Loli-Zero

I don't have anything recorded. But I played a bunch on PJS winning stream last night so maybe im floating in the archives as Mori-Zero. By the way, if you're figuring out setplay timings make sure you look at the frame data for face up and face down wake ups on the dustloop wiki. You'll have to make adjustments for some characters. Also combo into 2D might let you meaty on characters with extra long face down times, so that's good Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Dude this is guilty gear. You get meter for sneezing, and meter = combos with oki. I played last night on netplay for a long time. Anytime I played someone new, I would try to play footsies into a knockdown, do small reward mixups or pressure until I got throw or Mappa with 50 meter stacked, and then did throw bait it's late. Usually it CH and then I would win off that. If you do it a few times with no counter hit, or your playing offline and you know your opponent's habits you can start mixing it up. I also played a friend last night, who blocked high and rarely went for throw. So I just went low everytime and he got blown up over and over. Eventually he started blocking low sometimes, and even threw me once. So I started mixing in the other 2 options and he was screwed. I won any match I could get a solid knockdown on, if I didn't drop my combos cause of netplay. What you don't realize is few characters have setplay that are any better then this. Zato certainly does, but he's really hard to play or even just execute neutral/combos with at a high level. Milia does but she suffers in neutral as a price. If you are having trouble with the CH timing just do whiff under pressure into BDC Mappa. But I dunno man, I won a round last night off of CH IL D-Step CWH 6HS PB RC 6HS PB and was pretty happy I learned the setplay. And speaking of Hase... I've seen him do this setplay and then YRC after the whiffed under pressure and then go low. The YRC eats their inputs, making you safe from throws and then you get a free low mixup. Not something you want to do all the time, but good to sprinkle in if you are worried about throws but want to do mixups too Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Okay. I finally had time to test this out. Your math is spot on, but it's not as troubling as it sounds. Here's what I did. I went into training mode with slayer vs slayer. Then I recorded a sequence in each of the 3 training slots. Each sequence began with the following combo: Throw RC 5HS j.S(1) j.HS delay j.D j.2K j.K JC j.S(1) j.HS j.D. Then, upon landing, each recording had a variation of timing for the following inputs: p-dandy under pressure (whiff) it's late 2K K Mappa. For the first slot I did the dandy step as soon as possible, and then canceled into its late as soon as possible. When I played it back, it successfully meatied me and connected the 2K. Then I practiced throwing it. Here is the deal: on wake up throws are 0 frames, and can therefore throw meaties. Also, as yuhoke has noted, once the active frames for its late have started it is no longer throw invuln. However, once the active hitbox has connected with the character, you cannot throw as you are in blockstun. Therefore, it is throwable, but only with just frame timing. I tried mashing throw, and while I never got counter hit I never got throw even once. Then I tried timing it. At first I was getting it about 50% of the time, but then once the timing was in my head I got it consistently. For the second slot I continued to do under pressure asap but delayed the cancel into it's late as much as I could. This caused the 2K to not combo, but the setup remained throwable. This was likely early in the active frames or on the frame before the active frames, and is an example of a failed setup. The results of trying to throw it were the same as slot 1. For the third slot, in addition to delaying the it's late cancel as much as possible, I also added a very brief pause between landing and inputting dandy step. This resulted in the 2K not comboing (duh), and it's late counter hitting throws effectively. In theory, this setup has one frame where it is throwable, but you have to delay the throw a few frames after you have already woken up and there is no timing limit to brush up against (where as in setup one throwing on the first available frame is how you successfully throw). When trying to wait and throw I did not succeed once. I only got counter hit, or occasionally did it too late and was forced to block. Finally, I set the playback on random, and tried to throw the cycling setups. I did not succeed once (though sometimes I blocked). In conclusion, this means going for the meaty is throwable but it is difficult. Bad players who mash will not successfully do it. Good players can try but if they fail they have to block hi (or low if you did meaty 2K). Even if someone can consistently