Luminos564

Fun as that sounds, I doubt Ragna is a Murakumo himself. The process of creating a Black Beast has always required an Azure wielder to act as the "body" and a Murakumo to act as the "heart". Or rather, it is the components necessary to try and make Kusanagi, with the Black Beast being a failed byproduct. However, it seems the process is not absolute and there's multiple ways one can turn into a Black Beast. Ragna himself owes that to his Azure arm which came from the corpse of his previous loop fusion with Nu-13. As someone else put it here, the arm is simply returning itself to it's full form by using Ragna as the base. Arakune is however a super-mini Black Beast and I am pretty sure Roy was never a Murakumo himself. But he can, based on Relius' comments, become a full-fledged one by consuming Nox Nyctores or more specifically, Murkaumos themselves. I will grant you this, whatever Ragna is, it most certainly ain't all human...or at least, fully human. We've had constant hints winking that he's something very different but never been told exactly what. Hopefully CF does manage to explain it.

I'd be inclined to agree. Either this one or Es' stage, depicting a rampaging Black Beast. This is the kind of this Story Mode was made for in the console release. Fun as they are, arcade runs can only cover bits and pieces of CF. I would not be surprised if the eventual Final Boss is exclusive to the console version, whenever that hits. My money is more on Izanami herself, unless Mori's drug induced fever dream decides to pull a fast one on us, if only for consistency and general badassitude from the walking dead (hurr durr see whut I did thar?) imouto. Alternatively, considering Ragna's plan and the fact that the Azure wishes to at least meet with him, it is entirely possible this whole chaotic mess comes to a halt not from defeating a singular target, but instead having a single individual put the kibosh on this whole situation with the Entitled. Like you said, dealing with the 4 horsemen (Izanami, Nine, Terumi and Relius) will only stop with their grand plans. It does not ultimately fix the broken BB world. So something or someone needs to provide a solution and incidentally, it seems Amane's got the most (fabulous) one for the occasion. *incidentally, I really like the idea of depicting the 4 as the Horsemen of the Apocalypse. Izanami is obviously Death and Terumi is a shoe-in for War. Nine could be Conquest and Relius as Famine. It kinda fits.

No clue. We do not even know exactly what he is right, let alone his origins. We have a rough idea, but nothing concrete. However, there was something of a nod to it in CP where Jin asks Haku-men if "Yuki Terumi" existed in the latter's timeline. We don't hear Haku-men's answer mind you, but given the tone and secrecy, it might imply that "Yuki Terumi" only started showing up after that loop. For the longest time, I myself thought him as something akin to being a Mu-12 / Izanami to Ragna, a part of him that Ragna at some point cast away and it took shape (and formed self-awareness) until it became what it is today. I based it primarily on how knowledgeable he is about the Azure Grimoires, his animosity towards Rachel, Jin / Haku-men and especially Ragna. If he were once part of him and represented his overall negative aspects, then it is very much likely he would hate those 3 more than anyone else. Or how he at one point wanted to be a Black Beast (though upon reflection that might have been strictly Hazama). But Naoto's connection to Ragna puts more or less a lid on that theory of mine, so I doubt it was ever the case. That's simple enough to explain. Think of him as you would the Joker from Batman, in the sense that both have an extremely warped idea about the nature of their worlds. The difference is that Terumi trades "big, happy smiles during the times of chaos" for "despair during the times of chaos" instead. He ultimately believes the world rotten and full of lies, something which he loathes, and strives to bring the world to its proper course through causing untold amount of grief, sadness and despair. Ironically, for a guy who claims to not tolerate lies, he's not the most honest of individuals, but considering his actions, I'd imagine hypocrisy is on the lower end of his crimes. Entirely possible. Depending on what his origins actually are and if he was indeed human at some point, something had to have happened to him to fall off 100 trillion feet off his rocker. But again, we know effectively squat on his origins. I'd say he was more tossed in there at some point as opposed to stumbling into it, given that he seems to have no intention of ever going back there. And indeed he does seem to fear being trapped in there, judging by his reaction to when Jubei switched places with him and he realised their plan.

