Digital Watches

Nah. Axl owns him pretty hard.

But I don't look as smart if I just say "lol HOS."

Alright. Wrote that up.

Initial writeup: Done

Broken link is broken.

Could you edit the DAA thing in? I don't know what to write about it, since I hate that move and never use it.

They hit mid, take a while to come up, are activated when you pass over the spot that they're planted (no matter how high you are), and poison when they're the big doll-installed ones. Yes.

There. Writeup done. If anyone has anything to add, feel free, as it's been a while since I've fought a Venom, and there may be some things I'm forgetting.

Nah, I do that all the time. Look at the section on "screen maintainence," as the first paragraph is all about killing those suckers. But it's better to know where they are and kill them than to try to find them with random pokes.

Eh, you have to be at a range where it'll hit, yeah, but you have options if you whiff and FRC, such as airdashing back, and the hitbox is bigger than it looks. In the right situations, it has served me very well against I-No, and it's certainly much better than the atrocity of a move that is AC's j.6P

Hey, Shoto's right. It turns out I was only getting this to work because the baiken wasn't acting fast enough, this isn't a safe option at all.

True. The only caveat I'd add is that Axl's low-profile 2k does a terrible job dodging SV. Rock it can also lose to 2K.

Axl Low: Overview: This match is all kinds of stupid. It's worse than Baiken v. Baiken in terms of sheer raw banality. Whereas Baiken v. Baiken is like setting two rocks down and waiting for them to fight, Axl v. Axl is like giving large spears to two hobos and putting them in a sumo ring blindfolded after spinning them around a couple times. Your gameplan is to dick around trying to outpoke this guy until someone gets a knockdown, then rush like there's no tomorrow, since there's not much he can do about it. Long range: Axl is a hard character to zone out, as he can cover any range you can. Try to predict what he's going to do and beat it. If he throws out a 2P or 2H, you can IAD or raeisageki in. If he throws a 5P, you can run in or try to tenhouseki it. If he throws out a rensen, go for raeisageki or some other tomfoolery that'll go over or through it (just watch out for the 8 followup.) If his rensen whiffs, just run forward and be ready to FD break. If he tries to jump in, AA him with something. If he tries to run in, hit him with a low. Most of his shit gets beaten by rensen, but be careful about whiffing it, and it'll trade with his dumb green projectile (I think it's called rensen or something). Remember, your AA is better than his Air-to-Ground, so use that. If you can get him blocking or knocked down, you can start your rush. Rushdown: Axl's main weakness is his lack of good tools to break out of pressure with. His DAA sucks, and his weak excuses for reversals (some weird projectile counter thing and that terrible DP) get beat out by any low, so go for a lot of those. His high startup on most normals (6+) and 4F jump make him especially susceptible to tickthrows (Or tick-rashou), and it also makes it difficult for him to break out during gaps. Just be careful doing overheads, as your overheads are kind of slow, he has good AA options, and he has a low-profile move that'll go under Bomber. Either way, he's pretty much the best character to rush down, even easier than Eddie, so try not to let up. Defense: That dick Watches down at the Axl forums has been telling all the Axl players our darkest secret: Axl has a hard time breaking out of rushdown. So if anyone reads his guide on this matchup, expect them to be riding you pretty hard when they get the chance. To get out of Axl's rush, you need to be able to see his overheads (Bomber, IADs, 6H, and the occasional 5D) and IB like a mofo. FDing isn't that useful, since Axl has a lot of ways to get back in or just attack from a range, such as Rensen FRC, and various gatlings into 2H, 2P, or 5P (His long range moves, in case you didn't know). He even has a long range command grab, which can be hard to get out of if you can't 1FJ. I know it's a pain, but you should really familiarize yourself with Axl's gatlings and J/SCable moves, since that'll clue you in on when there might be gaps. Most of the time, the gaps are largest when Axl tries for an overhead. If you're IBing, you should be able to see it coming and beat it out, depending on what the overhead is. For 6H, 6P and Housou should both work (Benten is a little risky, as if you do it too late, it'll just trade.) For Axl Bomber, you can go under it with low profile 2K, or, if it's not in an air blockstring, just beat it before it starts up with c.S, 5K, or 6P. For IADs, go for regular AA options if you have time, but a good Axl can make it so you just have to block. Raeisageki might be thrown in from time to time, and depending on the preceding string, you might not be able to AA it in time, so block it. Just watch out for the FRC, since that's a common throw setup. Pros: -Axl has to think carefully about his zoning in this match, since Axl can punish him at the same range. -Axl is defensively weak, which makes Axl's usually mediocre-to-moderate rushdown capabilities much more effective. -4 frame jump makes tick throws and Rashousen setups harder to escape. -The Axl player might have an aneurysm and die because of how completely stupid this match is. Cons: -Axl has to think carefully about his zoning in this match, since Axl can punish him at the same range. -Axl is defensively weak, which makes Axl's usually mediocre-to-moderate rushdown capabilities much more effective. -4 frame jump makes tick throws and Rashousen setups harder to escape. -You might have an aneurysm and die because of how completely stupid this match is. My opinion: 10-0 Axl's advantage. Axl wins no matter what.

I knew there was SOME crazy magical tool I was forgetting. 6H also can hit a neutral crouching Eddie and link into 5K for a combo, so definitely some good stuff to mention, thanks! Yeah I did! It's in the "Pros" section.

