Canine

Another little thing about Shawl (and Amethyst) is that they both have bonus prorate, and a ground combo example using Shawl is early on one can 6C>Sea Moss~Shawl>Crimson>4X>the rest, usually after Kunzite. It's iffy midscreen but I've seen it before, just more consistent in the corner. Corner example of Shawl, though not the best since it doesn't end in oki and highlights a weird reset, without active flow up and with an oki ender it'd be around 3.5k I think.

If I may chime in, as upset as I am about air combos being poop from what we've seen so far like some others, ground combos might be neater? I dunno maybe other people thought about it but d5B air hit>d6D might be a thing for midscreen shenanigans? Further improved corner carry ? As much as I hate the focus being back on ground stuff since our flexibility is pretty much out the window if that's the case.. (even more so since a lot of ground drive strings don't seem to actually WORK even on crouch as previously mentioned) I am not a happy camper with current CF Noel /o Alas, time will hopefully tell ya?

Unsure if it was posted anywhere, but here's Lambda's challenge 20 sample play (literally had to pray to stumble upon it in video form, I couldn't get it otherwise despite having an inkling that it was something dumb like double air OD calamity ender somehow) 8625 Damage, 100 Heat, 10% OD - OD>236C FC>CT>214D>214A>5C>dl6C>dl236D>5C>5D>6D>TK OD Calamity>TK j2D>OD Calamity TK j2D is actually pretty annoying, other than that just make sure you get all the hits of 6C and delay 236D properly, otherwise you won't get enough damage.Again, sorry if it was posted elsewhere and I didn't see ;A;

Some shenanigans off the starter one shouldn't get often at all with the piddly amount of health needed to do it and the scenario in the first one. These can both be started with 49 heat or more. Transcripts and Notes 8908-8895 damage, 100 Heat, 10% OD, back to corner, standing opponent - d6C FC>214A>5C>TK j236C~j2C>RC>66>jD>cOD>landing d6D>d623D>5C>5D>d5C>d5D>d6B>d5C>d236D>OD Fenrir.Does not work on anyone who doesn't get hit by 5C after 214A in a fatal combo (off the top of my head, Izayoi, Amane, Tager). Amane and Tager can both be hit with 5B>TK j236C~2C to maintain an ample amount of damage, currently I have no work around for Izayoi too lazy. Does the most damage (8908) with a 7 hit d6C starter, the least (8895 or less) with a 9 or fewer than 6 hit starter respectively.Fenrir must be microdashed for possibly multiple characters (the only one that I'm currently aware of that requires it is Ragna for whatever reason).Will do substantially less damage if regular 6D is inputted instead of d6D upon landing after cOD'd jD.Can do 12 more damage by substituting landing d6D for landing d5D, Rachel (and possibly Tager) Specific.8721-8707 Damage, 100 heat, 10% OD, midscreen to corner, standing opponent - d6C FC>214A>5C>TK j236C~j2C>RC>j4D>cOD>665C>5D>d623D>6C(1)>2D>d5D>d6B>d5C>d236D>OD Fenrir.Still does not work on those who cannot be hit by 5C after 214A in a fatal combo.Does the most damage (8721) off an 8 hit d6C starter, 9 hit is still the least damage.Fenrir must still be microdashed for Ragna and potentially some others.This one I'm not confident in being completely optimal but ideas I have aren't panning out.okay back to lurking as the labdoge I am at times.

So uh, yeah Pardon the terrible webcam quality, old laptop went a month ago so and this one doesn't have an optical drive (meaning I haven't bothered to get the software for my capture card on this laptop through other means, hurray emergency replacements). But we can cancel 2D's low to the ground hits into Thor which doesn't come out due to momentum (I'm thinking) and thus leaves us with no recovery on 2D, so we get a situational rapid for free (still need 50 heat to do it, but it doesn't use the meter since Thor doesn't come out) Pardon me if it's been found already but yeah \o\ (Note Thor 'can' still come out if it gets inputed 'immediately' on the first hit, so it's not as easy as I made it look. lol)

Challenge 20 spoilers How I did it Sample Play Combo As a preemptive sort of thing. Should be alright, ya?