It's more likely that the reason for the headless Black Beast corpse is because Haku-men cut off the head with the then full-power Ookami nox, judging by that short story told from Black Beast Ragna's point of view, moments before he is killed by the Six Heroes (right after CP Ragna and Celica took out Nu-13 from within and the Black beast reverted back to human size). That weapon (Ookami) had the ability (or maybe it still does) to nullify things like seithr or something of similar nature IIRC. Of course, I'd like to ask if Haku-men was able to cut off the head and make sure it could not be reattached, why not slice the rest of the body to bits so that future Ragna couldn't obtain its power? But who knows at this point what went through their minds when the beast was finally slain 100 years ago...

Any being capable of putting up with Kokonoe and her orders is a certified badass in their own right. The fact Tager faced Azrael before and lived to tell the tale just amps it up. As for actually causing Azrael pain, perhaps there's a chink in his "armor" (so to speak)? All we know so far, is that Azrael has more or less not suffered a single injury despite tanking on a number of power hitters. Considering that: 1. Neither seals hurt him in the long run, especially the first. Years of being frozen alive and he just shrugs it off like he took a nap. 2. Nor was the second seal able to keep him locked up for long. He just punched his way out. 3. Him getting sealed wasn't the result of a one-on-one fight that ended with him losing consciousness long enough for Kokonoe to seal him up again. Yeah I don't count him being sealed as a "clean loss" (the term usually refers in an arena combat with just 2 fighters going at each other without any tricks). Hey, whatever works for you man. I only spoke for myself. I actively go after spoilers because it builds my hype when I DO see it in action. For the record, I was only really talking about text summaries. Not the actual game itself. You gotta leave at least something for yourself when this thing hits after all. Es is so far confirmed to only have 1 Arcade run. Zedar mentioned it in his post before. As for any others characters...couldn't rightly tell ya. We only have Es confirmed for console. Anything else is edging on the "no potential playable character discussion" rule.

I never said Azrael would win. I only said that fighting the Black Beast, an opponent he figures he could afford to go all out in order to enjoy himself, is exactly what he wanted all along. Everything he does revolves around fighting strong opponents. Whether he wins or loses, his entire focus is to have a good fight. Hell his entire Act II is about meeting Izanami and forging a pact with her because she promised him an "enemy", one worthy of his time. And then he one ups himself by trying to figure out how to get into the realm of the gods in order to kick their asses sideways. Say what you will about his odds, but the man certainly seems to think he can do it. We've also not seen any evidence to the contrary aside from a brief pain when Tager grabbed one of his scars. I'd like that. He'd go on to be the sole antagonist in this series without a clean loss record. It'd actually be all too perfect for a character like him so let's hope for that. Speak for yourself friend. I'm spoiling myself rotten when this game hits. If ASW is expecting me to sit still and avoid spoilers for months like they're known to take for a localization, not happening. They hyped me up with these Acts and I will not wait until I have my answers.

Bonus points: that's exactly what the crazy S.O.B wanted in the first place. But if they don't kill each other off, like the ongoing deadlock between the Orks and the Tyranids back on planet Orrok, the people that aren't yet involved will have to deal with the victor .

For Haku-men it seems more like a personal grudge than anything. He specifically targets Ragna because, in his head, this somehow must be done. Though to his defense, he had to go through with it 725 times before and it still pains him every time. Enough to want to off himself right afterward out of repentance. Tsubaki however I am not sure. At this point she should be aware of Terumi's true nature. I mean she got a front row treatment to his machinations in CS. Yet apparently, Ragna is the "pure evil" one . Sure Tsubaki, whatever ya say. Well actually, that's not fair to her. She at least has quite the list of reasons to not like the guy. Injuring Jin and Noel, the former's own near psychotic obsession over his brother along with being a terrorist at the end of the day are solid enough reasons for it. But this isn't concern either. Individuals of the Power of Order are not mindless. They can think clearly and pick their battles. My question is more in line: if the Power of Order is the force that is trying to keep the "evil from consuming the world", why is it (what seems to be) solely focused on Ragna? EDIT: Ogiga, alright I can understand that bit. What I do not understand is, why isn't the Power of Order sending its soldiers after Arakune? Ragna has the Black Beast's corpse grafted onto him. Fair enough. But Arakune IS a full-on mini-Black Beast. Ragna at the minimum is still human enough, but Arakune isn't. And look, if Es' stage is anything to go by, leaving him unattended just let him become the biggest threat ever (assuming that Black Beast IS Arakune after mega-evolving).

