[P4AU] Kanji Loketest/Changes Discussion

[Yohosie]

I will fight anyone to the death who says that command grab while persona broken is a bad decision

[Yohosie]

i will fucking destroy you

[HoudiniJr100]

I don;t think anyone among our kanji circle will say that.

[Martian Buddy]

I doubt any Kanji player would, but there'll be someone who complains about it, mark my words. I've seen stuff from other places on the net complaining that Kanji is getting buffed at all.

[Kairos]

I've seen psots on tumblr saying that Kanji and Tager are OP.

Someone, somewhere will say this makes Kanji broken.

[GreekAngel]

The ability to throw without a persona will make Kanji scary no matter if or when he is persona broken or not. I'd say this is an amazing thing

[HoudiniJr100]

The ability to throw without a persona will make Kanji scary no matter if or when he is persona broken or not. I'd say this is an amazing thing

if it's say, score attack kanji we're all dead, but for us players it's a godsend.

[Martian Buddy]

So we finally have new footage with Kanji, and specifically his new Shoulder Charge move. Looks like my guess was wrong, since it just shoots Take-Mikazuchi across the screen without Kanji, so it looks more like it'll be a mid- to full-screen punishing move for opponents rather than a combo starter, though I can already see it being used primarily in combos. If it can beat projectiles then we might finally have a decent option for dealing with Yukiko (and now Yukari) from full screen.

Links to the videos for those that haven't seen:

vs Yukari Round 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rA6L6xMGz54

vs Yukari Round 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opsUamQ8kU0

EDIT: Looks like it does penetrate projectiles. Happy days

Edited August 17, 2013 by Martian Buddy

[Omex]

So we finally have new footage with Kanji, and specifically his new Shoulder Charge move. Looks like my guess was wrong, since it just shoots Take-Mikazuchi across the screen without Kanji, so it looks more like it'll be a mid- to full-screen punishing move for opponents rather than a combo starter, though I can already see it being used primarily in combos. If it can beat projectiles then we might finally have a decent option for dealing with Yukiko (and now Yukari) from full screen.

Links to the videos for those that haven't seen:

vs Yukari Round 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rA6L6xMGz54

vs Yukari Round 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opsUamQ8kU0

note: I hate going of off videos to guess the speed of things, and I say never ever ever do it... but 5C feint in video 1 looks shorter.

j.c air hit might have a longer knockdown duration; it's possible the yukari lateteched but i'm not sure.

aside from that it seems the tackle has uh... 30f or less recovery upon use, and take doesn't die to projectiles. in other words, it's something we'll be able to guess, say, yukiko throwing a fan, liz doing j.b, and it'll go and cleanly plow them while we block the projectile (since take doesn't absorb it). on CH, wallslam. comboability is probably depending on distance and how high the opponent is. use in combos currently people are thinking probably not, but maybe off specific starters.

note: wait. it fatals lol. good shit

Edited August 17, 2013 by Omex

[HoudiniJr100]

I think now we're viable against zoners...today is a good day

[A.X.I.S.]

Shadow Kanji (Probably normal Kanji too) has a slower air backdash.

That might mean air back turn cross up j.B could be easier to do or not possible since its slow.

I'm curious about it.

The feint having a shorter duration is good.

[HoudiniJr100]

it was nerfed to half the original distance

[Osuna]

note: I hate going of off videos to guess the speed of things, and I say never ever ever do it... but 5C feint in video 1 looks shorter.

j.c air hit might have a longer knockdown duration; it's possible the yukari lateteched but i'm not sure.

aside from that it seems the tackle has uh... 30f or less recovery upon use, and take doesn't die to projectiles. in other words, it's something we'll be able to guess, say, yukiko throwing a fan, liz doing j.b, and it'll go and cleanly plow them while we block the projectile (since take doesn't absorb it). on CH, wallslam. comboability is probably depending on distance and how high the opponent is. use in combos currently people are thinking probably not, but maybe off specific starters.

note: wait. it fatals lol. good shit

Unless it Does absorb projectiles and the piercing was a property of yukari's attack.

[Omex]

Unless it Does absorb projectiles and the piercing was a property of yukari's attack.

You're right. Hitspark for guard effect happens when the arrows hit take, tackle's even better than we thought lol. If, say, yukiko throws a fan and we do tackel, it'll stop the fan while traveling and then we can chase after for the combo, good idea!

[Omex]

also, what i assumed ended up being true; oki chair no longer goes fullscreen, you have to space it to actually land it. what this means:

214C grab setups have to have lightning oki afterwards

214C personaelss grabs are gonna be weak, it looks like

j.214b knockdown will be really bad unless omc'd/omb'd

236C knockdown is going to be more important

and... hopefully oki chair gives way more damage/frame advantage on hit.

