[CS1-CSE] Valkenhayn Q&A

[Jais]

Ok I haven't been on blazblue since valkenhayn first came out because I started to hate CS because I couldn't play with my other characters anymore because of nerfs and stuff I really didn't want to learn because I was gonna start fresh but valkenhayn took to long to come out that I got bored of the game. So what I basically need is someone help me get better with him because he's the only character I find cool anymore and a reason to continue playing BBCS2 anyway. So if there are any valkenhayn up for some mirrors hit me up on my new/old PSN Crooshunter

I was so here, lol

[Mr.Nannie]

Alright Ive only got a few days exp with this game so cut me some slack here.

I was going through the combo thread this morning and Im having an issue with CD.

All 3 of the combos below want me to use CD, to 'wolf dash cancel?' and Transform to Human before continuing the combo.

The notation for each command is clearly separated... except for the CD, so Im I supposed to hit C and D simultaneously?

[h] Close Range 2A > 2C > 6B > 236C > 9D > j.B > j.A > Land 5D > 2C > 6C > j.214B > 2D > 236B > j.236A > j.236B > CD > j.B > dj.B > j.C (3.3k Damage, 50% MG)

[h] 2A > 2C > 236C > 9D > j.B > j.A > Land 5D > 2C > 6B > 2C > j.214B > 2D > 236B > j.236B > CD > j.B > dj.B > j.C (2.9k Damage, 47% MG)

[w] 236A > CD > 2C > j.B > j.214B > 9D > j.AAA > j.236A > j.236B > CD > j.B > dj.B > j.C (3k Damage)

This form changing is clearly Valks bnb, I would appreciate any tips on mastering this tech.

[Sahgren]

Alright Ive only got a few days exp with this game so cut me some slack here.

I was going through the combo thread this morning and Im having an issue with CD.

All 3 of the combos below want me to use CD, to 'wolf dash cancel?' and Transform to Human before continuing the combo.

The notation for each command is clearly separated... except for the CD, so Im I supposed to hit C and D simultaneously?

[h] Close Range 2A > 2C > 6B > 236C > 9D > j.B > j.A > Land 5D > 2C > 6C > j.214B > 2D > 236B > j.236A > j.236B > CD > j.B > dj.B > j.C (3.3k Damage, 50% MG)

[h] 2A > 2C > 236C > 9D > j.B > j.A > Land 5D > 2C > 6B > 2C > j.214B > 2D > 236B > j.236B > CD > j.B > dj.B > j.C (2.9k Damage, 47% MG)

[w] 236A > CD > 2C > j.B > j.214B > 9D > j.AAA > j.236A > j.236B > CD > j.B > dj.B > j.C (3k Damage)

This form changing is clearly Valks bnb, I would appreciate any tips on mastering this tech.

There's a slight delay in between hitting the C and D. Hit the C, wait a bit (until Valk starts moving forward), then try hitting D to transform, otherwise the transformation will get eaten by the startup animation of the dash.

You could notate it as C~D if you want to accent that there's a delay there, but since that's a pretty common portion of Valk's combos it's just generally understood what the timing is.

[Warriorkiller]

I have some questions about Valk, my choice of sub stopped on him since he is so bad*** but I don't know a thing about him, I've began Challenge to learn combos, but when I saw pro gameplay (Hima) I saw that none of the combo in the challenge are used, so unlike Hazama who has his most useful combos in the Challenge I didn't saw any combos useful so I feel like i'm wasting my time in challenge, first, are the challenge combos useful at all? and where should I begin to learn him? what basics are important as a Valk player?, what should I learn to do first and foremost? and does valk as any invincibility moves like a DP or something? or does he just sucks at turtling? and finally how to approach? since you can't block in wolf an only have a small hop and spamming air dash becomes predictable so are spamming 236A/C...

[Kiba]

first, are the challenge combos useful at all?

From a personal perspective I MAY use challenge combos 9 and most likely use 10. You will probably most likely use 5B - 5C - 236A alot too (mission 3). I tend to stray away from that combo though and use something like 5B - 3C - 236A because I have an easier time pressuring my opponent with wolf. So for example if they were to aerial tech backwards as I do 236A - 9C I could use the command grab or apply additional pressure with J.A. If you were to use 236A, You will either have to block because anything you do in human form will most likely get beat, and against the better players they would probably outpoke you if you were to wolf cancel and try to attack them.

