[CP] Azrael - Gameplay Discussion v.2 (Discuss Videos/Combos/Questions/etc.)

[Synyster17]

Hey is there going to be anymore loketest talk? I mean, I haven't heard about it in I don't know how long.

 

idk if there will b one. i think they will just drop the full change list and then drop that patch. it's only like one more month. im actually looking forward to it. i don't use growler as a dp that much anyway.

[1010111101]

Thanks, thats what i wanted to know, i just worded it raelly weirdly cus it was late at night. 

 

so the 2 ch combos are optimal? or is it just something simple that even a new player like me can do? ;p

[Synyster17]

Thanks, thats what i wanted to know, i just worded it raelly weirdly cus it was late at night.

so the 2 ch combos are optimal? or is it just something simple that even a new player like me can do? ;p

IMO he has easy combos. I think you should be able 2 do all of then if u know the links. As far as what you should do check the combo thread. Those are just the ones I use.

[Verimeloni]

Those could be optimized further, for instance instead of TCL > 3D you can do IAD j.A > j.B > 5B > sj. aerial, granted that combo pathway works for the opponent at hand (TCL > 3D doesn't work on Tager so just 236A for damage if nothing else works).

 

Midscreen:

 

CH 3D > 6A > 3D > 5C > TCL > 5B > 2C > 5B > aerial ~5.6k if you reach the corner. if not 3D or IAD.

or

CH 3D > 6A > 214D > j.C > airdash > j.C > 236D > 5A > TCL > 3D if you want both weak points. CH 3D > 6A doesn't work on Tager or Arakune so with those you're better of with aerial > j.2D > TCL etc.

 

[uW] CH 3D > 6A > 3D > valiant is powerful too~

[1010111101]

Those could be optimized further, for instance instead of TCL > 3D you can do IAD j.A > j.B > 5B > sj. aerial, granted that combo pathway works for the opponent at hand (TCL > 3D doesn't work on Tager so just 236A for damage if nothing else works).

 

Midscreen:

 

CH 3D > 6A > 3D > 5C > TCL > 5B > 2C > 5B > aerial ~5.6k if you reach the corner. if not 3D or IAD.

or

CH 3D > 6A > 214D > j.C > airdash > j.C > 236D > 5A > TCL > 3D if you want both weak points. CH 3D > 6A doesn't work on Tager or Arakune so with those you're better of with aerial > j.2D > TCL etc.

 

[uW] CH 3D > 6A > 3D > valiant is powerful too~

Thank you so much! what about some counter hit 6d combos?

[zankoku]

ch 6D > 2C > 6D > 5C > TCL > ender

or

ch 6D > 5C > TC > Valiant

[1010111101]

ch 6D > 2C > 6D > 5C > TCL > ender

or

ch 6D > 5C > TC > Valiant

Thanks, i need help with  CH 3D > 6A > 214D > j.C > airdash > j.C > 236D > 5A > TCL > 3D  i always seem to be too far for the 5a to hit after 236D.

[Verimeloni]

Thanks, i need help with  CH 3D > 6A > 214D > j.C > airdash > j.C > 236D > 5A > TCL > 3D  i always seem to be too far for the 5a to hit after 236D.

 

http://youtu.be/sKms8y7kGw8?t=48s

 

Switch 5A to 5B if you're fast enough

[1010111101]

http://youtu.be/sKms8y7kGw8?t=48s

 

Switch 5A to 5B if you're fast enough

Thanks alot! i figured out why i cuoldnt get the 5a to connect, it was because i did not delay the 2nd j.c enough! btw, what can i do if i do raw hornet when im really close? it seems that the air dash j.c will whiff if im too close when i hornet.

[Verimeloni]

Thanks alot! i figured out why i cuoldnt get the 5a to connect, it was because i did not delay the 2nd j.c enough! btw, what can i do if i do raw hornet when im really close? it seems that the air dash j.c will whiff if im too close when i hornet.

 

Raw version is covered in the video

[Synyster17]

So do we have an azrael Skype chat. Could someone add me plz.

[1010111101]

Hey guys, how do i punish backwards and forward rolling with azrael? is there something that can cover both options?

[Kinkuli]

Usually you would punish backrolls with 3D with a read. in some cases it might also tag forward rolls. For forward rolls 5A or 5B should be good enough. It really depends on which part of the screen you are really.

 

TK dump setup should beat rolls but there might have been few cases where this was not the case. It might have been that with safe jump timing opponent can backroll and without safe jump timing they can't. There might have been in depth post earlier in this thread about it.

 

Only real place where you have total control of rolling is corner. If you look at dogura's matches, he will whiff spaced 5B so that if opponent rolls, it will catch the roll. On whiff you still have the advantage. 

 

EDIT: DO note that in most cases with azrael, his combos end in situations where opponent can't roll straight away and you can get "late tech" punish. The strategy thread has in depth guide to late tech punishing so check it out. 

[1010111101]

ty so much

[Synyster17]

 

Luminos564, on 20 Sept 2014 - 6:03 PM, said:

So some things I noticed with Azrael (don't know Ragna enough to provide any input, sorry):

 

-TCL really does only wall-stick when close to the corner. Otherwise it causes the opponent to slide away.