[Yohosie]

Oh hey, air 5C fatal counters cause a long hard knockdown now, unless that was a stupidly late tech

Edited August 18, 2013 by Yohosie

[Omex]

Oh hey, air 5C fatal counters cause a long hard knockdown now, unless that was a stupidly late tech

more importantly the aoa combo into j.c didn't let her tech until she hit the ground, either she's lateteching aboslutely everything or that is indeed what htey want us to use as an air ender instead of j.214b!

[Yohosie]

Maybe that means we can combo off AoA now with a OMC? Also was it me or was it 18 hits instead of 16 hits? I can see AoA -> j.C (OMC) -> delayed j.B -> 2B -> 236C or something similar? Either way I super expect it to be possible, can't wait to get into the lab and try things out. AoAs not leading to oki midscreen was kind of a bummer.

[Omex]

Maybe that means we can combo off AoA now with a OMC? Also was it me or was it 18 hits instead of 16 hits? I can see AoA -> j.C (OMC) -> delayed j.B -> 2B -> 236C or something similar? Either way I super expect it to be possible, can't wait to get into the lab and try things out. AoAs not leading to oki midscreen was kind of a bummer.

uh? you don't get lightning oki but off of AoA midscreen C you can just do j.a j.a j.b doublejump j.a j.b j.214b before. good corner carry, etc. can omc j.236b for 2c 2b 236c pretty sure, so yea! now that AoA ~ D is also special cancelable we can probably do something off that as well. i wouldn't spend the 50 meter on oki over just ending in j.214b/j.c hard knockdown regardless :V

edit: oh yeah and aoa number was changed for noraisin. idk LOL

[A.X.I.S.]

Isn't it 17 hits now?

[Yohosie]

uh? you don't get lightning oki but off of AoA midscreen C you can just do j.a j.a j.b doublejump j.a j.b j.214b before. good corner carry, etc. can omc j.236b for 2c 2b 236c pretty sure, so yea! now that AoA ~ D is also special cancelable we can probably do something off that as well. i wouldn't spend the 50 meter on oki over just ending in j.214b/j.c hard knockdown regardless :V

edit: oh yeah and aoa number was changed for noraisin. idk LOL

woops not sure why I said that. That said in the current game I'm pretty sure I haven't hit an AoA midscreen in months.

[Omex]

・Shadow kanji

Shadow activate looks like it can be used as an OMC。5AA sweep > activate > 2C possible.

by the way, ~Sweep >Activate > 5C > 236AB > 236236a > 214214C only does 5k

Near, corner, AoAD> 2A > 2B > CorD tackle comboed, but it seemed like 5A would not combo afterwards

5B 2b, 5c and 2C are all gone.

5C and 2B are both hop cancelable, 5C is dash cancelable and it seems to be a very strong option. 5B > AoA now works.

j.b j.b j.236A/B works, but might be FC only.

Cannot do personaless 214C when 5/j/2D is active.

5C can be canceled into 214c(!?), which is why 5B 5C is gone apparently

backdash > yolodive works。Take tackle seems to be a good tool for air control and is there primarily to make the neutral game much easier。ただ5Bとかの手堅い牽制からの楽なリターンは取れなくなったし、増加した部分は全体的に大雑把な行動なので、ある意味より一般的なイメージの投げキャラらしくなった感 (hard to translate bit for me. sounds like with the adjustments given to kanji he's being changed to be a little more like a traditional grappler? ...or something? ;; )

While kanji has lost an option during RPS with the loss of 5B>2B、5AAが前進する関係上近距離でまとわり付きやすくなってるし(Commenting on the fact that 5AA moves forward, but I genuinely don't understand this description of the normal)、5C dash cancel are additions that are moving kanji in somewhat of a weird direction. 。I don't think he'll be that much different from his current version

Edited August 18, 2013 by Omex

[Martian Buddy]

It sounds like they're just tweaking a lot of Kanji's game to make him more usable while not changing him a lot. Keeping him the same while adding some much needed tools is pretty much all Kanji needs.

[Kairos]

I'm a little slow, what does 5B 2B 5C 2C mean?

Glad to hear Pikazuchi tackle helps with Air control though. Might make the vs Yosuke and vs Teddie matchups slightly less painful.

[Zeik56]

I'm a little slow, what does 5B 2B 5C 2C mean?

Glad to hear Pikazuchi tackle helps with Air control though. Might make the vs Yosuke and vs Teddie matchups slightly less painful.

Standing B, crouching B, standing C, crouching C.

789

456

123

5 is neutral, 2 is down, etc.

Edited August 18, 2013 by Zeik56