So, with the knowledge that air turn j2D pushes people towards you, allowing you to take the corner and attempt a left/right as well as a high/low (courtesy of Sougo) I applied the concept in two samples as you know, a thing. Pretty tough execution wise though, allows for some really dirty play however (❍ᴥ❍ʋ) (Quick note though there are many combos this'll work on, and if you want to quickly frazzle your opponent end a hop route at the jC and quickly jump>air turn>j2D, if it hits then wowzers 1.9k right there, if they block it backdash and attempt mixup)

PSA: 2B has pretty harsh SMP for a normal (500) Thus, I propose people start learning different enders to midscreen Anti-air 2B combos using the following two AA confirms as a base.. 1:2B CH>jC Whiff>5B>2C>hop jC... 2:2B CH>jc delayed jB>5B>2C>hop jC... and instead of ending with A:...5B>2B>j2C(>214B) (Easiest) we use the following routes instead B:...5B>jcjBAB>jcjB*>j2C(>214B) (Slightly more difficult) or C:...5C>jcjBAB>jcjB*>j2C(>214B) (Hardest of the confirms) In each of these cases you will get 2C's knockdown but due to 2B's SMP you get a lot less damage by using it again in A routes. The second jump cancel jB must be omitted if you use the falling jB confirm (i.e. every route denoted in this post with 2). Gunshot is an option if you managed to put them in the corner at the end, but isn't 'essential' in any shape or form. The damages of each are as follows, parentheses' values being if you manage gunshot 1A: 2857 (2903) 2A: 3039 (3082) 1B: 3279 (3329) 2B: 3267 (3317) 1C: 3473 (3523) 2C: 3475 (3525) I would implore people to at least go for the 5B jump cancel routes (B routes) as a start to optimizing play, and if they feel comfortable eventually, try the 5C jump cancels (C routes).

Also showing a midscreen possibility though honestly this route will likely never see the light of day in actual matches. In other news, I've updated the frame data page with regards to SMP on the 236A/B series. For those who don't feel like wandering over there due to not caring about the numbers, I'll just jot down the important bits. First, 236B~A/B has SMP on 'two' parts, the very first hit, and the first hit of the grab portion. So basically, you 'never' want to do two of them in one one combo, even if one's a grab and another just the slide, or vice versa. Second, 236AB~A/B is also the same case, SMP on the first hit (because it, too, can cause a slide), and on the first hit of the grab, however, this is where some tricky things come into play. Both 236B~A/B and 236AB~A/B share an SMP flag on the grab part. Meaning you 'cannot' do extended combos involving both (e.g. 5AA 5B 236B~A/B *filler* 236AB~A/B 214214D) without cutting the filler a bit. It doesn't cause too much an issue but is still something to keep in mind for my fellow lab goers. (On a personal note regarding this this is what makes 236B~A/B wallbounce combos into Mandala->Wail not very possible qAq, sad doge, but eh, that's what we have Spin state resets for I guess >_>)

Yeah it's a proration issue, personally I'd reccommend 'never' going into 236ABB after ending with 2D since 2D is a whopping 2000 P2 and if total proration goes over 3400 the next hit is an immediate tech no matter what, in longer combos you could see why 2D would be an issue. With the spin state in particular, you have to make sure that 236ABB's tackle does 'not' send total proration over 3400+ or else the spin state does not apply. j.C > 5AA > 5B > 5C > Heat Riser B > 5C > 2C > 2D > 236ABA > reset in this one for example, it becomes 300+200+100+100+300+200(?)+100+2000+100=3400 then spinstate, though I'm not exactly sure as to 5C's SMP penalty, I'm somewhat believing it's 100 rather than 50. Which is fair imo. But that would lead this combo to have exactly 3400 total proration before the spin state hit, which = immediate recovery which = PROFOUND SADNESS. Reccomendation would be to just skip 5AA and go 5A> 5B 2AB>214AB>5B>2C>hop 5C>5b>2b>2c>2d>Spin This one, has 300+200+100+100+100+150(?)+100+100+2000+100=3250, this is assuming 5B's SMP is 50 which would be a safe assumption. It's under 3400 total so it works. Woosh But yeah, if you're gonna go for spin state stuff, safest bet would be to just end with j2C/2C rather than j2D/2D if you've used a pretty long combo. But be aware that a full C animation is also pretty harsh on the proration. Blah blah..back to the lab /o/

Ggs, sorry for being somewhat bluh myself, trying to get into Sho's Rhythm, deeeeeefinitely nothing like Adachi's, lol. Also sorry for not being talkative in the lobby, I usually only communicate with the emotions there xP

Just wanted to say I compiled as many P1/P2 values as I could and put them on the Frame Data page, while some of them aren't as complete as I'd like and Heat Riser is a little bonkers in some cases it's as best I could get with everything I could reasonably get. For those who like looking at those things anyway, didn't bother with SMP because of the likelyhood of tons of 50s and those are a pain to calculate, basically avoid using repeating 2C or j2C in an applicable combo, though they don't share SMP between each other, 1 of each is the limit for them in a combo without murdering it. SB gunshot also has a shockingly light SMP of 200, which I should probably put on there. (Also AoA values are definitely the same as other characters and it'd probably be 100% alright to copypaste but I don't like even assuming in the slightest, lol)

