ryokoalways

Doesn't work off 5D since you can't get them high enough in the air. It does work for 2D, and it's already there.

5D>6A>5A>5B is probably not universal if it's strict on Ragna. 2D>6A>5A>5B would probably be universal though. Characters with a short otg hitbox has a tighter timing for the j2C. I think characters like noel/nu/mu and carl are the only ones though. A slight delay to the j2C fixes the problem, and it's not too difficult if the AD timing after tsubaki is good. There isn't any variation in height either so really no random factor to have to account for. Edit: I don't know what I was thinking about when I said 2D would work. That will teach me to think about other shit during work.

Fuzzy guard jB>tsubaki is probably a universal set-up from middle of screen. 50% screen length jB>tsubaki>AD j2C>land gurren>walk 2C(5B if more to the 50% area)>j2A>AD j2A>j2C>2C>j2A>AD j2A>jC>j2A>J2A>AD j2A>jC>5C>3C for 4741 and 2.2 recovery 75% screen length jB>tsubaki>AD j2C>land gurren>IAD delay jA>jB>2C>j2A>AD j2A>jC>j2A>j2A>AD j2A>jC>5C>3C for 4230 and 1.9 recovery If above doesn't work, then jB>tsubaki>AD j2C>land gurren>hop 5A>6A>5A>j2A>AD j2A>jC>6C for 3676 and 1 recovery You can add j2A>J2A>AD j2A>jC>5C>3C at the end if you are between 50% and 70% distance. It's only ~75% distance that requires the 6C knockdown.

The following catch combos do not use any magatamas, and has meter retention in mind. 5D>6A>5A>j2A>AD slight delay j2A for 1996, 2 recovery and knockdown. 5D>6A>5A>jA>jB>j2A>jC for 2062 and 2.2 recovery 2D>delay IAD jA>jB>2C>j2A>j2A>jC for 1920 and 2.2 recovery. Not universal 2D>walk for a bit, 6A>5A>j2A>j2A>jC for 1798 and 2.1 recovery, in the event where the above doesn't work. 6D>super jump j2C>2C>j2A>j2A>jC for 2410 and 2.3 recovery 6D>hop twice 2C>super jump j2A for 1899, 1.9 recovery and set-up knockdown.

For mix-up, 2B is faster and 3C has much better proration (both also have much better advantage frames, with 2B staying at +2 and 3C going from -9 to -4, making both moves much much safer), so renka is no longer the main option as a starter as a low. This is important because you really do not want to use meter unless you know you can get some type of return. Change to tsubaki allows for fuzzy guard options, which is a major addition. Overhead jB on 2 more characters is also very good. Mid-screen low is arguably better for renka>gurren because of IAD jA>jB, which results in greater relative dmg than before. Hakumen also basically traded the tsubaki enma midscreen high option for the renka>kishuu>2C>hotaru low option. The former is slightly better, but I think it's safe to say that the change to tsubaki isn't really an overall nerf, but just a change of options. As for 6A being better, I should include 5A for the same reason in that 5A>6A and 5A>j2A links add a variety of options. 5A Anti-jump is actually worth something now. In the combo thread, using 6A instead of 2B in the reverse combo I posted makes a major difference in the combo due to the 3% difference in P2. 5A>6A>5A string has the advantage of taking a long time to execute, making meter gain better as a result. Basically, Hakumen's air combo ability got better because he actually gets something off pokes instead of jA>jB>j2A. Again, Hakumen's real nerfs were -IB system (Defensively, self-explanatory, but offensively, Hakumen basically became the only char without air-tight strings, so it's not really a nerf, but just him getting shafted) -Poke dmg (the effects aren't that large if you can confirm off 1 hit. The P2 decrease is the killer. Also, 2A going from 6 to 7F, which is a massive nerf) -meter gain (the biggest problem imo. It's the a cause for all the problems I stated in the previous post. If he had CS1 meter gain, he is easily A tier) However, he got a better corner game (a much better one imo), if you can get there with some magatamas.