do this, they have to commit to the throw press before they see if there is a gap or not, and if you did a throw bait setup instead, they will be CH hit out of startup of 5HS or 6HS (or 5S if they are using the 6S+HS option select). The timing for the two options will likely vary depending on what ender you use. Don't forget, you cannot do the setup early enough to get a comboable meaty it's late off of combos ending in 2D (however 2D from far away gives you enough frames if it hits late in its active frames). Also, players can attempt to back dash or jump block the throw bait setup, but if you did a meaty they get hit. If you do the throw bait right there is not enough room for anyone to mash a 5 frame normal, and maybe not even reversals depending on how quick the startup is. You can get MASSIVE damage off of CH it's late. If you buffer a P dandy step ahead of time you can confirm into CWH on CH (and then do a CWH loop on most characters) or do under pressure/nothing if they blocked or got a normal hit. If you happen to get blocked, you are +1 unless they instant blocked, so that is not so bad either. This is a good character. If you are a smart player, and take the time to understand how people think on defense, and why mixups work you can open people up like they are a can of beans. Happy throw baiting, kids. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

http://horibuna.web.fc2.com/GGXrd/ http://keeponrock.in/match/search_form#content Taka is probably the best active XRD player that you can regularly find footage of. Adam is also quite good. If you can ever find footage of Kubo or En watch it. They are old Slayer Gods, but don't play much XRD (at least on stream). Zato is probably Slayer's worst matchup in this game. Zato got more tools to help the matchup and Slayer lost some of his most important ones (BDC 1 frame jump and j.HS CH ground bounce). In this matchup you have to take big risks. K mappa when you see an opening, especially if you have meter. Long dash if there are holes in his neutral patterns. IAD footloose YRC to get in safely. 2P Shadow Eddie when you can. If you can instant block 2S, iad j.S or long dash throw to stop drill blockstrings. Learn to antiair Zato's fly with CH 5P into 6HS Pilebunker/CWH. This is really, really important. Eddie's instant fly j.K is still good, but not as broken as it was in reload, so you have more opportunities to do this. 6P can be good in this matchup too. Most importantly, if you get in, you have to bait Zato's burst and kill him. Don't drop your combos and convert for max damage or strong oki. Don't letup, he has bad defensive options (watch out for reversal super though). If he gets out of your pressure, or bursts you, you may not get another chance to kill him. Play smart, and be unpredictable but controlled and you can win.

1. If you're talking about mixups, go for a whiffed under pressure into its late, 2K, dash through c.S, or bite. If you just want to force your opponent to block, c.S or 5K canceled into 6HS-dandy step is good. Also meaty 5HS into dandy or 2HS are good options. If you expect a DP or mash you can dandy away and YRC, then respond to what they did. Also meaty 2D or 6K have their place. 2. I assume you mean on block. Under pressure is 0 on block, which means you have good options unless you are instant blocked. If you're getting instant blocked you are probably using it too much, and should mixup with empty dandy steps into throw/bite or dash throughs. Slayer's 2K is 6 frames, so you shouldn't get mashed out unless your opponent is using a 5 frame jab. If that's the case, try mixing in another dandy step instead of pressing a button, then respond to what they did with one of the follow ups, or even YRC Mappa to catch 2Ps. Your other best options are probably BDC bite or BDC mappa. Both of these tools are really important if you want to blow up mashing and condition opponents to block allowing you to return to mixups. 3. Potemkin is always a difficult matchup. Usually the matchup leans in slayers favor at a high level, but only if you are specifically playing the matchup and abandoning most of slayers normal play style. Potemkin has big health/guts stats and is much harder to kill then most characters. This means slayers strength of big damage is less relevant. However, pot himself does huge damage. There is no way around this, other then making sure you know max damage combos to finish out a round. If you leave Pot with a pixel he will probably kill you. Potemkin gives slayer's neutral game many problems. His large normals beat many of yours. Slide head knocks you out of dandy steps and other ground movement. Pot buster can grab you out of ground approaches and 6HS. Hammer fall absorbs slayers big hit normals and then punishes him. To respond to these things, be careful with your movement options. Dandy step sparingly, especially if you have no meter for YRC. Bait hammerfalls, but keep an eye on his meter. Look for oppurtunities to 2HS slide head. 2Hs is low invuln so you will CH him. This is more difficult because 2Hs has smaller range, but should still be important. Try and stay airborne more often then you normally would, but be smart about your approaches because Potemkin has strong AA's. Footloose and j.S are good jumpins because the multi hit property will stop hammerfalls. Abuse 6P in neutral. It has a strong horizontal range, has invincibility above your knees, and will CH potemkins long reaching normals. 