Eddie General Strategy: This matchup can be very intense, and is basically a contest to see who can get the first hit in, as neither character can really get out of pressure very well, and both die from 1-2 combos from the other. So obviously practice your blocking, but most importantly, get rid of little eddie and RUSH THAT SHIT DOWN. Defensive tactics: Surviving Eddie rushdown is pretty much the same for most characters: Block extremely fucking well, and try to predict and get out of unblockables as best you can. So the only comment I'll make on that is that Axl has the unusual property of having an extremely narrow standing hitbox. While this probably won't net you a free escape from a blockstring, it has saved my life a few times when I guessed wrong against 5K (One of Eddie's main low options in his stupid endless blockstrings). Basically, to make 5K not combo into 5S, you should try to FD probably one move per string that'll push you back, then IB Mawaru's backhit as often as possible. This sounds (and is) hard, but if you can get the timing down, it can get you a few lucky breaks. You should still generally follow the block low, wait for overhead rule, though, since Eddie's fast overhead, 6K, is still 18F startup, which is well within the realm of "seeable." Watch out for tickthrows too! To get rid of little eddie, I tend to try to zone and fish with j.S, 2P, and occasionally rensen (Of course go for AA stuff if he jumps). Anti-air can be a little hard against Eddie, but not too hard. 2K will go under basically anything he can do, 6P is a good way to beat out j.K trickery, and you can do the standard long range stuff as long as you make sure to keep track of where he's flying. Housoubako and Benten (light) are semi-viable options to get rid of little eddie up close, just expect to get hit by a naked Eddie combo afterwards. Arr Tea Es Dee! Eddie suffers from the same problem Axl does: A lack of fast normals and invincible moves. While he does technically have a 5F normal in 2P, it's pretty weak in terms of hitbox and active frames, and 2K will even duck it! So here's your chance to pull out all the stops. Almost any frametrap that Axl can do will work on Eddie, as well some of the more longshot blockstrings (5K, 5H, 2D, Rensen comes to mind). Try to build guardbar if you can (Any jumping normal besides P builds 10, with 10 per hit on j.S, hardslashes build a ton, two-hit pokes build a ton, 5P fuzzy-guards, so don't worry if he tries to duck the second hit, and Kokuugeki FRC stuff builds a ton), mix him up with high-low-throw-crossup-unblockable-feint stuff, and just generally stay on him like alcohol on Mr. Mamation. With Eddie's terrible defense, guts, and a little guardbar, you can completely rape his lifebar like he rapes yours and everyone else's! 6H is an unusually good tool against Eddie, for use as a meaty, guardbar builder, and general overhead. It goes over several of Eddie's key pokes, and is difficult to beat on reaction for a character with nothing fast or invincible enough to really do so. Pros: -Extremely good AA can decently neutralize Eddie's powerful air game. -A few nonsense hitboxes work to Axl's advantage (2K goes under a ton of shit, Dizzy animation can't be IK'd, narrow standing hitbox makes 5K-->5S not combo, etc.) -Once he gets momentum, Axl can make it very difficult for Eddie to get out of lockdown. -Axl has the damage/guardbar output to kill Eddie very quickly. -Getting rid of little eddie is slightly easier with tools like long range pokes and 2F startup on Housoubako. Cons: -lol unblockables -lol full stun combos -lol Mawaru blockstrings -lol tick-commandgrab -Basically all the reasons Eddie is good apply to Axl (with the possible exception of air-to-ground superiority) My opinion: 4.5-5.5, Slight advantage for Eddie. This matchup can go either way very quickly and easily, and it's certainly not Eddie's easiest or Axl's worst, however, the advantage is probably still his, for all the same reasons he rapes so many other characters. Special thanks: Teyah for reminding me about 6H So... feel free to discuss anything else about this matchup here. If something I or someone else here comes up with seems noteworthy enough, I'll add it to this first post.

That's when you go for empty rensen FRC --> Mad punish. Rensen FRC is early enough that I can't think of anything slayer can do fast enough that you can't block/beat.

Aye, that's what I meant. Figured it was either flashy or some kind of spacing thing. Come to think of it... I wonder if Benten or Housou will fuck that up. Wish we had a bridget over here in the NW...

Cool CM! I just have one question: Since they're unblockables, do the double crossups on the sliding bear + j.D setups serve some purpose, or are they strictly flashy?

Eh, got a little greedy, trying to go for damage. Eheh. Yeah, a lot of wacky execution errors there. Like I said, scrubby. Especially the one at 10:18, which I think was just mistiming the airdash so badly that it didn't come out. Tenhouseki is stupid and risky and barely does any damage even if you get the followup combo. It's almost 100% useless and you shouldn't rely on it as AA especially. Yeah, but with BDCing and all his invincible/movement stuff (BBU, Dandy, DoT), Slayer has a lot of ways to punish you for poking, very hard. Meanwhile, I seemed to be having a problem AAing j.H, which is part of why I was trying so much weird shit like Benten, 5H, and TK FB as AA. Anyway, I disagree that this matchup should be played defensively, as Slayer isn't lacking in options to get in, and keeping him locked down is better than getting in a guessing game for large chunks of your life, which Slayer does very well at mid range. Yeah, I'd usually go for 6K, dunno why I went for 5P Portland mindgames! Thanks muchly.

Or you know... jump, or even *gasp* block! Are you sure it beats 6H in every circumstance, because I could have sworn that wasn't true.

Er... Don't you mean "Kieru?"

Alright, so... http://www.booyagames.com/tournament/vids/ Random Select Winter Showdown. Featuring me being a scrub in the GG grand finals! But I still win. A few random notes: -Any tenhouseki in this match was a crossed up housoubako. Never do Tenhouseki ever. -AAing Slayer is really hard. Fuck j.H. -2H FRC + 6 matches of psychological conditioning = Awesome.

Eh. Since you have to land after the FRC, they have ample time to jump.

Yeah, 3P is a pretty universally good move to use. The only problem is slayer's relatively short airdash, which makes it easier for him to punish it if he jumps it. But it's a great tool for beating Mappa, BBU, and Dandy steps.

Nah, there's a section on the FRC too.