j.S DJC dj.S, dj.HS VT) having only one fixed air combo "finisher"? My key point here was "maintaining variety"

This section of the wiki covers the mechanics you're asking about.

http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=GGACR/Damage#Hitstun.2FUntechable_Time_Scaling_and_Gravity

Edited September 29, 2015 by silverhydra

[Mr.Ownage]

This section of the wiki covers the mechanics you're asking about.

http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=GGACR/Damage#Hitstun.2FUntechable_Time_Scaling_and_Gravity

Oh. Thanks for the link, it seems useful, but... it still doesn't cover how MUCH untech time I get from attacks. So me dropping SW loops was the reverse scaling (more hits = less time for something else) increasing! Now if there was a spreadsheet or something about moves untech time (espicially Millia, Sol, Ky, Testament and Dizzy, i main them) that would be great!

[Final Ultima]

Every attack in Guilty Gear is allocated an Attack Level, which determines the attack's hitstop, blockstun and hitstun across various different circumstances. The link provided will give you all the basic details. The Attack Level of individual attacks can be found in their respective character's frame data page.

Please note that there are exceptions to the values listed. Many attacks have a hitstop or hitstun/untechable time value greater than their Attack Level would indicate. In these cases, please consult the notes provided for that move in the frame data. In Accent Core and Accent Core Plus R specifically, there are some Level 5 attacks that have more blockstun than their indicated value. These moves have a distinct audio cue when blocked, a large clanking sound.

It's worth noting that Guilty Gear Xrd currently does not details for these exceptions listed in the frame data, so if you choose to play it in the future, you may wish to do some experimentation of your own.

As for what causes combo sequences that were previously working to fail, Guilty Gear has numerous systems in place to prevent infinite combos. Gravity increases as the number of hits in the combo increases (be sure to check the link silverhydra provided for individual character weight values), and pushback and untechable time decay increase as time spent in hitstun increases, capping at 16 seconds. Untechable time decay functions similarly to hitstun decay in other games, except that it applies only to attacks that can be teched, in other words, only on an airborne opponent. Attacks with non-standard untechable time are also affected.

Combo Length	Untechable Time Modifier
0 seconds~	100%
3 seconds~	95%
5 seconds~	90%
7 seconds~	80%
10 seconds~	70%
14 seconds~	60%

In regards to the combo route you listed earlier: As you're new to the game, you're still in the early stages of experimenting with the combo system, and that's great. Getting familiar with how the system works is important. That being said, allow me to expand on the weaknesses of the combo route.

Firstly, Fafnir has 70% forced proration, which greatly limits your damage potential from that point on. At the distance implied by your route, comboing into 2D > Bandit Revolver (1) (RC) and then performing a Sidewinder loop would be far preferable. Sol functions much better at close-range, both in neutral and in combos. As such, it is typically only recommended to use Fafnir as a combo part at distances where you are unable to combo otherwise, such as off a raw f.S > 5HS. Secondly, Bukkirabou ni Nageru (Wild Throw) has a fairly long animation, which means that it advances untechable time decay noticably for next to no payoff. If you connect with Fafnir and still wish to spend the 50% Tension on extending your combo in spite of the forced proration, I recommend that you either perform a dash 5HS/2HS into a Clean Hit Grand Viper (assuming that the opponent is unable to Burst out of it), or perform a dash 6P, provided that you're sufficiently close to the corner to get the wall bounce and convert off it.

As for your question regarding Roman Cancels resetting jump options: No, they do not. Furthermore, most grounded moves that render you airborne use up air options in the process. There are, however, several moves of this variety that have a property referred to as auto-Jump Install, which restores one of your air options. If you want to know more about Jump Install, there is an explanation provided here.

[Mr.Ownage]

Ahaa! These links and mini-spreadsheet pretty much explains them all! This seems really helpful, will try to experiment with them for a while! Thanks a lot Final Ultima, your answer is the kind of technical data I was looking for!

The sheet is interesting though: I thought it was the hits that mattered, and not the time of the combo. Oh well, really helpful information either way!

This has pretty much answered my questions (I now know the untech time for all moves). Now my remaining two questions are :

Can I close this thread? It's pretty much answered.

And are there any timing-assisting tools or something similiar? It's pretty hard keep track exactly how much time I can spend before going onto the next attack.

Can Grand Viper do more damage? That's great, but I have trouble clean-hitting it.

Edited September 30, 2015 by Mr.Ownage