I leave you guys alone for less than a day and everything starts exploding? The hype's too real it seems. I dread to think how fast it'll all go up when the console release hits. So, I've been thinking in my time away. We know that the Power of SEIGI Order wielders most often want Ragna dead. Jin, Haku-men and even Tsubaki are sharpening their knives for this reason (though we have no confirmation on Makoto since apparently she too is capable of using it). But, has it ever been explained exactly why the Power of Order wants Ragna dead? Is it because he runs the risk of turning into a Black Beast? Well then why aren't all the P.o.O users gunning after Hazama / Terumi? He runs the risk of becoming one himself because that's apparently what he wanted in the past. Likewise, why aren't they hunting down Arakune and Nu-13? They present just as much, if not more danger of turning into it. Ragna can at least "resist" the temptation (Izanami putting his Azure grimoire into overload, not so much). Is it because of the whole, World's Antibody? Antibodies by definition are supposed to be going after "foreign", dangerous antigens that threaten the biological system. In this case, it's elements that threaten the world of Blazblue. But once again, why aren't the P.o.O users then going after the bigger threats in Nine, Izanami, Relius and Terumi? I mean it's kind of like going after a terrorist while the world is being bombarded by nuclear warheads from all sides. The point is moot by then. So I have to ask: what's so specifically about Ragna that requires the need of extermination by the Power of Order? It seems like there's something personal about it.

We've gone over this. Mori stated that Central Fiction will be the ending to Ragna's story only. Blazblue as a series could very well continue beyond that. Heck, depending on the route Ragna's ending ultimately takes, he could still make appearances in future titles. Playable even. But I wish people would stop acting like CF is the ending to Blazblue as a whole. The series gathered a nice following of players and the lore is so huge, you could make more games out of it. Do you honestly think ASW and Mori specifically wouldn't take the opportunity to make more moolah from it?

As someone pointed out in the News and Gameplay thread, the stage looks like a busted up NOL branch. That said, the way the structure is all warped I can draw two impressions: 1. The Black Beast in the background is creating havoc and thus messing up the general space. Remember, we're still (AFAIK) within the Embryo so this twisted landscape could simply be that the Embryo is failing and cannot be maintained anymore. 2. Perhaps the appearance of the Black Beast is causing some kind of temporal phenomenon and time itself is being screwed over. Either way, no matter how you slice it, that Black Beast is definitely the focus of the stage.

Now that you mention it, yeah. We have a time period unaccounted for in between CP's climax and Act I. Tsubaki's conversation with Rachel had to have happened pretty soon after Ragna going berserk and spitting Noel out. It was mentioned at that time that Ragna disappeared since Kokonoe sent Tager to look for him while Sector 7 goes about supplying electricity to the now seither-less cities. Then Lamb-chops' ending from Extend had to have happened around a time Noel was healed up and was preparing to "compete" with Rachel on who will find Ragna first. Then right after that, we've hit Act I so there's a bit of a gap in the events. Though I imagine this is something the story mode would likely fill in since there's probably no way for ASW to explain it via arcade. At least Amane is more talkative about his planning so we can at least expect him to give us the skinny. Speaking of story mode: "Psst, Red Devil. You take the 1000 on the left and I'll take the 1000 on the right. Especially that guy with the star-shaped plunger". "As you wish Grim Reaper". Joking aside, if Tager's involved then chances are Kokonoe is on Ragna's side. Or maybe they're just in alignment since both want to protect Noel. I imagine this is also a point where Bullet could jump in to provide assistance to her captain. A better scan. You can see the Black Beast a lot clearer now.