I'd be up for it too o/

If I might toss something in here showing off Adachi's high end potential, I'd want to toss in this little thing. Showin' what we can get it nigh optimal conditions, it's about as best I can get without being more impractical than need be. (already takes 125 SP, so having heat riser before it is a 'really' impractical condition, does 8.8k with it though, and KOs 9500 health characters due to poison) Notation as follows: 5C FC - iAD jC - 665B(2) - 5C - 2B - jC - 665B(3) - 5C - Sweep - 236AA - OMB - 2C - 214214B - 5B - 5C - jcJB -jcJB - j2C - 236AB(A/B) - 214214D, 8274 damage before accounting poison, does not actually k.o a 9k character, Minazuki was at 99%, I just wanted to KO the s.o.b., pardon the language. Apologies for it being something that'll likely never see the light of an actual match, but it's still there and something possibly worth learning, at the very least I'd reccommend people try to learn more Mandala routes, as difficult as they are and pretty much always requiring the corner, coupled with Ghastly Wail they can easily end a round like that.

GGs anyone I fought against today o/ Pardon the day 1 Adachi, if anyone did run into me.

Of course if I'm missing anything important feel free to point it out

Well the thing with U. Makoto is at least I can 4D her 5D onslaught, steins I can't even 4D-AT safely Can't even jump properly too I'll find a way in my spare time I suppose, and work on my U. Noel shenanigans, not that I foresee them getting much use any time soon. So much inferno dividah. So much.

Personally I'd always be up for Unlimited Tourneys, I don't get to play them against people as much as I want to. Gimmicky normal tourneys sound fun too though, especially that No Drive gimmick I heard about. I really did have fun though, perhaps a bit frustrated over the way I was knocked out, but fun nonetheless. Azure against Squirrel now though.

Oh well, it was fun.. til Stein army No regrets though. Time to just watch how this plays out. Sorry for being a drive masher myself though, tried to be somewhat stylish to compensate /o/

I got an error when I tried with that most recent invite. Weird.

Sorry sorry got called out for something urgent D: I'm still here though (As in something came up while the room poofed apparently lol)

10 minutes to go, checking in now o7 I'm able to play.

Oh oh, this sounds fun, I'd love to join. PSN:CanineV2

Oh, I suppose I should've just said Spring Raid in a non FC combo, meterless of course, but yeah I know you can do stuff off CH Spring Raid, and I've known (and seen it work) that particular blocked jD-SR setup too, it's silly with SR being an actual faux-DP now, S Starter doesn't permit much though. Just the general route into jC jD (or even 6C 5D stuff if you feel like that, I particularly like that route myself even if oftentimes it's less optimal) and whatever ender you feel like at the time. I have seen 'one' case where SR hits into later active frames though, that permits followup but.. I'm pretty sure that's not worth too much investment into learning since I'm pretty sure since it worked on Rachel it had to do with her weird hitbox as it was.

Nah, looking at hitstun it doesn't work. (@Legacy) Spring raid with no decay has 53 frames of hitstun during a FC combo, since it'll hit on the first active frame that leaves the remaining 6 active + 41 recovery for 47 frames before you can do anything after it. 53 - 47 = 6, so the only thing you can do to combo after it is 5A or 2A, the latter misses if they're too high after SR too. This is also why you can't do jack after a spring raid on non FC hit. Since without FC there's only 3 frames before they can tech when you have the option to do something, and even her supers aren't that fast. (Well Astral is but really, c'mon) tl;dr 5/2A are the only possible (meterless) ways to follow up an early SR in a FC combo. And I found that combo works in the corner as well, you just need to use 5B before going into 5C after Chamber Shot, with no need to microdash or anything. Just have to be sure Spring raid hits at about standing level so you land 5A when they're pretty close to the ground, as Chamber shot'll whiff if they're any higher, even though you can still get away with 5C until a certain height. Height requirement is the same for near corner as well. Same amount of damage using the 5B-5C route if you go for 22B ender, but I'd advise against this since knocking them down with 6B is not guarenteed due to the sheer hitstun decay at that point, I'd probably just go for 6C (2) jump oki. You can also get away with 5B-5C instead of 5C if you need to run up and don't think 5C will hit, but again I'd advise against trying to go for 6B-22B ender with this route and just do some jump mindgames after 6C(2). Damage is 3873 at that point if you opt to not do that ender.