I've played around with combos based on the combo vids that's been posted. I've tried some original stuff, but mostly I just tried to test changes and optimize combos. I also did not test with any DLC characters. Instant overhead is possible on Ragna and Carl. Funny thing is, if they are crouching and not blocking (2), the jB will whiff. If they are blocking (1), the jB will hit. I think it's safe to say that requirement isn't an issue. Mid screen hotaru- If hakumen's vertical position is higher than his opponents and the opponent isn't one character length off the ground, the following is possible: hotaru>IAD delay jC>land gurren>IAD delay jA>jB>2C>j2A>j2A>jC>j2A>j2A>j2A>jC>5C>3C 70% screen distance results in corner knockdown. The window for the combo is tight. Important timings are the first jC hit, which can't be too high (gurren will whiff) or too low (IAD jA>jB cannot be delayed). If the combo is done incorrectly, you can adjust to land gurren> hop 5A>5B>j2A. I use this mainly as the combo for cross-up hotaru, which you can set-up with enma IAD or 5B IAD. The idea is exactly the same as ragna's 3C>IAD dp cross-up. It's not as reliable because you need the opponent to be standing, but if used sparingly it's a powerful tool. Use the following combo pieces only with good starter (renka, 5B, 5C,3C). Other poke starters will cause combo to terminate at relaunch. General rule to follow is don't go above minimum number of magatamas unless starter is good. This does not work with arakune or carl due to their air hitbox lacking a lower part. ~renka>kishuu>hop 2C>tk hotaru>AD j2C(1S)>2C>j2A>AD j2A>j2C>2C>j2A>AD j2A>jC>5C>3C tsubaki insert at (1S), following 2C requires hop first. This will increase dmg by ~1k, so only do this if you are going for the kill, as like most combos, they are front loaded for magatama usage. Alternatively, you can use shippu at the end of the combo for less dmg, but get to keep the magatama safe from being wasted due to a burst. Renka starter for 5380 and 1.3 recovery 5B for 5035 and 1.3 recovery 6127 (tsubaki) vs 5727 (shippu) 5C for 6215 and 1.3 recovery 7471 (tsubaki) vs 6891 (shippu) 3C for 5595 and 1.3 recovery (always use shippu above tsubaki insert as you cannot double relaunch off 3C starter) 6551 vs 6289 Mix-up starters Note: You can use any starter with the combo piece, but follow the above rule in only using magatama when you land a good starter. -Use renka only when 3 magatama or lower/2B starter low magatama Low renka(2) into (j2A>j2A>jc)X2 for 3675 and 1.5 recovery 2B starter into regular for 2848 and .9 recovery renka>kishuu>6C into 2 relaunches for 5299 and 1.8 recovery 3C counter starter into 2 relaunches for 5524 and 1.8 recovery High tsubaki>6C into 2 relaunches for 5326 and 1.9 recovery jB fuzzy guard/overhead into (j2A>j2A>jc)X2 for 4744 and 1.6 recovery Hotaru- Add (j2A>j2A>jc)X2 if counter hotaru>6C(charge level varies depending on height and distance) into 2 relaunches for 5024 (lvl2 charge) and 2.3 recovery high magatama- obviously not efficient. Use only when going for the kill Low renka>kishuu>6C>2C>hotaru>j2C>5C~ into 2 relaunches for 6726 and 1.8 recovery 3C counter starter into 2 relaunches for 6244 and 1.9 recovery (remove 6C) renka>kishuu>gold burst>6C>2C>hotaru>j2C>5C~ into 2 relaunches for 7318 and 1.9 recovery 3C counter starter into 2 relaunches for 7302 and 1.9 recovery High tsubaki>hop gold burst>5C>2C>hotaru>6C into regular for 6166 and 1.7 recovery Hotaru- Add (j2A>j2A>jc)X2 if counter hit hotaru>j2C>tsubaki>land 6C into 2 relaunches for 6401 and 2 recovery hotaru>land gold burst>6C>2C> j2C (if not counter, jB)>tsubaki>AD j2C>2C into 2 relaunches for 7234 and 2.6 recovery I have a gold burst in some combos because I feel that Hakumen can apply pressure with increased dmg when he lands a good hit. In instances where a gold burst would increase your dmg by enough to kill the opponent, you should always do it. This will apply pressure to your opponent to match your burst or die. This also makes reading a burst much easier, since the situation is very simple. For air throws near the corner, it's always better to cancel into a special. Either air throw>tsubaki into double relaunch (j2A>j2A>jc)X2 for 5538 and 2.7 recovery (the j2A...X2 component varies by character here) or if within 25% screen distance to the corner. air throw>hotaru>hop 6C into double relaunch for 4926 lvl3 or 4539 lvl2 and 1.9 The following are reverse combo options for the piece 3C (counter)>2B>renka>kishu>~ 3 magatama hop 6A (can insert a 5A before 6A against certain characters as burst bait)>5A>j2A>AD j2A>j2C>2C>j2A>j2A>AD j2A>jC>5C>3C for 3821 and 1.2 recovery Really close to the corner you can, 6A>j2A>j2C~ into (j2A>j2A>jc)X2 instead for 3994 and 1.9 recovery 4 magatama 6C>gurren into (j2A>j2A>jc)X2 for 4969 and 2.1 recovery 5 magatama hop 2C>hotaru>6C into (j2A>j2A>jc)X2 for 5794 lvl3 or 5628 lvl2 and 2.3 recovery The level of the 6C is distance dependent, and a hop may need to be inserted as well. Use your own judgement. The combo is very long, and unless you get the opponent as close to the ground as possible for the final jC, they will tech 5C before becoming otg. As mentioned above, the big dmg mid screen combo does not work for arakune, so I worked in a new meter gain combo as a replacement. Usually renka>enma piece will work just fine, but the meter return isn't that great. Because it's a replacement for the punish combo, I am assuming good starter (5C). Likewise, 40% distance to the corner is required. 5C>enma>jump back, then slight delay AD (match height where arakune is about an inch above you)>delay jC (use AD momentum to move arakune a bit to the corner of the map before striking)>hotaru>AD land 6C into regular combo. Arakune must be above you or else hotaru won't land. You will hit arakune's bottom as it will extend when he gets hit by jC (the animation causes a slight hitbox extention). You also need to use your AD to push arakune a little, or else he will tech just before reaching the wall. The damage from this combo is about the same as renka>enma. However, due to the longer continuation from hotaru wallbounce and 6C ground slide, the meter gain from the combo is a lot more superior.

