[CF] Es Gameplay Discussion Thread aka Pudding Lovers Anonymous

[Tokkan]

1 hour ago, RurouniLoneWolf said:

0:51 Palamedes Distortion? Wasn't expecting her to rush forward like that. https://youtu.be/U5Mx31N8OEU?t=50

Nope. I can make out some of Es's battle dialogue and it sounds like she's saying "Type:Slasher 'Ga-something'" here. "Ga-something" because I can't quite hear the knight name clear enough other than that it seemingly starts with "Ga". Sounded like it could be either "Gawain" or "Gareth". Don't quote me as if what I'm saying is gospel though; I'm only 100% certain of the "Type:Slasher" part, not of the knight name part.

1 hour ago, RurouniLoneWolf said:

- Looks like her theme is one of the XBlaze tracks. But they could've just used it for the trailer only

According to Famitsu and 4Gamer, the track playing during the gameplay is actually a new track by XBlaze composer Kikuo.

[RurouniLoneWolf]

12 minutes ago, Tokkan said:

Nope. I can make out some of Es's battle dialogue and it sounds like she's saying "Type:Slasher 'Ga-something'" here. "Ga-something" because I can't quite hear the knight name clear enough other than that it seemingly starts with "Ga". Sounded like it could be either "Gawain" or "Gareth". Don't quote me as if what I'm saying is gospel though; I'm only 100% certain of the "Type:Slasher" part, not of the knight name part.

According to Famitsu and 4Gamer, the track playing during the gameplay is actually a new track by XBlaze composer Kikuo.

Thanks for the added info Tokkan. Interesting. So, she seems to have a third distortion. I'm surprised the theme is a new track as well. I thought it was the same as one of the XBlaze tracks but it might've just bene the general tone that's similar. I'll have to give it a better listen later.

[oh no, he said]

I'm not convinced that that spike is the enhanced version of Griflet. There's also another crest that seems to emerge from the edge of Griflet's hitbox that doesn't seem to appear when she uses it on naoto earlier in the trailer (though it's a little hard to be sure since it cuts away not long after she uses it) and it strikes me a bit superfluous to add in that extra hit if the REAL enhancement was the downward strike. Would it no be simpler to just amp up the hitstun so the spike just naturally links? Hard to say, but as of right now I'm unconvinced. 

Also we can see towards the end of the trailer she has a little dashing pommel strike move that causes Celica to wallsplat/bounce. Pretty funny coming from a move that looks more like a poke. Would wager that's her 6A. (also you can see the activation hitbox for that  full circle version of her drive that she uses in this combo at 0:55 in the left corner of the screen)

[Monarch]

Something that really caught my eye was Es doing air fireball > activate crest >  IAD > j.C, not to mention she was able to OTG Ragna afterwards after her air stomps with 5C. She seems to be very juggle focused going off of the PV, and given what we've seen above she has plenty of ways to do it: being able to combo off of a fireball meterless is a pretty strong ability.

[Tokkan]

17 hours ago, oh no, he said said:

I'm not convinced that that spike is the enhanced version of Griflet.

Es's sprite animation for it appears to continue on from Griflet's sprite animation. It matches the description of enhanced Griflet's auto-followup happening as she is falling. 4Gamer's article speaks of enhanced Griflet's added crest hit and auto-followup as if they are separate (they put it as 紋章発生＆自動追撃).

[xLittleLucifer]

Does Es have a DP? cause I honestly do not think it's "Griflet" cause in the trailer Es only did Griflet after this move Here & Here [Which as you can see it can also be done in the air which discards the probability of it being a Normal] so maybe she doesn't have an actual meterless reversal or it could simply just work in a similar way to how Bullets meterless Dp works, How it has one intial hit and then if it hits an auto combo follows up.

