Exciel

She's certainly better than before. Even if 10 months from now she's ranked the worst character it wouldn't mean the same thing it did in CSEX. Don't worry about it too much. As a side note Arcadia tier lists are hardly any more legit than ones you can find on jbbs.

So if Makoto is good she's braindead and if she sucks Ragna's braindead.

Hey this character looks good which means I probably won't ditch her ʅ(･‿･`)ʃ Compilation of unorganized shit I've been observing from matches and streams so I could be wrong on stuff. 5B - Recovery might be quicker again but this is purely based on sight. 3C - Also looks faster to me in total. Invincibility windows and properties may have been altered as well, was actually able to duck under Amane's 5B. 2D - Seems impossible to follow up level 3 with 2C unless it's against a high airborne opponent, due to increased gravity? j.B - CH still long untechable time. 623C/j.623C (Corona) - Probably have SMP but they aren't shared between ground/air versions. Either that or only the air version has SMP. Also j.623C might have invincibility now as I saw an opponent burst as Makoto was ending a combo and it went through corona. Actually sort of an indirect nerf to bursts as a result of being quicker since I've seen this happen unintentionally against Hakumen and Carl's slides as well. 236D (Star) - Level 3 connects from 6C which is really nice. Wallsticks in corner even on level 2. 214A (A Vision) - I swear to god I saw Ragna or someone 5B and it went through Makoto but I might just be tripping. If it does have some sort of strike invincibility that'd be hilarious. 214A~B (Eclipse) - Faster? What people seem to be saying. 214A~C (Lunatic) - I believe this has SMP for whatever reason. I wasn't really expecting it but I saw Makoto do an RC combo with it and the second time he did it the opponent flashed blue, I THINK. 214B/C~D (Arrow) - Still sucks. Was beat by Bullet's 5A, which looks like a good anti-air in general anyway. 214A~D (Cosmic) - Travels really far distance quickly. Might be fun against keepaway characters. On block seems to be safe enough and pushes the opponent a considerable distance even. 214A~C~D (Lander) - The timing for level 3 in particular looks kind of tight and it seems hard to place it in combos. 46 (Parry) - It's still there. That's about it OD - Obviously Makoto's drives become level G allowing for silly combos. Otherwise level G moves may have better frame data than level 3s. Level G 5D spam is legit. If you do Particle Flare just before OD ends all 3 hits will still count as OD version (which also means you don't have to time anything!)

rip squirrel

Her JP voice actress is actually still Tomomi Isomura, the rest of the JP BB cast should be unchanged as well. source From a guy who played 1st location test twice: I don't know how to translate the descriptions for the new moves well so I'll only attempt the changes to old moves. 4Throw - can't be followed up with 2B. 3C - untechable knockdown time decreased. Can't link into 2D L3. 5D - untechable time increased. Enough time to link dash 2C after a whiffed jab(?). 236D (Shooting Star) - Level 3 still wallsticks. 2C>Sh.Star>6A>2D L3>j.B>j.D L3 works 214A~C~B (Star Gazer) - Start up slowed. Can't link on a crouching opponent from Lunatic Upper (214A~C). 2DL3 - vector was changed so that 2C no longer links from 2D L3. 5B and 5CC are still ok. 236236D (Partical Flare) - Similar change for PF. Doesn't feel like you can follow up with 2D L3 after two hits. 46 (Parry) - Parry hit (not to be confused w/ Space Counter) staggers backwards(?).

Big Bang Smash combos look mad fun. Very nice.

He got like 2 or 3 buffs that matter making him S tier in CSEX. I don't see how he wasn't already really good other than being outclassed by better characters who would all be S tier or higher in CSEX.

I assume for the furthest corner push the highest 6A BBS is required though, especially to link to 5D. 6A doing a reverse hit gives even more untechable time on BBS so that's something to keep in mind, now that BBS has more recovery too. Uhh.. that'd be quite a statement to make since CS2 Ragna was already really good. I think CSEX Makoto has to rely on too many gimmicks and resets to win or just the opponent defending poorly. But she definitely isn't unusable.

Eh, after seeing what Makotos can do as of late I don't care too much. As long as I can dash in 2A then I'd rather use her than any other character. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=70ZF2TioujI#t=321s Midscreen BBS combo is pretty sick, may replace PF for meter-to-corner combo. Not sure how many chances you'll get to though if it requires real precise positioning.