They increased ragna's dp hitbox by just enough so that you can't backdash it during oki-setup. This blows ass.

out of curiosity, does all (j2A~~~jC)X2 replacements nets lower total dmg than only one rep into knockdown? I've tried several and they do about 70-100 less dmg, but you get an additional 40% of a bar of meter.

Whether you super jump for j2A depends on what part of the corner loop you are on. You super jump to get closer to the corner, so you really only need to super jump when you are going for 2 relaunches (~>2C>j2A>j2C>2C>sj2A>j2C>2C>~). All other instances (double jC parts, or just any knockdown) just do regular jump. Also, I take back what I said about the renka>kishuu>hop 2C>hotaru>AD j2C combo part. The timing isn't very strict on characters it does work on. The mistake I made was on the j2A after that piece. Doing a super jump tk motion for hotaru and a slight delay on j2A basically guarantees the combo, so the risk associated with it isn't that bad.

After playing with all the combos, the only part that actually takes practice is renka>kishuu>hop 2C>hotaru>AD j2C~. A decent starter is a requirement for sure. I'm pretty sure this is going to be character specific too (I don't think it will work on arakune due to his lack of a lower aerial hitbox, for instance). Outside of that, tsubaki can only be comboed if it's done at the beginning/end of the hop for middle screen (probably character specific too). Everything else that's been posted so far seems universal.