[xLittleLucifer]

So Here are all of the normals that I could see in the trailer, I've put what I think the input might be for said Normal. Also I would like to add that The drive Normals [D] can be charged & The charge version have special properties once it hits like ex. Ground bounce or Launch, Also the "Crest" that get left behind will depend on what Drive Normal [2/4/5/6/J.] + D was used which means that all of them are Unique And have separate uses besides being used for combos (By Separate uses I'm talking about Neutral / Screen control, Oki or Combo), Also I think that once the "Crest is out you can simply decide to activate it by pressing [D] again or just let it sit there for when ever you want to use it, but that is my assumption, No actual information saying that's how it is.

- 5B

- 5C

- 2C



- 3C

- 6C [?]

- J.A [?]



- J.B

 

- J.C

 

- 5D [?]



- 4D [?] (If "6D[?]" turns out to be a special move then this Drive Normals input might actually just be 6D instead)



- 6D [?] (This could actually be a special move, Thanks to Tokkan for mentioning it)



- 2D [?]



- J.D



- J.2Dx3[?]

 

[Tokkan]

21 minutes ago, xLittleLucifer said:

Does Es have a DP? cause I honestly do not think it's "Griflet" cause in the trailer Es only did Griflet after this move Here & Here [Which as you can see it can also be done in the air which discards the probability of it being a Normal] so maybe she doesn't have an actual meterless reversal or it could simply just work in a similar way to how Bullets meterless Dp works, How it has one intial hit and then if it hits an auto combo follows up.

That move is not separate from Griflet, it's the first hit of Griflet; the animation from it links seamlessly into the uppercut portion. It also couldn't be a normal anyway because it produces the "cross-shaped sparks, blue shockwaves" hitspark that's unique to specials/supers (Nine's spells also produce the same hitspark, BTW).

[xLittleLucifer]

4 minutes ago, Tokkan said:

That move is not separate from Griflet, it's the first hit of Griflet; the animation from it links seamlessly into the uppercut portion. It also couldn't be a normal anyway because it produces the "cross-shaped sparks, blue shockwaves" hitspark that's unique to specials/supers (Nine's spells also produce the same hitspark, BTW).

Yeah I know that the 1st move is not separate from griflet like when I saw the trailer I knew that that move was part of Griflet, that's exactly why I was asking if she had a Dp, cause I really doubt that the first hit has inv.

[Tokkan]

15 minutes ago, xLittleLucifer said:

Yeah I know that the 1st move is not separate from griflet that's exactly why I was asking if she had a dp, cause I really doubt that the first hit has inv.

Battle planner's comment in Famitsu says she her specials include "a projectile, invincible move and rushing move". We were shown a projectile (Breunor) and a rushing move (Mordred). Trailers have shown she has a second rushing special move where she jumps forward and does a hexagonal slash and it has two versions (one where she does the hexaslash as she lands and the other where she does it while still midair). So that leaves Griflet to be the "invincible move." Griflet was also shown in Famitsu, making it seem like the obvious choice.

Counting her command grab, hexaslash, Bors, Griflet, Mordred and Breunor, she would have 6 specials. I don't think she would have more, that seems counter intuitive to her apparent "beginner-friendly" intent as it adds more complexity to her moveset. And that's on top of the fact she apparently has 3 supers, one of which has 4 versions.

[xLittleLucifer]

Hm, I really hope she does have a DP Lol Cause I really do not want to have to handle Valks, Izayoi or Izanami's pressure with only my blocking cause that's going to be exhausting as hell.

[xLittleLucifer]

1 hour ago, Tokkan said:

Trailers have shown she has a second rushing special move where she jumps forward and does a hexagonal slash and it has two versions (one where she does the hexaslash as she lands and the other where she does it while still midair). So that leaves Griflet to be the "invincible move." Griflet was also shown in Famitsu, making it seem like the obvious choice.

Counting her command grab, hexaslash, Bors, Griflet, Mordred and Breunor, she would have 6 specials. I don't think she would have more, that seems counter intuitive to her apparent "beginner-friendly" intent as it adds more complexity to her moveset. And that's on top of the fact she apparently has 3 supers, one of which has 4 versions.