Take a number friend. Most of us here are saying the same exact thing. These 3 acts have been one bombshell after another. The world of BB has boarded the crazy train and ironically, it's Ragna and Taokaka of all people that have their heads on straight. By the time Story Mode expands, I am not even sure what to expect. But as for some of your questions... From the sound of things, she is the Master Unit Amaterasu's core, by virtue of the fact that she's housing the soul of the entity residing within it. We're not entirely sure exactly when she came to house it, but some of us think it was around the time she was devoured by Berserk Ragna, saw the Gate and then separated herself from Mu-12. Racquel brought him over. She wants him to "save their world" and we've since learned that Naoto's story (Bloodedge Experience) takes place after Blazblue which is stated to be its starting point. He's also overriding Ragna's existence so characters like Valkenhayn and Rachel are telling him to GTFO. Also Haku-men apparently senses "the Dark One" from within Naoto's arm judging by the win quote from their Vs. match. Being a total bro-pal to Ragna by taking on Hazama and protecting Noel at Ragna's behest. She also surprisingly has a good head on her shoulders. I dunno how much you picked up but basically, the characters are aiming at each other's throats (or more specifically, Noel's) in order to be given the opportunity to recreate the world as they see fit by using the Azure. Carl wants his sister restored for instance (like always). Taokaka has a desire too, that being seeing her Kaka clan prosper in wealth and food. But she also admits that if it did happen this way, then it wouldn't be the village she knows and loves, so she has no need to have it granted. Yup, sure is. She's guarding the Gate that Noel saw and seems like she'll only allow Ragna to pass through it, as it is the will of the Azure itself. Anyone else is going to get up and personal with her sword. For the record, the Gate that she is guarding is the gateway to the "realm of the Gods" or more specifically, the Azure. So obviously letting guys like Terumi through it is a very bad idea. At the climax, Izanami made Ragna go berserk. During said fight, he severely injured Jin and "devoured" Noel. She ended up seeing the Gate and separated herself from her Mu-12 (God-slayer) powers. In the meantime, the Embryo that Izanami forged out of Take-Mikazuchi encompassed the characters and messed up their memories so that Act One was mostly a retread of Calamity Trigger, but with differences like Kagura being present as well as Amanohokosaka already being the Imperator. The Embryo is a sort of "pre-construction" world where the characters chosen by the Master Unit, the Entitled, must fight to reshape the world according to their will. Not everyone is an Entitled though. Ragna, Azrael, Arakune and Litchi are not one for instance. According to Nine however, the Embryo was also made so that Ragna becomes a "god" but that hasn't been brought up since. Act Two is about the cast being shown that even IF they get their hands on the Azure (pieces handed to them by Izanami), their wishes won't come true because the supreme Entitled, Noel, will just overrule them and deny them their wish. So now we're in Act Three where every character is either gunning for Noel, wanting to protect her and others are scheming behind all the chaos. Oh and Ragna has decided to play the "villain" in order to deny the desires of others in order to save them. This includes Nu-13, y'know, the gal that literally stabbed him in the back at the end of CP? Bottom line: it's a mighty mess the world is in and that's not including all the individual people affecting it. So now you're mostly caught up, excluding reading up on individual arcade runs

See, this is what I like. I have little knowledge of the Azure Shrine Maiden aside from the fact Mei is related to her of many generations afterward. Glad there's someone here who can recall the knowledge of XBlaze because there's so much misinformation about it. So effectively, the Azure is by principle "God" of the Blazblue universe. Perhaps even that of XBlaze. At least if I am understanding you proper. That would explain why all the timey-wimey stuff can be made manifest: because people are tapping into the power of creation. It does also explain why the very first unit, a mechanical construct, gained a soul after coming into contact with it. And now Ragna is going to get right up and personal with it? Though it might not turn out badly for him since the Azure is willing him to be there as opposed to people like Roy who peered outta sheer desire to surpass Kokonoe. Now, if the Azure is ultimately the natural process for human beings to go through, then perhaps this is ultimately what needs to be done to fix the world of Blazblue. Not complete death like what Izanami craves. Not soulless, porcelain dolls crafted from the deranged mind of a lone scientist. Nor even reset once more so a big tittied witch can hug her adorable sister again. It needs someone to cut all this crap, raze said plans to the ground. In a word: destroyed as it is now so it can start fresh.