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm14475841 Apologies if someone has posted this already, but there is a small section in the latter part of the vid that has Fuzzy guard. It's only one variation (ignore the starter>j2A btw, that's just junk), and you can also fuzzy with 5B. I still want to know if 5A qualifies. Everything else in the vid has been done already I believe.

You need off hop hotaru. Off tk type heights, I don't think so in CS2. If you check the carry combo vid, there were several instances where the hakumen was basically a handful of pixels off the ground, and just AD right after the hotaru (which is why I think the recovery got further reduced).

you don't need to land to AD off hotaru. That was true even in CS1. It seems in CS2 the recovery is even less, and you can still do an additional dash off the counter reset.

New hakumen is better at controlling close-mid distances, so use that to buy time. From some of the new vids, you can still make them pay for being careless. It's just more costly for hakumen to do avg dmg. The flow of the match for hakumen would be to fish for a decent starter and burn 4-5 magatamas, doing some dmg and getting corner knockdown, then use 3 magatamas and go for a addtional set-ups. Basically, instead of being able to make a move at 3-4 magatamas and be extremely threatening, you need at least 5 magatama to be able to do any sustained attack (you basically need 1-2 more magatama than CS1 for everything).

There are some nice pieces that can be used from a carry combo video. Several combos also had good design, mainly in that multi-magatama specials are limited compared to kishuu/enma/gurren to preserve meter gain. While the magatama requirement is high, at the very least it shows that there are mid screen options to break out respectable damage so your opponent can't just take a bunch of risks without paying for it.

It's horizontal range. Don't make it more complicated than it is.

I did the comparison for startup frames with scan from previous mook, so I'm sure about C moves all being the same. The only startup frame changes were 2B from 9>8F jA from 6>7 jB from 10>8 jC from 11>12 (it was previously same speed as Jin's) As for renka, I was 100% certain that 120% is gone. Let's assume it isn't for now though as the translation notes state it's still there (I did not do this version so I never saw the Japanese mook scan). That said, the damage you get off poke>renka is still abysmal in the middle of the screen, whereas before you can still get respectable dmg if you were able to confirm pre-renka with just 1 hit. Regarding counter, again, it's just due to IB nerf because you generally cannot create your own chance to catch stuff anymore. Your opponent now has more control to when catch is a viable option, which is why it's extremely risky. On top of that, now all catch has 45% proration, which is a sharp drop from ~60% you had previously. In normal instances, the changes only hurts 2D significantly, but in certain instances where you may want to break out dmg for the kill, that's no longer possible. 6C has same move proration. Do not do it more than once in a combo. And as above stated. 6D has the worst proration nerf relatively because it used to not do dmg.

Change to IB makes hakumen much less intimidating during block strings. Risk/reward againt A/B block strings are now too horribly in opponent favor to try to punish. This wouldn't be too big of a problem if hakumen had a real back dash. Hakumen needs to create more space than other characters to be able to back out safely. Hakumen's poke starters got nerfed noticeably. Add the fact that 120% on renka is gone, anything that's not 5C starter has far greater reduced damage than just the overall tone down for everyone. This means opponents will almost always win risk/reward in the middle of the screen. To clarify, hakumen's C moves are not faster. All of them are the same, and jC is slower by 1-2F. The most interesting speed increase is jB going from 10F to 8F. This means fuzzy guard jB>tsubaki becomes a very important mixup tool anywhere. I would think overhead jB should be usable on more than just tager and hakumen now, but that would still need to be tested. And of course there is improved kishuu, which is now safe against IB dp punishes in IBed entry. Additions such as ground strings and magatama off catch are offset by the fact that Hakumen's meter gain got nerfed (longer static after specials) and catch is much less reliable. Reduced combo capability also makes meter return much worse in the middle of the screen. Again, IB nerf also makes magatama much more valuable. I could spam hotaru all day in CS1 and never go below 3 magatamas. I know for a fact that won't be the case in CS2. Only real buffs were hotaru (corner, also since it can work as a gimmick cross-up that's actually reliable), yukikaze (marginally, still not accessible enough to make a big difference), jB, tsubaki (thanks mostly to jB), kishuu, and 6A. Hakumen became worse in most situations and became better in much more specific situations. Losing flexibility and options is never a good thing. So, it makes sense he went down in tiers, but he is still good enough to compete no problem since he still has mix-up options (which are actually much improved imo).