- I thought the move that you're calling "Hexaslash" was simply just a Drive normal, Has it been confirm that that move is an actual special move?, cause I put it as 6D[?] in the recent post thinking that It was just a simple Drive normal since it seem like it ... But now that you mention it you might be right cause the "Crest" design is way to heavy for it to simply just be a Drive Normal & In the trailer it does not seem like she charges neither of the versions (Mid-Air vesion & Land version) ... which would also explain why a crest didn't get left behind after doing it like a drive normal would.

- 3 Supers? Hm, So far I've seen the Install one "Percival" & The multi-option one "Palamades", What would her 3rd one be (if you have any info on it).

- There's been No release info. of the inputs for the Special moves yet right?

[Tokkan]

15 minutes ago, xLittleLucifer said:

- I though the move that you're calling "Hexaslash" was simply just a Drive normal, Has it been confirm that that move is an actual special move?, cause I put it as 6D[?] in the recent post thinking that It was just a simple Drive normal since it seem like it ... But now that you mention it you might be right cause the "Crest" design is way to heavy for it to simply just be a Drive Normal & In the trailer it does not seem like she charges neither of the versions (Mid-Air vesion & Land version) ... which would also explain why a crest didn't get left behind aftert doing it

- 3 Supers? Hm, So far I've seen the Install one "Percival" & The multi-option one "Palamades", What would her 3rd one be (if you have any info on it).

- There's been No release info. of the inputs for the Special moves yet right?

-It has the hitspark unique to specials/supers (and Nine's spells) that I mentioned before, it MUST be a special.

-Palamedes is only seen once in the trailer, as is Percival. There is a 3rd super seen twice.

-No, but there probably will be on the 24th.

[xLittleLucifer]

Wait ok, Palamedes is the shooter one right? I thought that the one where she stabs & goes through you :  
was simply just what happens if you pressed a different button while doing Palamedes since it said that "the moves properties are affected by whether Es is airborne or in the ground and which button was pressed to launch the attack" D: I am so confused now, I'm just gonna have to wait for more info lol! It's to early right now.

[Tokkan]

4 minutes ago, xLittleLucifer said:

I thought that the one where she stabs & goes through you was simply just what happens if you pressed a different button while doing Palamedes since it said that the moves properties are affected by whether Es is airborne or in the ground and which button was pressed to launch the attack D

I see, you misinterpreted what that meant. That just means you can perform with a different button. Let's say it's input 236236, and it has both an A version (236236A) and a B version (236236B). And when done in the air, they are also different. I honestly interpreted that to mean it probably has anti-ground and anti-air versions, which become air-to-ground and air-to-air while midair. 4Gamer's article makes it clearer that it's different based on A, B and air versions, and not activate and then press another button like you thought it was. Even counting that, the rushing slash move and Palamedes have completely different startup animations so they can't really be as you were thinking.

[xLittleLucifer]

4 minutes ago, Tokkan said:

I see, you misinterpreted what that meant. That just means you can perform with a different button. Let's say it's input 236236, and it has both an A version (236236A) and a B version (236236B). And when done in the air, they are also different. I honestly interpreted that to mean it probably has anti-ground and anti-air versions, which become air-to-ground and air-to-air while midair. 4Gamer's article makes it clearer that it's different based on A, B and air versions, and not activate and then press another button like you thought it was. Even counting that, the rushing slash move and Palamedes have completely different startup animations so they can't really be as you were thinking.

Oh, kk now it all makes sense lol

[WhiteWolfMomiji]

I didn't know that specials have their own blue shockwave effect until Tokkan mentioned it, so rewatched Es trailer again and noticed something. Her move that puts her airborne, where it was speculated as 2D earlier by xLittleLucifer, also makes the blue shockwave effect. That's the only move I noticed that also makes the "Crest" while being a special.