Alternatively, since the gate is guarding the entryway into the supposed "realm of the gods" (or the Azure) it's entirely possible for Ragna to ascend to godhood by going through it, thus completing the function the Embryo was devised for. At least according to Nine but we need to remind ourselves of how screwy she'd become of late. So, a question. Es' quote to Ragna is that "she will guide him to the Gate. It is the will of the Azure". This seems to imply that the Azure isn't a mindless power source but an actual entity in its own right. So what exactly is the Azure? We know it makes certain people into sludge smoothies and makes them crave it. Likewise, it seems to tempt (perhaps unintentionally) people like Litchi (during Ragna's CS story) or just about any of the Entitled willing to kill for their desires. And yet, something doesn't feel right. For whatever reason, I cannot really call the Azure itself "evil". I dunno why, but I instantly thought of U-Do from Xenosaga when I read Es' line. For the unawares, U-Do was, basically, a sentient "power" or rather "God". It makes the Gnosis (ethereal salt monsters) and isn't inherently malicious. It just has no ability to actually communicate with humans without driving them insane.

I can live with that. If the Black Beast evolves and provided Ragna's recent appearance as Izanami's "beast" is an indicator, then it would make sense that the thing would have a shifting appearance over the course of the story. Though, it brings the question of how far can it evolve to? I can see now why Azrael would want to throw down with it. I mean, an opponent that can lay waste to the world and that evolves over time, building in power? That must be his dream come true.

Ogiga, that only assumes this new Black Beast...thing is even made from Ragna or anything related to him. For all we know the one seen in the image could be Arakune evolving like a Pokemon except instead of becoming cuddly and easily locked up inside a metal sphere, it's a giant fawking doom being that would give Ridley Scott naughty ideas. Also, inconsistencies in design is nothing new to this series. Just look at the portraits from CT, CS, CP and now. There's multiple artists to this series so the Black Beast going through redesigns shouldn't be all that surprising. CT was a long-ass time ago too and artists tend to evolve or change up their style as the years go by. Or some get fired/leave and are replaced by others, which is just as likely. That said, I do like how you took the time to find every image of it there is. Feels most nostalgic. I think the last one is most likely. I doubt ASW is feeling generous and drawing up more images for all 3 acts in her arcade. Then there's added dialogue and voice work so the costs still need to be kept in-line. But I don't think giving her a unique arcade run that ties into all 3 acts prior is out of the question. Especially if Zedar's idea that she is guiding Ragna (when he's an amnesiac) is on the money.

Direct your attention to directly above Es' energy beam thing. You'll see the white eye as well as teeth from a newly formed Black Beast. Hey, that actually makes sense. She wasn't there when Noel/Mu-12 saw the Gate itself was she? And now that it has been "found", Es shows up as the "scary Guardian" that Amane mentions. Though I'm curious since she (at the least) isn't hostile to Ragna but the way Amane words it, it seems she wouldn't allow the empty Amaterasu to be sent through the Gate. Gah, this is getting too good.

Take a look right smack in the middle of the background. Notice the eye and maw of teeth. THAT'S A BLACK BEAST! *Original post courtesy of Shado_Onikkisu so be be sure to thank them.

Ooooohhhhh. Wait...if Es is a "guardian of the Gate" then does that mean that vague, off-hand comment from Jubei about Ragne becoming a "guardian of the Azure" might be brought to light here? And this Es knows Ragna to boot (then again, so does every random street urchin these days). The plot thickens. Before I respond, let me express my appreciation. Discussing this weighty lore and its characters has been a delight so far. I mean that with utmost sincerity and not one hint of sarcasm on my part, even if I do not agree with everything. Now then... Even still, Tsubaki should be aware that whether it is out of personal beliefs or simply circumstance, the fact remains that Ragna's actions during the incident ultimately benefited the world at large. It's far and away from the "pure, source of all evil" that she named him to Rachel. Now again, I am fully aware that hurting both Jin and Noel put damn big wedge between them and I do not expect them to sit down for tea anytime soon. Likewise, I am not expecting Tsubaki to be all-too forgiving on her part since at the end of the day, Ragna is picking up a "villain ball" in order to deny the desires of the Entitled. Alls I am saying though, it would have been nice nice to create some dramatic tension with Tsubaki as people do explain just what in the blazing hell happened at CP's climax and his actual involvement. It's why I called it a "wasted opportunity" though perhaps that was too harsh on my end. Even still, are you positive said interactions during the amnesia in Act I wouldn't stick? Ragna seems to be different, judging by his tone and demeanor following Act III. It's still Ragna for sure, but he is definitely turned out for the better. Similarly, "actions speak louder than words". Tsubaki may not believe an amnesiac Ragna should he have ever denied what she accused him of, but you know how that goes in games like this: Character X gets accused/attacked by Character Y. X spares Y or otherwise does everything in their power not to kill the latter. Y starts getting doubts etc. I kinda like that scenario, but ultimately I do understand that this is Mori's tale, however..."haphazard" it seems at times. So I am not going to go out of my way to demand the story fit to my preference.