The second combo for mission 5 may be useful because for now as you're learning him it will be you standard wolf combo.

where should I begin to learn him? what basics are important as a Valk player?, what should I learn to do first and foremost?

Again this is coming from a personal perspective. When I was first learning valk I used challenge mode as a basis. I'd play with others and when I got more comfortable with doing those basic combos I'd look for more advanced ones, that is watching combo videos and match vids. It's better to work your way up though so you're familiar with the basics, such as being comfortable with wolf movement because you will need it in all your matches. You will need to familarise yourself in the different ways he can cancel moves into the wolf such as his 6C (before hit), 6B (on hit) and his special moves.

You also need to become comfortable with his 8 way dash in wolf mode and be able to move around without burning so much meter.

This Valkenhayn Tutorial may be of great use to you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kALO1HQalAY

does valk as any invincibility moves like a DP or something? or does he just sucks at turtling?

Valk has no viable DP options. He has 6A which has full body guardpoint but it's not active until the first 5 frames of the move. In most situations its useless, but there are ways in which it might be helpful, such as using it during specific moves during Noel's drives but that comes later.

Valk also has his sturm wolf but you need 50% heat to use it. Being said, most of the time you will have to block, or even barrier block and look for options where you can backdash/jump out of player's pressure. He only has 4 primers so you can't afford to always be on the defensive. Valk isn't built for that.

and finally how to approach? since you can't block in wolf an only have a small hop and spamming air dash becomes predictable so are spamming 236A/C...

This is where matchup comes in. Sometimes you can abuse the wolf's movement to try and get in such as against Litchi without her staff. However, sometimes you will need to be patient and rely on human form mostly such as against Tager maybe.

Edited July 24, 2011 by Kiba

[Warriorkiller]

Ok thank you, I've watched the tutorial in english and didn't understand a lot if it, what is AKonig?, Bkonig? Rosen? Jagd? UKEMI? AEisen? BEisen? Shubalt? Weise? NETA? because the tutorial gived me more questions than it answered XD

[Sahgren]

Ok thank you, I've watched the tutorial in english and didn't understand a lot if it, what is AKonig?, Bkonig? Rosen? Jagd? UKEMI? AEisen? BEisen? Shubalt? Weise? NETA? because the tutorial gived me more questions than it answered XD

The majority of these are his move names, you can check them from the in-game command list. Usually when he puts a letter in front of the move name, he means you're supposed to use the A version or B version depending.

Examples:

Konig: The wolf cannons. "AKonig" means to do [w]236A/j.236A. "#Konig" would be the # of cannons you're supposed to do.

Rosen: 236C, his dash uppercut.

Jagd: 236B, his spinning low kick.

Ukemi means to tech after getting hit.

Shubalts and Weise probably refer to 236B ~ 236B like with Jagd. Why he calls it that is beyond me.

I have no idea what NETA is.

[Warriorkiller]

The majority of these are his move names, you can check them from the in-game command list. Usually when he puts a letter in front of the move name, he means you're supposed to use the A version or B version depending.

Examples:

Konig: The wolf cannons. "AKonig" means to do [w]236A/j.236A. "#Konig" would be the # of cannons you're supposed to do.

Rosen: 236C, his dash uppercut.

Jagd: 236B, his spinning low kick.

Ukemi means to tech after getting hit.

Shubalts and Weise probably refer to 236B ~ 236B like with Jagd. Why he calls it that is beyond me.

I have no idea what NETA is.

Teching is recovering right?

and what's his corner combo? correct me if i'm mistaken but it seems to me that his 6C acts as Hazama's 236D (venom sword) ie useless just about everywhere except to push ennemies in corner, but very useful when they ARE in corner... (if you can answer my questions by comparing with Hazama when possible please do it'll make my understanding better since he's my main)

I did challenge 5 and your right combo 2 does seems helpful, I saw that it's part of the basic combo hima uses... correct me if i'm right but that is his BnB?

my Valk does improves, I understood the basics of his drive (the wolf cancel thing with a customizable direction and his c dash) I also realized that spamming Konig wasn't a good idea (at first I thought that was all he was good to do in wolf) and then his A and B's in woolf are pretty useful too... but I have yet to learn some CH combos, Fatal combos, good Sturm wolf combos, corner exclusives, how to move with efficacity, when to and when not use is wolf to move, some pressure etc...

