FlyingVe Posted January 12, 2011 Posted January 12, 2011 ON the brightside, now that the japanese have Mu we'll have some quality offline vids to analyze. James vs Koogy was funny, but I don't think there's much to be gained there...
TD Posted January 13, 2011 Posted January 13, 2011 l dont need just simple help anymore, as i'm sure most of us dont. l want to know how to not get blown up offline. l need some detailed answers on how to fight each character - WHEN to do this, WHY this works, WHERE to do it - i'm past the HOW stages. l only know how to fight hazama and that's just barely. every other match i'm just 'doing this and hoping it works'. lt's frustrating not knowing anything.
SolarMisae Posted January 13, 2011 Posted January 13, 2011 Detailed guides on taking on each character would be pretty awesome...however right now wouldn't really be the best time to do that, considering CS2 is just around the corner and they'd all have to be tweaked to the changes wouldn't they? Either way when CS2 does come about, guides like that would be very helpful for those like me that don't get a chance to do offline often enough to learn that way.
Aginor Posted January 13, 2011 Posted January 13, 2011 tbh, pretty much everyone in america is just waiting for cs2 now. With the offline scene as it is now, it's hard to get offline match up experience with EVERY character unless everybody in your scene can play multiple characters. I don't think it's very big right now. Though, I think this will be easier to come across once cs2 comes out since it's coming out for consoles here and there is no arcade advantage. What experienced offline match up info do you need? As for suggested strats, they either 1. don't work straight up or 2. work at first then stop working. If it's the latter, then you have to change up your strat (adaptation). And well...depending on the match up, you have to play mu differently. Some are similar and some are very different depending on what characters you need info. on.
TD Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 is there any frame data on mu (and possibly the rest of the new characters) that list her startup/active/recovery frames rather than just frame advantage? l think that's all i'm going to really need at this point. l'll work on the rest.
FlyingVe Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 There should be a mook or something soon. Of course then we'll need to wait for translations.
Aginor Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 There will probably be a mook for CS2 but probably no more for CS1 since it did come out almost a year ago...
C0R Posted January 16, 2011 Posted January 16, 2011 I had an extended conversation with Spark recently about when to could expect Mu's frame data, and he ended up teaching me the entire process and giving me to calculation tables. Problem is, there's no control (yet) for testing the frame data, because every character underwent subtle design changes. I'm probably going to work with him to confirm/build on any existing frame data when the game is released in america. Also known as buying him dinner so he does Mu's second after Hakumen's
TD Posted January 18, 2011 Posted January 18, 2011 I've taken the liberty yesterday of compiling a very short summary of each of mu's more "common" matchups using LK's format (which I personally think is THE most gdlk way to assess a match). I'd like to think that for the most part my thoughts were pretty accurate, but then I got to thinking. At first I was just going to do the shit and keep it to myself, but then I realized this is obviously something that should be done as a team effort. In short I propose we revamp the mu match threads so that we can incorporate LK's format which will not only make it organized but more efficient. And for those who want to help, we could all work on filling each section, and proposing ideas that are/should be tested.... It beats being dead all day lol.
Silfer Posted January 18, 2011 Posted January 18, 2011 I dont mind helping with what I can, dont know if I will be usefull (netplayer and all) but I'm all for it.
TD Posted January 18, 2011 Posted January 18, 2011 thanks. well, i'll get a small summary of mu vs ragna later. l ask though, that those who started threads in the matchup board to edit the first post soon so we can start putting info up there. also, my computer is broken indefinitely... l have to use my phone to type the summary which means no line breaks.
FlyingVe Posted January 18, 2011 Posted January 18, 2011 (edited) I've only started the Mu vs Valk, but we should probably wait for Aginor and his mod-magic. If you would, I would like to see what you have. Would you be willing to PM me? Edit: I have a computer so I will add those line breaks Also, I have a fair bit of experience Mu vs Ragna, and I play both characters, so I might be able to help out there. Edited January 18, 2011 by FlyingVe
TD Posted January 18, 2011 Posted January 18, 2011 alright. l'll get to typing it up when l get home.