[Tokkan]

1 hour ago, WhiteWolfMomiji said:

I didn't know that specials have their own blue shockwave effect until Tokkan mentioned it, so rewatched Es trailer again and noticed something. Her move that puts her airborne, where it was speculated as 2D earlier by xLittleLucifer, also makes the blue shockwave effect. That's the only move I noticed that also makes the "Crest" while being a special.

That move has white shockwaves, not blue. That move also lacks the cross-sparks explosion effect. White and red shockwaves can appear as part of regular hitsparks, and specials can have them in addition to their specific blue shockwaves. There are also orange, octagonal shockwaves that are specific to Taokaka. A successful block also produces a purple octagonal shockwave that represents a stop sign.

Edited July 13, 2016 by Tokkan

[WhiteWolfMomiji]

11 hours ago, Tokkan said:

That move has white shockwaves, not blue. That move also lacks the cross-sparks explosion effect. White and red shockwaves can appear as part of regular hitsparks, and specials can have them in addition to their specific blue shockwaves. There are also orange, octagonal shockwaves that are specific to Taokaka. A successful block also produces a purple octagonal shockwave that represents a stop sign.

ah, Ok. Thanks for the explanation. Makes sense now. so its not a special, and is in fact a D normal.

[xLittleLucifer]

Yeah, plus you can see the 2D leaving a "Crest" behind as she is put airborne, which is then used (right after Breunor) to buy her enough time to allow her to recover from that special move (Breunor) and Keep following up the combo Example - Here

[Monarch]

July 24th Youtube Stream

[xLittleLucifer]

A preview of "Es" in action on the CF site

Things to point out :
- Last hit of "Mordred" has decent un-tech time after hitting a airborne opponents which can be used as a combo ender for a knockdown after 3C, The opponent will spins if he get's hit by the last hit of "Mordred" while he's 'In' the ground (Now If it's buff it will still launch)
- "Bors" has a pretty quick activation and recovey, I'm guessing around 20~22F frame total or maybe less
- The Heavy version of "Hexaslash" does Not force a ground bounce if the opponent is hit while in the ground, It will force a ground bounce if the opponent get's hit while in mid-air
- You can catch a small glimps of her Air-dash @0:06 It looks similar to UNiELs system Air-dash. Also her 2B, It hits low.

[Tokkan]

4 hours ago, xLittleLucifer said:

- The Heavy version of "Hexaslash"

The move is called "Gawain" it seems, I can clearly hear the voice line now. Only question is, what type? Probably Type:Slasher but we'll see.

And the Issen super is called "Type:Slasher 'Galahad'".

[RurouniLoneWolf]

So Gawain for the Hexaslash special and Galahad for the super. Nice. I like these names. I especially like Galahad.

Yeah, it seems like 3C > Mordred is going to be the main ground combo ender without Bors buff. Hard to ballpark the actual frames for Bors total recovery but I'd say it does feel decently fast, though a bit closer to 24-26 frames than 20-22. Now that I've seen Es is air dash from a neutral situation, I can understand what ASW meant by the arc trajectory. It's not really like a UNIEL air dash because UNIEL air dashes usually make you arc upward as well. The best way to describe Es is air dash is that it's similar to a regular air dash in the first half of its animation but in the second half of the animation, it starts to arc downward, making it great for jump ins like ASW mentioned in earlier Famitsu articles.  

Also, in this gameplay trailer we got to see 2D? being charged this time. So at the very least both 5D and 2D can be charged. This is pretty interesting. I wonder if it's just there to further improve her frame trap game along with her Crest Arts or if the charged versions of her drive normals have buffs like an increase in their attack level or increasing the damage of the crest art or buffing the Crest Arts in some other matter. Pretty interesting.

[9:02 PM]

Her moves look cool, but jesus that overhead is MAD slow. I hope it's plus or gives her a mixup off the crest follow-up or something.