Are there any combos with his command grab? it seems like a great combo ender to me giving back any wolf gauge spent in the combo... but I didn,t saw hima uses any, and my small tries weren't sucessful... plus it can surprise many people since Valk dosen't have a normal grab on wolf form, so many people would not be waiting for it to tech it...

thanks for answering my questions, the more I play him the more I like him, he definitly is harder than he seemed but he his funnier too... and he really is a great addition to the cast.

Edited July 25, 2011 by Warriorkiller

[Sahgren]

Teching is recovering right?

and what's his corner combo? correct me if i'm mistaken but it seems to me that his 6C acts as Hazama's 236D (venom sword) ie useless just about everywhere except to push ennemies in corner, but very useful when they ARE in corner... (if you can answer my questions by comparing with Hazama when possible please do it'll make my understanding better since he's my main)

I did challenge 5 and your right combo 2 does seems helpful, I saw that it's part of the basic combo hima uses... correct me if i'm right but that is his BnB?

my Valk does improves, I understood the basics of his drive (the wolf cancel thing with a customizable direction and his c dash) I also realized that spamming Konig wasn't a good idea (at first I thought that was all he was good to do in wolf) and then his A and B's in woolf are pretty useful too... but I have yet to learn some CH combos, Fatal combos, good Sturm wolf combos, corner exclusives, how to move with efficacity, when to and when not use is wolf to move, some pressure etc...

Are there any combos with his command grab? it seems like a great combo ender to me giving back any wolf gauge spent in the combo... but I didn,t saw hima uses any, and my small tries weren't sucessful... plus it can surprise many people since Valk dosen't have a normal grab on wolf form, so many people would not be waiting for it to tech it...

thanks for answering my questions, the more I play him the more I like him, he definitly is harder than he seemed but he his funnier too... and he really is a great addition to the cast.

Yeah, teching is recovering.

You're right in that 6C isn't that great outside the corner. On the other hand, it's an overhead they have to watch out for (even if the return isn't much midscreen), it break primers and put you at a frame advantage on block, and gives you semi-decent corner carry on hit, so it's worth throwing out just to make them watch out for it.

Corner Combo:

[h]2C > 6B > 3C > 2C > 6C > 2C > j.214B > 2D > 236B > j.236A > j.236B > 5/6C > j.B > j.B > 5B > j.D~B > dj.B > dj.C > j.236236C if you catch them on the ground with a 2C.

If you catch them in midair with the 2C, do: [h]2C > 6C > slight delay 2C > 6B > 2C > rest of the combo. You'll want to catch them as low as possible with the 2C after the 6C so that the 6B will hit.

Command Throw Combo (corner):

[w]236D > [h]2C > 6C > slight delay 2C > 6B > 2C > j.214B > 2D > 236B > j.236B > C~D > j.B > dj.B > dj.C. The c-grab will automatically revert Valk to human form for you.

You can do 2C > 6B > 2C > 6C > 2C instead for easier timing on most of the cast, but you'll need what's originally listed for characters with awkward hitboxes such as Rachel.

Command Throw Combo (midscreen):

[w]236D > RC > j.236A > j.236B > 5/6C > j.B > j.B > 5B > j.D~B > dj.B > dj.C. RC the c-grab right after he finishes biting the opponent so that you stay in wolf form for the j.236A.

[Warriorkiller]

Yeah, teching is recovering.

You're right in that 6C isn't that great outside the corner. On the other hand, it's an overhead they have to watch out for (even if the return isn't much midscreen), it break primers and put you at a frame advantage on block, and gives you semi-decent corner carry on hit, so it's worth throwing out just to make them watch out for it.

Corner Combo:

[h]2C > 6B > 3C > 2C > 6C > 2C > j.214B > 2D > 236B > j.236A > j.236B > 5/6C > j.B > j.B > 5B > j.D~B > dj.B > dj.C > j.236236C if you catch them on the ground with a 2C.

If you catch them in midair with the 2C, do: [h]2C > 6C > slight delay 2C > 6B > 2C > rest of the combo. You'll want to catch them as low as possible with the 2C after the 6C so that the 6B will hit.

Command Throw Combo (corner):

[w]236D > [h]2C > 6C > slight delay 2C > 6B > 2C > j.214B > 2D > 236B > j.236B > C~D > j.B > dj.B > dj.C. The c-grab will automatically revert Valk to human form for you.

You can do 2C > 6B > 2C > 6C > 2C instead for easier timing on most of the cast, but you'll need what's originally listed for characters with awkward hitboxes such as Rachel.