5HS outside of his poke range is a good move as well. You can follow up with pilebunker on CH. Pot buster is 3 frame startup. This use to punish k Mappa on hit. K Mappa is -2 on hit now though, so you can use it more then you would (just rarely do anything offensive afterwards). Pot can backdash pot buster to blowup most of slayers oki. To counter this you should abuse BDC Mappa, p dandy step CWH, or things like late sweep. Find what works best for you, but you have to respect and punish his backdash or you will consistently lose to scrubby potemkins. It's late is strong against Potemkin because it has throw invuln on startup. There is one frame where it is throwable before the active frames, but it's difficult to expoit that gap if you are defending against slayer. CH leads to big damage. There's more to the matchup then those things, but hopefully that gives you some things to start thinking about. 4. Blockstrings into K Mappa will be -2 unless they instant block. If they instant block you are screwed. If they don't, your best bet is BDC P Mappa to counter mashing. Try and condition your opponents with this before you attempt post Mappa offense. CH Mappa combos into DOT or 5K K Mappa RC combos, so you should be able to punish people hard for just mashing. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I thought I was getting punished with a 5 frame normal when I played last night, but maybe I was trying to do something. Either way, if you get IBed on K mappa don't try and do anything. Edit: instant block takes away 3 frames, so k mappa should be punishable by anyone with a 5 frame jab on instant block Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

First of all, when I say baiting throws I mean forcing them to throw out 5HS/6HS because you are unthrowable and scoring a free counter hit because heavy moves have long startup. So if you're getting hit you're not baiting with the right stuff. In regards to Mappa, if it's instant blocked you are getting punished (K Mappa). If it's not instant block you can't press any buttons, but BDC Mappa is a decent option. If it's on hit you can hit 2P to stop some mashing. Anything that beats you still will get CH by BDC Mappa. Learn BDC Mappa. Despite the invuln nerf it's still incredibly useful. Also dandy step is good after Mappa on hit. You can BDC cancel it if you're getting hit out of startup (this will depend on how close you are I think.) In regards to BDC bite the optimal short cut is 6321447 HS. To practice it start by learning the timing to dash backwards after a Mappa on hit. Then try and had the other inputs before the backdash. Then just add the 7 motion at the end right before you hit HS Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Throwing is a huge part of this game. If you are next to someone on their wakeup, you are getting thrown. If you use the setups for oki we've been talking about off of j.D or 2D you can bait throws with its late. When you jump in on someone you will get thrown if you land next to them. Try spacing your jump ins differently or using j.S(1) j.K for jump-ins. IAD j.HS will get you thrown if the spacing is wrong. In general, slayers offense is all about baiting throws with its late, 6K, BDC Mappa, etc. after opponents are scared to mash throw you can throw them or do better mixups based on the situation. Hope that helps Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well, if you're doing oki right under pressure will whiff. But yeah, I'd recommend defaulting to its late for oki until you've read your opponents habits. Also, if you have a long air combo and you notice they fell away from you, you can usually space it so you are out of throw range. Then you can just go ham and mix up however you want Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You should be canceling the first hit of j.S. If you're hitting j.HS but it's not coming out that means you hit it too early. For the other problem I would try delaying the initial j.D a little. This is what you want to do on most combos to ensure they float higher for additional hits (unless the character is light already). Also, I would practice the combo with 5HS in stead of c.S f.S. I'm pretty sure it's better damage and it should work on everyone but Potemkin IIRC. You might need to do j.P j.K after the j.2K though I can't remember. If no one beats me to it I will try and compile a list of bnbs Saturday or Sunday. We've covered most of it in the last 3 or 4 pages but it'd be nice to have it located in one thread for reference. