Lord Knight

!!! she's back! EDIT: the crossing 2C refers to the j2D combo right? EDITEDIT: nevermind, can't read

I thought she'd be easy to play, but I didn't get good with her for about a month and a half.

I made one after NEC last year, but never got around to posting it, didn't think it was the time. It also doesn't align with the community list.

cant we just play gg or something edit: wow dp the frog dash throw was pretty gdlk lollllllll i know the truth is alan wants to dp forward exe beast

On Jin 6B discussion - this move is still a top class move when used properly imo there's just a reason you don't see things like 6C > 6B or 5C > 6B often, for the above reasons but when used in a way to beat throws, it's excellent getting CH against a whiffed throw or being +4 on barrier block (os throw tech) is pretty good imo!

That stuff isn't that bad. It's the stuff like the xx > sj2C > jD > airdash j236D/jD stuff that are practically unseeable Jin's gimmick/trick level is high, and he gets good damage off them.

As far as I know, outside of the Makoto one I also listed, that's pretty much it. Litchi's you can't burst because hers is a projectile. Baiting burst after 3C is a legit tactic if he has 50 meter, that leads into way too much damage, it's a good place to burst. Early in CS, I used to burst bait a lot, but to be honest it's not worth it to me. In my case, Litchi's damage was so high, that I was missing out on a ton of implied damage when I held itsuu stance for too long. It's better to try to see if you have burstsafe routes. For example, CS1 Hazama has jDrive CH > flying in > [1] (burst safe) > 5C > 3C > (1) > Jyayoku etc. It's much better to not give up the implied damage imo, especially if it's someone you've never played before. I've played Tagers who hit me with 2C FC and just try to bait my burst after when I have 90% health left - too much yomi, too much variance for me.

I hate to sound cheesy, but if you really think using a burst can change your momentum and help you win, you should do it. People who hold their burst till the end will be real sad come CS2.

Nice! I was wondering when someone would bring this up. To be honest, a lot of people don't really know how to burst well - though it's hard for me to say explicitly HOW to burst, there are a couple of general applications. I feel like you actually covered most of the prime usage of bursts in your post: A) Obviously, combo breaker B) Regaining momentum In addition it can be used for - C) Breaking out of pressure D) Situational escapes And gold bursting can be used for E) Reversals F) Escaping certain setups I find it really surprising when people don't burst sometimes - most commonly when they have a chance to win the match, but they simply choose to have the 2 bursts at the end of the round (of course, there are other examples). As far as what your talking about, using burst to punish, there are very few that are useful. You can also burst Makoto dp if she uses it as an ender, but only on the ground (so, never). Much more useful is spots in characters combos, where you are guaranteed to escape, like bursting Jyayoku startup (assuming they go the general best route of 3c > Jyayoku). I could try to write a list, but it'd be pretty long, and it should be obvious where not to burst (for the most part).

Translating the post in order to clear up any confusion. ----- Litchi - Slight disadvantage against Bang, even with Tao. She could still get stronger, and your opponent needs a lot of info on Litchi to win, so she's top. Tao - No explanation needed. Strongest neutral game, good damage off all hits, an lays the weaker characters to waste with ease. Bang - Offense, defense, neutral, and comeback factor are all at a high level - there are virtually no flaws. Has a big disadvantage against Tao. It's hard for him to compare with the top two characters. Arakune - "One Chance Man". Can turn around any match until the last second - it's never over until it's over. Random beam or gold burst is pretty much is the end of the round. Carl - He's strong, but Litchi, Tao, Arakune and Bang are ridiculous in comparison. Jin - Does well against Tao and Litchi, and has even been doing well against Bang lately. High health, and multiple shoryu's that deal with a wide variety of situations. In addition, his mixup is strong, and all his jump attacks are useful in a variety of situations - they are simple to use and strong. His uses for meter are varied and all useful, and the benefits of using meter to add damage are nice. His drive is quite useful as well. Hakumen - troll character Hazama - Damage is not high enough (off all random hits). Okizeme is overall weak. I'm not sure about vs Bang, but Litchi and Tao beat him pretty solidly. Lambda - "Matchup information" - this is extremely important for this character. Limit on her reversal and uses for meter aren't good enough. Doesn't stand a change against Litchi, Tao or Bang. Ragna - Overall strength is all right, the power of wakeup dp is great and his okizeme is solid. . . . but to be honest, there's not much variance in his attack pattern - the more you see it, the better you'll be able to deal with it. Bottom 4 don't really matter. They are good but all flawed in some way.