Command Throw Combo (midscreen):

[w]236D > RC > j.236A > j.236B > 5/6C > j.B > j.B > 5B > j.D~B > dj.B > dj.C. RC the c-grab right after he finishes biting the opponent so that you stay in wolf form for the j.236A.

thanks but can you point me videos where that combo is? I have no trouble with reading the combos but I don't have an image of it for Valkenhayn yet, I don,t have trouble agains't seeing combos like this for Hazama since I really know him but I really don,t know a lot of Valk so if I could have a visual it would be interesting, now for the Command grab combos, I was talking of it as a finisher, not a combo starter... but thanks for the combos anyway it can be useful

[Sahgren]

thanks but can you point me videos where that combo is? I have no trouble with reading the combos but I don't have an image of it for Valkenhayn yet, I don,t have trouble agains't seeing combos like this for Hazama since I really know him but I really don,t know a lot of Valk so if I could have a visual it would be interesting, now for the Command grab combos, I was talking of it as a finisher, not a combo starter... but thanks for the combos anyway it can be useful

I'll look up a video of practical Valk combos, but for now I can't find any.

The problem with using the c-grab as an ender is that then you'll just get a purple grab that they can break. You can, however, set it up so that you reset into the c-grab, as shown in this video.

Edit: Accidently killed two birds with one stone. In the video he keep resetting into practical (albeit not optimal) combos, minus the enders.

Edited July 25, 2011 by Sahgren

[Warriorkiller]

Ok thanks I'll do some traing with those combos, i'm gonna come back if I have more questions, Valk really is difficult to play and by resetting it allows for a new combo entirely so it's good

[NickExtreme1]

I'll look up a video of practical Valk combos, but for now I can't find any.

The video Kiba linked above us is sufficient. Very helpful especially in the breakdown of Valkenhayn's combo logic.

[Warriorkiller]

ok I tried to do the BnB again and I cant get the (h) J.B to connect after the (w) 5B... (when you have to jump and transform in midair then hit with B) and the rare times it will connect, when I jump again the second j.B won't connect, is there a visual cue or something about the timing or I just have to try again and again and again until i finally get the timing right?

and is it safe to assume that J.236236C will ALWAYS connect after a J.C?

finally are there any good Strum wolf combos (w/o RC) are does this DD just sucks? because I've done a 5.4k damage with j.236236C and only did 2.9k with Strum wolf...

[OrionXElite]

For the [W]5B>j.D>[H]j.B part, you gotta make sure you're doing the j.B quick. I know when I was trying this, I wasn't getting the j.B cause I wasn't hitting the button soon enough after I went back to Human. So try and adjust the speed at which you hit j.D and j.B and you'll find it soon.

Konig Flug(j.236236C) Will always hit assuming the j.C hits at the right height. So long as their under Valk and you do it right after the j.C, it'll hit. Delaying it can cause the angle to get messed up and either hit wrong or miss entirely.

As for Sturm Wolf, there are a few cases where it could be useful. It used to be the Super of choice in CS1 since it gives you way better oki and it still gives a bit more damage. The problem now is that the extra damage you lose from whatever leads up to the Air Super evens out if you just end on Ground Super so you'd better off in most cases ending in Air super cause you get that little bit of extra heat.

[NeonCrusader]

[w] 5B, j.DB should be done as quickly as possible; no tricky timing on it. You have to evaluate whether or not 5B's untech time will carry over into j.B, though, since proration may make it impossible. In general, I find it easier to do [w] 5B, j.AAA, dj.DC, which does a bit less damage but does get you that nice falling j.C trap thing.

I'm almost 100% sure that there is no situation where proration makes j.C, Konig Flug impossible, though at extremely low proration (and I mean beyond the auto-tech threshold low) they may be able to tech the second hit of Konig.

Sturm does more damage as an ender, but generally you need a good proration starter to get a good combo into it. Otherwise Konig Flug enders are much much easier and present themselves far more often.

[Warriorkiller]

ok I'll try it again then, I also have troubles with the timing to do the J.D to retransfrom in human so often my j.B will hit, as a wolf... ok thanks so I know everytime I have 50 meter I can use Konig Flug without fearing it may miss and I'll just forget about Sturm Wolf unless i'm winning and can finish the match with it so they won't burst that's sad since it's so bad***

[Rakaneth]

Can someone explain to me what is happening in the otherwise amazing translated tutorial video at 9:10 or so? It looks like an option select but I can't quite grasp it.