-6B seems like it can be cancelled by more than just forward dashes. I saw it jump cancelled (on hit) and normal cancelled into 6C (on whiff).

-Damage looks somewhat lower but kinda hard to tell. Might just be the combo routes taken. EDIT: Yeah damage is lower but negligible (we're talking like 100~150 damage lost from the current version). Ragna's damage is lowered as well so I guess this it more just a general thing with all the characters and not just these 2. 

-Either the distance was too large or the player did it too late but BHS did not connect from 6A (wall-bounce).

-Similar to the above but Throw>6A (corner wall-bounce)>air dash j.C did not connect. Probably could with an RC on 6A.

-Scud Punishment now wall-bounces. Damage lowered to 1299 (normal, non-OD version).

-Growler Field still can "hit" the opponent (Ragna blocks it in the air) and later when it does hit proper, it still sends them flying but not as far as CP1.1. "Hot potato" Growler is pretty good though, especially if you catch Ragnas dash-cancelling their (caught) Dead Spikes.

-Not strictly Azrael-related but when 6B and Belial Edge clashed the words "DEBCG Sousai Gravity" appeared. No clue what the heck that means however.

 

That's about all. I'm sure someone much more attentive and knowledgeable can provide more info than I.

 

 

So i quoted this post from the bbcp new thread and thanks again for looking over everything in there pretty cool of you.

 

that aside really mori. tlc now slides. how are we going to deal with that also 6a from throw does go into BHS the guy just mistimed it. 

 

 

also scud seems to be faster now. it looks like a real reversal and it leaves them somewhat close to you.

Edited September 21, 2014 by Synyster17

[Verimeloni]

6B and Scud startup buffed, SCORE

[natearistata]

Yeah, but doesn't look like you can follow Scud up on counter-hit anymore (is this OD only anyway? I should know this), due to the full-screen wall-bounce. But still, the untech time -might- be long enough that you could follow it up in the corner? Could be interesting.

 

Also I never saw what the j.D/j.2D having further knockback looked like in the loketests, but it certainly looked the same as it is now in that video, so that potentially got unnerfed.

 

Another change that poster didn't catch is that Gustaf now puts the opponent into a stagger state on hit, so they have to tech. Could lead to a lot of blue beat combos if they're not on the ball there, and if they are you just continue your pressure.

 

As for the throw>6A>j.C not working, I can't say 100%, but it just didn't look right to me when they did it. I want to say they messed it up vs. it doesn't work anymore at all, but I'm definitely not certain on it. Still, TCL nerf hurts. Having them slide out gives enough time to chase them down I think with a forward dash > IAD, but it's definitely not ideal and no more mid-screen rapid combos is pretty sad; nerfed corner carry, damage, and weak point potential all in one. Def the biggest nerf he got.

[Verimeloni]

that aside really mori. tlc now slides. how are we going to deal with that also 6a from throw does go into BHS the guy just mistimed it.

TCL > RC > 22C?

[RentalBlackout]

To me it looked like j.D knockbacked further than it did, yet j.2D seemed similar as 1.1 Not too sure about it. Does anyone know if 2C was changed?

[Synyster17]

TCL > RC > 22C?

After watching the tape I would say no.

I think something along the lines of 5bb 236a rc 3c stuff would work fine. Hopefully getting them close enough to the corner to make use of the wall stick.

[Synyster17]

To me it looked like j.D knockbacked further than it did, yet j.2D seemed similar as 1.1 Not too sure about it. Does anyone know if 2C was changed?

J.d did get hit a little but I didn't see the j2d. If this statement is true then we will be getting a lot of low weak points now.

I looked for a single 2c but I could not see it. I will try to research the tape again to see if I can find it right. I really started paying attention to it after the second match so ill go check.

[RentalBlackout]

Yeah I was wondering why I couldn't tell if 2C was nerfed, apparently it was cause I never even saw it being used, not in neutral anyway. On a plus side I guess 6B's just that good now?

[LegendaryRath]

If TCL slides instead of wallcounces midscreen, then I would assume the go-to RC combo would be 'stuff > gustaf > RC > 3C > 22C > stuff'

 

It looks to me like they're experimenting with different things at this point, which I'm fine with. It's difficult for me to worry about changes in a loketest too much, but I do still find it all interesting.

[RentalBlackout]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nnecTvUslg&feature=youtu.be&t=1h9m44s

Well that's how j.2D looks, seems like people can emergency tech off of it now but you don't knock them as far as j.D.

[natearistata]

If TCL slides instead of wallcounces midscreen, then I would assume the go-to RC combo would be 'stuff > gustaf > RC > 3C > 22C > stuff'

 

It looks to me like they're experimenting with different things at this point, which I'm fine with. It's difficult for me to worry about changes in a loketest too much, but I do still find it all interesting.

I assumed they were playing the finalized version, as it comes out in ~18 days in arcades, but that could of course be wrong and they're still tweaking things.