If you can, check if j.2C (blocked) 5A (pseudo-fuzzy) is guaranteed or if there's too much landing recovery on j.2C now.

>I can't remember the changes in CS:E properly, can you still follow up 214ACCCCC in the corner? Nope. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWTQjqxRKfk http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ps_LQWw9KHU Rest of that Makoto, he's really good actually but has some pretty crappy opponents as well, like that Noel who thought pressing buttons on 6B > orb was a good idea. Some forms of orb oki should still work especially on bad reversal characters but a safe corona ender might be better often just for the sake of damage. I wish Eclipse Turn could cross up in the corner or at least have one move that still wallbounds so you could do (facing away from corner) ...6C > PFx2 > 2DLv3 > j.DLv3 > etc. back into the corner set ups.

Watch out you'll make them put repeat proration on j.2C Are you on east coast Omni? I'd like to play you but this is unfortunately not a character that goes well with distance lag.

Well here's more nerfs from jbbs. Feel free to proofread my translations, sorry I ignored you last time hakimiru I never check PMs. （ ￣з￣） New stuff in bold. Nerf List -Dash initial velocity down -4Throw recovery increased -Air throw cannot follow up without meter -5B recovery increased, CH5B dash 2A doesn't link -5C > 5CC delay window decreased -6B start up to 22f, can only link from 5CC on crouch hit, doesn't force crouch, attack level lower, still links to Lunatic Upper and 5DLv3 -2C same move prorate at 70% -3C invincibility near the end is removed* -5DLv3 has less untechable time -2DLv1 and 2DLv3 count as the same move for same move proration -2DLv3 has less untechable time -j.B on counter hit floats opponent more, less untechable time* -j.2C hitbox weakened, landing recovery increased -j.D range nerfed so that the old reverse hit is impossible -236A Comet Cannon recovery increase, 236A~DLv3 doesn't wallbound -623C Corona Upper changed so that you can't pick it up off a counter hit or aerial hit -46 Parrying has counter hitbox, can only cancel into dash, can't use repeatedly -214B/C~D Lightning Arrow can't be followed up -214A~B Eclipse Turn recovery increase -214ACA Mars Chopper drive cancel removed -214ACB Star Gazer recovery increased (he's unsure) -214AD (and probably 214ACD) Shooting Star doesn't wallbound -632146D Big Bang Smash recovery increased -236236D Particle Flare Invincibility changed, something about the bar (I'm unsure about this one)* * for translations I wasn't too sure on. And take this with a grain of salt since it's from jbbs which isn't 100% reliable but odds are your character is suck.

I miss the old 10 frame start up and partially invincible BBS. Punishing shit randomly all day.

This seems to be true. Read it off jbbs early on so I had suspicions before but it seems to be pretty apparent now, Star Gazer is slower than before. It's to prevent ...5CC 214ACB 2A etc. standing combo.

For the record Space Parry isn't a reversal. As far as I know it starts up 2 frames after the 46 input to prevent it from being a frame 1 reversal. Edit: Man not being able to combo off the air throw is a real dick move. The clunky recovery is sad.

Uh every character in this game is like that unless you want to use like Arakune. If you let aesthetics get to you then I hope you're happy to hear Makoto's combos are still 10 seconds+ long in the corner. And what creative and deep mix ups? My Makoto certainly doesn't have any of that, she has a low, an overhead, a throw, and a command cross up. Guess what, none of them lead to any good damage or guaranteed okizeme that let her reset her mix up even with meter. But who cares, if you're doing mix ups midscreen you're not playing this game right. You're playing post-CS Blazblue, all you do is tag your opponent with a random hit into the corner and keep them there and now that Makoto can't do that without guarantees she sucks. Get outta here with the combo video comparison crap, first of all an interesting combo video has creative combos instead of optimal combos that you use in a real match, second of all you're playing a fighting game to win not to sugarcoat your opponents eyes with some dazzling and beautiful and creative combo. The amount of weak mentality on this forum is mindboggling, I'm not saying you have to be a top pro tournament player but honestly if it's 2011 and you still have a low tier warrior mindset you really need to consider your priorities for fighting games if you play competitively. CS2 Makoto was in no way broken it's just many other characters were just too weak, and even so, at high level play you still have a Tsubaki winning SBO and no Makoto's in top 4. /nerdrage That being said, it isn't that bad. Right now Makoto is considered to be the bottom character in the game but even so it isn't CS1 Rachel bad and as long as you have good fundamentals you can win. I even think it might be ironically laughably fun to be the most bottom tier character for a version of the game right after being the top most. It's just this character is undeniably boring now that she has no tools at all besides the most basic fundamentals of normals and commands that amusingly alone can make her better than CS1 Rachel. You might as well be playing a Tsubaki that can't charge, which is almost what they did to her in CSE and probably why she's consider the second worst character in the game right over Makoto currently.