You want to use tk or hop hotaru to differenciate the combos, not whether you land. Outside of a couple of instances in the corner where you get to decide (based on opponent height on hit and available magatana), whether you need a landing reset isn't a choice, but a part of the combo. For instance, if you tk hotaru outside of corner and your opponent was grounded on hit (they also have to be nearly point blank to you), you have no chance of landing a j2C (if you do quickest tk hotaru then it should be possible. But since the new blow away effect makes you unable to even tell how fast you did it as the screen moves away, it's too unreliable). Hop hotaru will make you closer to your opponent and give you a set timing for IAD. So, you are making a choice between tk and hop, then accessing the situation based on which you used (was it a high/grounded hit, how many magatamas do I have, am i close to/far from corner, should I be baiting burst, etc). Whether you land is a result of those choices, not a choice itself. Difference between tk and hop is a lot less important in the corner, as your choice will be completely based on height on hit and distance to corner.

It's not going to be used much because that string is something you use when you have absolutely no meter, on top of the string having a somewhat strict distance limitation (due to looping back into 5A). Unlike CS1, you should not be that close to a target when you have no meter in CS2. If you have meter, you hitconfirm 2B into enma or renka (position pending). If you have no meter, push him 1 character length away with 2A spam and go from there. Edit: Let me reword that. If you can do the combo, by all means. It's not going to happen often considering you need to be fairly close and your target needs to be standing (common sense says if you land 2B they are standing, but in CS2 there is even less reason to block high against hakumen outside of the corner, so that's why I think it's going to be rare).

It does work on most characters, but there is no reason to do it. If you want to do a carry combo it's cheaper and more efficient to just do enma combo (without the renka). If you want to do a mid screen setup, then you'd do 2C after kishuu (still need to figure out if this is possible if renka is omitted. May have some distance/timing issues). The 5A>6A>5A piece if more for after 3C counter or any type of AA into gurren if you are looking to conserve magatamas.

looking for a hotaru opening is unreliable. Any variation of X>renka>kishuu>2C>hotaru>AD cost too many magatama (not to mention the spacing between renka and hotaru cause a prolonged meter gain stoppage, causing even more problems). Besides the one already listed, the only other thing is the old anything into enma, but losing jC>jC takes that back to CT level carry. Has anyone tried enma>j2C>5C>kishuu>2C>j2A? WIth the better proration, it may be possible to score a legit knockdown through that and get a reliable mix-up game at the middle of the screen.

Yukikaze spam is a bit rampant right now because 1. It catches low now. 2. It's more ambiguous. 3. It's an substitute for jD Remember, you had two types of Hakumen player in CS1, the real ones, and the jD spammers. What you are seeing is probably jD spammers. Out of curiosity, has anyone optimized low magatama carry pieces yet? As good as hotaru>AD is, it takes too many magatamas to be reliable for most situations (unless the distance limitation isn't as severe as I'm making it out to be). The only variation I know of is 5A>6A>5A push, which isn't bad but doesn't really give you a good position after both of the players recover.

Oh what the hell? They released it on handhelds first/already? That's... really counterintuitive.

I've always just assumed the recovery on gurren is reduced, since gurren entry seems to be safe. This could be an illusion due to less stop frames though. I will look around.