I used to really hate Carl (like a lot). Now he's tolerable (some matchups vs him are actually fun).

Don't read too much into it! Troll success!

Characters with good neutral games are those who not only do a lot of damage at random hits, but do a good job at controlling options when not in pressure. Characters aren't ordered in any specific way. Top class: Tao, Litchi Excellent: Bang, Carl, Arakune, Hazama, Valk, Mu, Lambda Great: Hakumen, Ragna, Jin, Makoto, Rachel Good: Noel, Tsubaki, Tager Fucking lame: Carl Carl Carl Carl Carl No character in this game is particularly bad in neutral, it's just that some characters are absolutely ridiculous.

I rank her at A+. Her max damage is big, her abare is a bit weak unless you're fishing for it. Her midscreen damage isn't too good, corner damage, ukemi and okizeme are all good. Weak against characters that play neutral well (but her damage makes up for it). Despite this, I don't think she's even close to CS1 Litchi, lol

More or less. It's a bit interesting to see that even though Ragna is in a more or less average position, he's still a relatively strong character. It tells a lot about the cast's overall strength this time.

I want to get into this further. This is something I see in some midlevel players. Don't waste time trying to over-complicate the game. Not thinking at all is obviously a bad idea, over-thinking will just lose to randomness. As far as dealing with what options you want at your disposal, just keep it in the framework of your matchup strategy. There's no need to use some obscure option if it's not necessary (for example, Litchi can hop lows with 4D - but how often do you see this?). Play their character first (as in, apply matchup strategy), then play the player (if they know proper responses to your strategy).

You can do most of these in CS1 CS1 j2B loop - staff needs to be slightly out of the corner - 5C (FC) > Haku > hatsu > riichiA > ippatsuA > tanki hatsu > (land > hatsu > riichiA > J2B) X2 > land > hatsu > riichiA > j2C > 5C > 2D > JC > Staff2 > dash 2c > ItsuuA > 6Kote > 5C > 2D > jC > barrier > 2C > itsuuA > 4kote > 3C > 2D > 6C > 6D > Daisharin (339399) > hatsu chun hatsu hatsu > last hit of daisharin > kokushi

the problem is the punish you can get for using normally safe moves some chars can deal with this, others cant

Unfortunately there's not much I can say about this. You've got to work so hard to win with Tsubaki with only meager rewards. Normally I do tell people to just switch characters until CS2 if they play the bottom 4. Really I all I can say is buff your neutral as much as you can, get clean pressure, and come up with as many ways to hit with 22[d] as possible. Manage your meter well and try to segment your matches between games you can just play (since they can't zone you hard), and matches where you have to sit/be patient (but normally have more time to charge).

Right now 6B[m] CH (midscreen) > glide throw > 5B > 2C > tsubame > 5B > 6C > kote > JBCB loop Thanks to the proration numbers, some new combos came out: Corner - 5B > 2C > 6D > Hatsu > RiichiA > RiichiA > Ippatsu > Tanki Hatsu > land > Hatsu > RiichiA > J2B > jHatsu > Haku > Chun > 5B > 6C(1) > 4Kote > jBCB > dj JBCD > falling jC > 6C(2) 4426 damage. Corner/near corner 6B[m] ch 6B CH > 4D > 6Kote > Haku > Hatsu > RiichiA > IppatsuA > Tanki Hatsu > Hatsu > RiichiA > J2B > Air Hatsu > Haku > Chun > 5B > jBCB > land > 6C(1) > 4Kote > jBCB > dj jBCD > falling jC > 6C(2) Approx 6000 damage. 6B CH > Double gold burst > 4D > 6Kote > Haku > Hatsu > RiichiA > IppatsuA > Tanki Hatsu > Hatsu > RiichiA > j2B > Air Hatsu > Haku > Chun > 5B > jBCB > land > 6C(1) > 4Kote > jBCB > dj jBCD > falling jC > 6C(1) > Daisharin (939999) > Air hatsu > Kokushi Damage "not less than 8500"

For comparison's sake, this is Chou's list: SS: Tao Litchi S: Bang A: Arakune B: Carl, Jin, Hakumen C: Hazama, Lambda, Ragna ---From this point, character potential is limited--- D: Noel E: Rachel F: Tsubaki Tager Original post (he explains his ranking, but I'm not in the mood to translate it all): http://jbbs.livedoor.jp/bbs/read.cgi/game/48579/1284887157/321 Generally anyone who thinks Tao is S tier thinks that her neutral game is so good that it makes up for her low health/primers.

It's the last community list.