FlyingVe Posted January 18, 2011 Posted January 18, 2011 If you need help with anything let me know, I'll do what I can.
Aginor Posted January 18, 2011 Posted January 18, 2011 I've only started the Mu vs Valk, but we should probably wait for Aginor and his mod-magic. If you would, I would like to see what you have. Would you be willing to PM me? Edit: I have a computer so I will add those line breaks Also, I have a fair bit of experience Mu vs Ragna, and I play both characters, so I might be able to help out there. What do you need me to do? Edit the first post of threads?
FlyingVe Posted January 18, 2011 Posted January 18, 2011 I think the plan is to circulate/edit Tempest's matchup thing then update the first posts (or start over) in the threads to make them better. The idea is to use LK's format. You're the mod of course, so you know best...
FlyingVe Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 Got it, looks good. Sent back some thoughts.
C0R Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 (edited) !!!! Taking what Spark taught me about frame data I was able to do some testing with d cancels after her c series, meaning we have more frame data. Was never confirmed before, but she has a 4 frame jump startup just like the most of the cast. ON NORMAL BLOCK Ch state ends on the frame after the first number, and Mu can chicken block on the frame after the second number 5d: -4/-8 2d: -6/-10 4d: -6/-10 6d: -6/-10 5c>5d>7AB is -(=/<)4, throw immune on frame 5, air blocking on frame 9 5c>2d>7AB is -6, throw immune on frame 7, air blocking on frame 11 5c>4d>7AB is -6, identical to 2d 6d identical to 2d I'm not sure if 5d is completely accurate, I'm only so good at parse-frame imputs, but I did run it a good number of tests. Bascially, if all that info is completely correct, you can cut a frame off the recovery of 5c AND get a stein with 5d. Going to go run tests on her other C's to see how drastically stein cancelling fixes those ugly -20's. Just confirmed, all above data is also true for 3c, which is the same level as 5c. 2c is a level above 3/5c, therefore is -7 on 5d7 cancel, making 2c her safest C on block. Weird. 6c is also level 5, therefore is also safer than 5c. Data looks odd, but it's the results, I'll keep running them looking for errors. Not sure how I feel about 6c being safer than 5c, but 8 frames off the recovery of 3c is pretty nice. Edited January 19, 2011 by C0R
TD Posted January 20, 2011 Posted January 20, 2011 good find, corin. lt proves why 3c 5d sod works and the rest do not. :o and now we can see how stein cancels will incorperate into her matchups - wow, what perfect timing, huh? lol. well, i'm going to get to work on mu vs jin tomorrow if ve is finished with the bits l gave on ragna. so, to get this started, does anyone have good advice on this matchup that they want to share?
FlyingVe Posted January 20, 2011 Posted January 20, 2011 The big one that gets alot of people (me included) is that Ice car can get over lasers. It's annoying... I'll think about it more though and see if I remember anything out of the obvious. You should also know jin's Ice resets so you don't get caught too off guard.
TD Posted January 20, 2011 Posted January 20, 2011 yes, 214d. l was actually going to mention this myself, about how much more important being careful setting steins, and spamming 236d against jin. his d car is fullscreen and very hard to react to, but with 236d lasers everywhere this, along with his swords are stopped. of course you can always ib punish, it's still an ice car lol. very tolerable match for her imo. alright thanks; i'll be sure to include that little tidbit.
C0R Posted January 20, 2011 Posted January 20, 2011 I get munched by EX air swords in the corner, he's out of range of everything. The ground ones aren't too bad though.
FlyingVe Posted January 20, 2011 Posted January 20, 2011 (edited) Well, DIceCar on reaction stuffs command laser (setup dependent obviously), and both D and C bail him out of aot of Oki setups, but once again, this is a match where I'd stick with SoD and zoning. Also, I think this is slightly in Jin's favor, not much though, like 5.5-4.5 jin. Edited January 20, 2011 by FlyingVe
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