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Throws are 1 frame startup so you can get thrown, yeah it's like ST. A lot of times that oki is used at a range where throws will not connect. When it's not, you have to use its late to bait throws. But it's late has one frame where it is throwable, so depending on how air tight your setup is you can still get thrown with just frame timing. Nereus, your just not getting the jump cancel. You do not have to install that combo. However, if you're too low to the ground for j.P j.K you will land before a jump cancel can come out and it will feel like you had no jump. That's my best guess without seeing what you're doing. Jump installs are only necessary for slayer when he is doing a super jump combo after c.S f.S or 2P 2S and you want a second jump. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Nice stuff! Thanks for doing all that testing. I feel like the first combo works on more cast members with small variations. I know you can do that combo on Sol if you delay the first j.D a hair for 161. Also, if I'm ever worried about my execution or can't remember character specific stuff I just do 5HS sj.K j.S(1) j.HS j.D. This should be pretty universal and does 147 on Sol. You get oki too. For corner combos you can also do the dust route into c.S 6HS P-Step CWH c.S sj.S(1) j.HS j.D for 165 on sol. That dust route works on everyone I think. Only a few more then the first one you listed but you get slightly better oki off of j.D because you can still do meaty it's late setups. The throw combos look really solid. That's the route I've been using, so I'm excited to try out your enders so I don't have to find them all myself. I do the same 5D(9) combo. I haven't found anything better yet. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You don't have have to jump install for that combo unless you're super jumping? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I keep seeing Slayer's confirm off Helter Skelter with a j.HS that's slightly delayed. It's low enough that you don't need to cancel into j.D to link 2K and it's early enough that it still links off the Helter Skelter hit. I've even seen it on characters that I thought you couldn't get any confirm on. I think I need to relab this. I imagine if this confirm works on everyone it also probably leaves you low enough that j.HS will whiff on counter hit allowing a proper confirm. If that's the case HS would be a lot more practical.

It's a round closing gimmick. If you watch Taka slayer he'll finish rounds with pilebunker RC undertow pretty often. This is just a guaranteed version of that gimmick that is harder to set up. Mess around with it and see if you can add it to your arsenal. Any good slayer has a deep bag of gimmicks to pull from. It is one or two frames I believe, but its easy to time because of the visual. It doesn't feel any harder then any of his FRC's from older games. Also, I forgot to test instant block DP. I'm pretty sure they can't even leave the ground so DP's shouldn't have time to start up, but I will double check tomorrow.

Maybe you can YRC you're falling J.Hs before it connects in a CH situation. Probably too fast to react but that would be interesting. One thing I did find for helter skelter is that if you roman cancel it on block during the frames where he's touching the ground, he will be grounded and you can get a guaranteed undertow. Even on instant block they can't move or press buttons, so burst and DA are the only ways they can get out. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What's the damage like on the 2hit DHD ones? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Did testing on combo routes from c.S today. 2.K c.S-f.S and c.S-f.S c.S-f.S can combo into j.D 214214S on Bedman, Eddie, Ramlethal, and Sol 2.K c.S and c.S-f.S c.S can combo into j.D 214214S on I-No, Ky, and Potemkin c.S-f.S can combo into j.D 214214S on Axl, Chipp, Elphelt, Milia, Sin, Slayer, and Venom The j.D route does not work at all on Faust or May, and only works on standing opponents in all cases. If you end the combo with c.S-2.D the damage is almost identical to Mappa RC routes, and gives you a worse oki situation then a J.D ender. However, if you end with c.S-f.S 5K-K Mappa the damage is usually around 20 higher. So the route should really only be used to squeeze out extra damage without additional meter usage. In all other cases, its best to just do c.S-f.S c.S-f.S 5K-KMappa RC K-Dandy CWH 5HS j.S-j.HS-j.D and take the okizeme. In cases where you want to frontload damage to avoid bursting just cancel 4xS into DOT for about 20-30 damage less then the Mappa RC ender.