Anyone notice that in that move Es looks like she's (kinda) making the "hourglass" that was present in Chronophantasma? Or at least the openings?

I am not going to speak for other people, but while I do not fault Tsubaki for the views she has, I do draw an issue at her claim that he is "pure evil". Or as you put it in that she doesn't even see him as a person, when she had a first-hand experience to the contrary. I think some tend to forget (perhaps even Mori himself) that by CP's climax, Ragna had to work alongside Tsubaki, Makoto and Bang against the likes of Relius, Terumi and Izanami in order to prevent some big shit hitting the metaphorical fan. I wouldn't expect her to drop her opinion based on only one instance (Jin and Noel being injured only adds more fuel to the fire after all), but at the least, I'd have liked to see her question "why" a known criminal would go so far as to fight a Godzilla-sized mothafawker like Take-Mikazuchi for the world...or rather Celica's sake. Personally, the issue with Tsubaki is a wasted opportunity. Here was an amazing, gold-mine set-up where Tsubaki could have encountered an amnesiac Ragna and through interaction could have been presented with evidence contradicting her views of him. Kinda like with Lyuze from Casshern Sins if you want an example. Still, elements of it seems be in place for the arcade since, even though hostile, Tsubaki was at least willing to hear what he had to say to her question before aiming for his neck. At the end of the day though, this is still the arcade version and who knows what can of worms the Story Mode for console will be. And speaking of which... Es is in (console Story at least). Wonderful. We can finally know just what her deal/stake is in all this.

Ah, that would explain the "humans built it" line from Izanami. Outta curiosity, is there anything of importance in that city?

OK, I promise not to dwell on this much and I am not mad or anything but, you do know this series is about as far away removed from realism as my arse is from the dark side of Europa, right? This is a story where a man like Ragna can get shot by an outta control Mu-12 (after receiving a thrashing from Hazama), disintegrate his left arm and then not die despite bleeding from every orifice. Or if you wanna throw in arm transplants, why is it that he can move his mechanical replacement within what seems to be mere days? As opposed to going through months of intense physical and mental therapy just to form a fist properly? But now you're telling me it's impossible for anyone else to be affected by that Azure arm because they're not Ragna? Alls I'm saying is, if the series has barely any concern keeping up a facade of "realistic problems", why should we? Play by its rules, sure. Doesn't mean we suddenly have to make up some of them if the story itself gave us none in the first place alright ? See now, this intrigues me. I mean, Arakune is a "failure" Black Beast but seems capable enough of becoming the real deal. But that is the process of a human unfortunately turning into it. But this implies that the Black Beast is Ragna's default state. And in some aspects, it makes sense. He's certainly running the risk of turning into one even if he isn't stabbed in the gut by Nu-13. Though, I imagine this shift to be different than when he fused with her in all those loops prior. Well, Izanami claimed it was "humans that built/made" Izanagi. Now in what context this isn't made clear. For all we know, Izanagi could be an mechanical construct or programming just as much as it could be an actual person. I have my doubts about it being Ragna though. I dunno, something about it does not fit. But then again, in the actual myth he and Izanami were siblings (later husband and wife) and Ragna is technically Izanami's sibling so there is that parallel. Not sure how he feels about snuggling up to a living skeleton from the depths of hell though...

Somehow the image of Hibiki slashing and failing to cut a confused Noel makes me laugh like a loon. It's like something out of Monty Python except I doubt Noel would ever utter "'Tis only a flesh wound". Rachel on the other hand, sounds much more "caring" this time around. Go figure. I'd have thought she'd snide at others until her dying breath. But sounds like her power-loss really did a number and she's much more kind to both Ragna and Noel.