Play this character now if you want a character with a 2A, an overhead, and a throw.

If you ask me, CS Makoto was the hype. 5D2 RC 236AA~D and double Lightning Arrow combos were mad fun. Techable knockdown, which if it still has repeat proration on both versions is pretty silly. Virtually useless now outside of gimmicky approaches and perhaps cross ups I guess. It's a shame they didn't turn Shooting Star into the slick pilebunker move I was hoping they would.

What you did there, I saw it. Anyway, character love can only take you so far. I'll still use this character because I don't have much of an interest in anyone else and I'd feel it was a waste for already putting so much work into her previously. Only thing is just ask yourself, what can Makoto do now that Ragna can't do better? And the answer is probably nothing besides get a 3k BnB off standing corner hit off 2A. But that doesn't really matter for Ragna as he builds meter like mad and has better combos off random hits. Besides ASW says standing BnBs are for nerds. Makoto's 2 worst nerfs are probably her removal of corner carrying options (seriously PF, 2D3, j.D3 is a combo wtf) and removal(?) of comet okizeme. The difference between Makoto and other offensive characters (although like every character is offensive now) is that Makoto only has combos in the corner while many (good) characters can do ok midscreen stuff off random hits or at least corner push. So what you have left is a pretty uninteresting dash in 2aaa mash character with little reward off of it. Hard to take this character seriously now but I'm sure with time she'll get somewhat better and probably won't be as bad as Taokaka. But if you think having midscreen-corner combos and okizeme is what makes a character 'retarded' then you have a really weak mindset and play too much Blazblue.

For the time being we're at the very bottom of the character ranks with Taokaka, Litchi, etc. Yes, Tager is considered stronger than us.

Gee Makoto players are a happy crew. She looks absolutely terrible to me, she lost everything. Same move prorate on all her moves means there's no room to find alternate corner combos to make up damage like CS2 Bang could. Barrier change makes pressuring harder. The fact that she could combo into an overhead was a huge scare factor and promoted high blocks. Midscreen -> corner ability no longer exists. Orb okizeme no longer exists. No more rewards off things like dp and parry. No reason to do PF combos if proration is worse and Makoto can't corner carry. Damage reduced all around, can't even combo off air throw, probably can't BBS 2 hits -> PF in corner anymore. etc. etc. etc. Of course this is only day 1 but it's not unlike ASW to do this （╯°□°）╯︵ ɹǝıʇ doʇ

stunedge wherefore are thou stunedge

I don't completely trust me translating but here's a summary so far. A series can only gatling up to 3 times 5B - counter hit > ? can't be followed?. Unsure, but I know lower hitbox extended, hits more characters OTG 6B - 2 frames slower, doesn't force crouch, combos from 5CC on crouch j.B - counter hit less untechable time? 2C - 70%? repeat prorate All Drives have repeat prorate regardless of levels 5D - untechable time decrease, can link 5B, 6A, 2B, immediate 2D, 214A~C, and fastest possible 2C 2D - untechable time decrease, can link j.D and barely link 2C j.D - untechable time increase, can link dash 2366A/2C 6B+C - special cancel. A astroid etc. j.B+C - can't follow up? CA - can't follow up on counter hit? 214B - jump distance increased, something about teching 214C - jump distance decrease, same as above 236A - recovery increase? 236A~D - wallbounds on counter hit, can follow up with 5B if close 623C - counter hit can't be followed up with 5A? Follow up delay window decrease Parry - Unsure, something about more recovery and dash cancelling Space Counter - weaker proration Shooting Star - Distance increase 214A~C - Untechable time increase 214A~C~A - Can't cancel to drive, need to RC to follow up 214A~C~B - Floats more, can follow up with 2A (I also think the move is slower though) 214A~Cmash - More recovery, can't follow up in corner Big Bang Smash - More recovery, stronger proration Partical Flare - No invincibility, weaker proration I'm assuming 補正 means hitbox. Edit: woops it means proration

Because nobody wants to sprite a zillion sprites for one new character. Every sprite-based 2D game has this and it's a game made by 3 people give them a break.