The Valk Bible

[NickExtreme1]

Can someone explain to me what is happening in the otherwise amazing translated tutorial video at 9:10 or so? It looks like an option select but I can't quite grasp it.

The Valk Bible

That is actually a fuzzy guard set-up. The inputs pretty much explain how it works.

In the video, the inputs go like this:

3C = 3C(dash)

CA = 5C(brake) > j.A

[Rakaneth]

I am actually referring to the section one second after.

[OrionXElite]

I am actually referring to the section one second after.

You mean the part with the 5C>j.A(66)>3C>CA>(4BC)>5B??

Its an option select since Valk's j.A>3C>CA trick ins't 100% air tight. I know how it works, but I don't know why you have to go 66 after the first j.A. Although it doesn't make any sense to do 66 so I think its a translation error so I'm gonna assume its supposed to be 44. But otherwise, the way its works is like this:

You go 5C>j.A and if they block it, you can option select the follow up by doing j.A(44)3C>CA>4BC>5B. This will force a couple a different actions to happen at once and depending on the way the opponent deal with it, it'll pick the option accordingly. If they block or get hit, the second j.A comes out and the 5B follows. If they try to DP the first j.A, it whiffs and you backdash. If they try to IB>DP through the 2nd j.A, the 4C will come out instead. This is actually REALLY useful to know cause it will probably work on the characters that we need i most against like Jin's DP(As Shown in the video) and Hazama's Kick Super. I'll see if I can get it down consistently enough to test what it works against.

[Warriorkiller]

[h]2C > 6B > 3C > 2C > 6C > 2C > j.214B > 2D > 236B > j.236A > j.236B > 5/6C > j.B > j.B > 5B > j.D~B > dj.B > dj.C > j.236236C

the 3rd 2C won't connect, they can recovery a lot before the hit, everytime I tried...

[BerserkJustice]

[h]2C > 6B > 3C > 2C > 6C > 2C > j.214B > 2D > 236B > j.236A > j.236B > 5/6C > j.B > j.B > 5B > j.D~B > dj.B > dj.C > j.236236C

the 3rd 2C won't connect, they can recovery a lot before the hit, everytime I tried...

I hope I am not telling you something you already know, but that is a corner combo. Generally combos that have 6C in them can only be followed up with 2C either in the corner or within dashing distance of it (they can also be followed with wolf 236A at certain distances, but that is another story). Other than that, try to hit the 3rd 2C as low to the ground as possible in order to make the following air sequence easier to connect.

[Verard]

Hey sorry if this was mentioned before but I'm having trouble finding a combo for a specific situation. I like to command grab in the corner ALOT and my opponents inevitably catch on either with a backdash or jump on wakeups. But 90% of the time they will jump, and I if I happen to predict it I will jump with them and airgrab. The problem is I have no idea how to combo off this. I'm too close to the corner to do a 5B > 2C, as they land behind me. The only thing I can land is a 5A and I don't know what to do with it. Anyone have a combo for this? Preferably one that puts them back in the corner.

[Sahgren]

Hey sorry if this was mentioned before but I'm having trouble finding a combo for a specific situation. I like to command grab in the corner ALOT and my opponents inevitably catch on either with a backdash or jump on wakeups. But 90% of the time they will jump, and I if I happen to predict it I will jump with them and airgrab. The problem is I have no idea how to combo off this. I'm too close to the corner to do a 5B > 2C, as they land behind me. The only thing I can land is a 5A and I don't know what to do with it. Anyone have a combo for this? Preferably one that puts them back in the corner.

Off of an aerial command grab you should be able to do the exact same combo as if you landed a ground command grab. j.236D > 2C > 6C > slight delay 2C > 6B > 2C > j.214B > 2D > 236B > j.236B > 5/6C~D > j.B > dj.B > dj.C (4k DMG, 55 MG)

Off of a human air throw it changes on the spacing. If you're close enough to the corner that they cross you up when falling, the combo I tend to use is: Air Throw > 5A > 2C > sj.D~AAA > j.236B > 5/6C > j.B > j.B > 5B > j.AAA > dj.D~C (2.8k DMG, 29 MG). That should put them back in the corner.

If you're far enough away from the corner but close enough to land a 2C, you can do: Air Throw > 2C > 6C > 2C > 6B > 2C > j.214B > 2D > 236B > j.236B > 5/6C~D > j.B > dj.B > dj.C (4.2k, 49 MG). The exact same combo as if you landed a c-grab, just with more damage and less meter gain.

Edited August 1, 2011 by Sahgren