Yeah man. If you have any questions about when to use what normals and what not just ask. I played accent core too and you could just spam 2HS, 2D, and 5K like a moron and have "good footsies". All of his normals are still solid, they just have specific purposes. If you need crutch buttons while you figure out what's going on just hit 6hs and c.S a lot at their respective ranges. (And buffer 6hs into dandy so you can combo off CH or air hit and go into pressure if they block) Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Did you play reload villainous? Most of the things you're talking about he didn't have until accent core, but he was A tier in reload. This game is way closer to reload then accent core. If you compare to reload there are still big things he lost that present challenges to people wanting to play him, but most of them aren't the things you are describing. In other words, players coming from solely accent core need to change up their style entirely anyway, but not everything involved in that process is negative. He's a much different character. In reload/XRd slayer is a heavily fundamentals/footsie based characters with strong defensive options. You murder people for sloppy play and wanting to get out. On offense you're goal is guard crank your opponent with frame traps that score huge CH damage, and then set up greedier mixups if an opponent refuses to press a button. For any player coming from accent core I would recommend watching footage or reading guides from reload as a starting point. There are tricks and gimmicks you can apply from accent core here and there but you shouldn't use that version of slayer to inform the foundation of your gameplay. Aaaand he still does massive damage if you have meter available. I checked today, and 4xS j.D 214214S c.S f.S 5K-K Mappa does 230 with 0 guard crank. Im not sure what the average damage is in this game yet, but that's ridiculous damage off a left/right mixup. Similarly I'm getting 200+ damage off of AA confirms for 50 meter. I don't think many other characters can get that off of accessible AA tools Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah. What those guys said. 2HS still good because it crushes lows, you can't spam it in footsies like AC, but you have other buttons for that. 6P is so good. 5P CH 6HS is still incredible. It's day 6. If people want to play an easy character to produce results they can always play Faust or Milia. Few Japanese rep Slayer because most of the Slayer Gods don't play these days, and nobody wants to spend 20 100 yen coins a day trying to figure out tech for a character that rewards strong fundamentals when they could pick faust and spam f.S-item throw. We have training mode now. There's a lot of potential tech out there we just have to find it. In regards to things he got, other then the combo stuff I already posted about, long dash is reaaaaaaalllly good. If you're not sure why, you should play around with it more. One of the best things he got though is easily IAD footloose YRC. If you can get the timing perfect this becomes a full screen jump. It's so good in matchups like Faust and Eddie. Also the instant j.D 214214S combos that he can do on standing opponents do hemma damage. You can follow up with c.s-2D for a knockdown. For 50 meter its his highest damage confirm off of c.S or 2K and gives you knockdown. I don't combo into DOT or 6HS-Pile anymore (unless youve got tons of guard crank) because his new combo options are so much better.

It's late won't hit meaty off 2D if you combo into it. So you can't link 2K. You do get meaty its late if you hit someone with sweep in neutral though. But even when you combo into 2D, you still have a strong hit, throw, dash through mixup off that setup. And you can still use its late as a throw bait and combo if it counter hits. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Hit throw and left right is probably all your getting meterless. Off of whiffed 214P-S setplay you can go for hi lows by mixing up its late and 2K or 2HS. Otherwise you can spend meter on a roman cancel for 6K. 6K is more of a throw bait now Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Exactly. If they look low or you're nervous about the situation you can just do a normal CWH combo. If you get into the second dandy step, and your nervous about executing CWH-5S-j.k-j.D you can just pilebunker. But overall the damage is so good I really think it should be a BNB in any situation it works Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I did it multiple times off different starters in a set with my buddy Saturday night. So yeah. It got a lot easier because most of starters I posted involve RC and RC adds time slow and untech time. But even the non RC seem easy so I dunno. Something else might of changed. Once you've got the combo down, you can basically notice anytime you hit an enemy with CWH in a combo at the right height. I actually found a few of the routes I posted while playing. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk