VR-Raiden

Curious if other command grabs are getting that PRC treatment. Also did the startup change to PRC stick around? Thought I recall it being shortened. So far so good though, I'm just happy if his gameplay/confirms are mostly intact which they still sound to be. Now we wait for day of changes info.

Don't think it was mentioned in here yet, but off Kudakero |> 6P > 6HS > HSVV->TO ender, you can get the same strength GF (YRC) as BR > backdash method. Simply GF (YRC) in place after the VV, you have to forward jump to reach. Empty jump 2K is gapless on IB (tested on Bedman, 52f face up wake up). It's not as universal as BR, but if you can use that ender and want to spend meter on your oki, it's worth doing over BR > backdash. good test combo for this btw is 5D > backdash > 6HS > BB > Fafnir > dash 6P > delay 5HS > j.D > Kudakero |> 6P > 6HS > HSVV->TO EDIT: also realized you can fuzzy off j.D (RC) on block in corner as well. This lets you do stuff like low airdash j.S > j.D blocked (RC) > dash j.K fuzzy on Zato. Works on IB but only if the j.D was very low.

I did some testing on the typical BR knockdown > backdash GF (YRC) setup. I wanted to see how different wake up timings reacted to minimum height airdash j.S when they tried jumping (upback) after blocking or IB the GF. Obviously this loses to empty jump 2K, but I wanted to know how tight minimum height airdash j.S was on each timing. I didn't test all characters, just a group of those with similar wake-up timings/comboing tendencies. I tried my best to make sure I got minimum height, results I got: Normal block GF > jump results in air blocking air dash j.S: - Venom(49f) and Bedman(52f). Bedman is weird here, considering the rest of the results. Normal block GF > jump results in getting hit out of jump startup by airdash j.S: - Ky(51f), Potemkin(52f), I-no(52f), Millia(53f), Sol(53f), Slayer(54f) Normal block GF > jump results in blocking air dash j.S on ground (solid blockstring): - Elphelt(55f), Sin(58f), Chipp(58f) Instant block GF > jump results in jumping out of air dash j.S: - Ky(51f), Bedman(52f), Potemkin(52f), I-no(52f), Millia(53f), Sol(53f), Slayer(54f), Venom(49f) Instant block GF > jump results in getting hit out of jump startup by airdash j.S: - Elphelt(55f), Sin(58f), Chipp(58f) In summary, 51f-54f face up wake up characters can only jump out of minimum height airdash j.S with IB (except Bedman, weird exception but maybe error in testing). 55f and up result it in being a blockstring on normal block and getting hit out of jump startup on IB. Extra note on Potemkin: you can minimum height air dash j.K instead of j.S. This makes it tighter, so if he IB the GF and jumps, it hits him out of jump startup. What would be more important to know is which characters 6P/anti-air can beat this j.S, I want to look at that too but tested this first. Venom is the problem, you can't get empty jump 2K to be gapless on him with this setup. So he always has the 6P+HS option available. On Venom I was trying to get a setup where empty 2K was gapless, I only got it once using 6P > delay 5HS > BR ender. It was pretty inconsistent though. However if you're spaced outside throw range, as long as the 2K hits jumping on IB it's not bad, which is more easily achieved with this setup than getting 2K to be gapless. On meterless corner oki for Venom, since you don't have time to walk back out of throw range into meaty neutral jump safejump timing from a typical BR ender (you can but it's kinda tight), it's more worth it to use the 6P > delay 5HS > BR, or other advantage/pushback increase methods. That way you don't have to move at all or only very slightly to get in position and still have meaty neutral jump safejump timing.

You're right, I got j.S to fuzzy too. Thanks I'll update that. And this OS only catches her backdash in corner right? I didn't really specify but so far I've only looked at OS backdash punishes at midscreen.

Well I only consider GF YRC for oki wasteful if you do bad setups where they can fuzzy jump out or anti-air/throw OS just as easily as if you didn't use it. But maybe Sol is high enough in air in good setups to avoid getting rejected? Wishful thinking perhaps.

According to this, pushback is decreased on 1st hit of Kudakero. So which is it? http://shoryuken.com/2015/02/04/upcoming-guilty-gear-xrd-sign-arcade-changes-detailed-by-arc-system-works/

I don't think that matters much, GF YRC isn't too strong after 5HS anyway simply because you have to wait so long for them to leave blockstun. In most cases the earlier you YRC the GF the better. Delays in pressure are before you actually do GF, not necessarily how long you wait to YRC it. This seems to just make it less lenient. It could possibly hurt GF YRC in pressure but my guess is not significantly.

Use this thread to discuss Sol changes in 1.1 loketests. 1st post will be updated as info arises. Oops somehow managed to lose 1st post (on phone lol) but whatever let's use this thread so info isn't lost in gameplay discussion.

After spaced out midscreen BR, you can dashing GF into some goofy cross-up setups. Some seem harder to react to than others. The GF hits as cross-up in each recording shown. 1:BB, 2:dash jump, 3:IAD, 4:tk.BR, 5:BR YRC https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQ1DOSIeHlU EDIT: I am actually a bit puzzled as to why cross-up protection doesn't kick in for some of these.

I've been wondering about reversal BS against it. I tested it very briefly and couldn't seem to throw 2K but my timing was probably just off. Definitely need to look at it in detail (me no like reversal BS being a thing). EDIT: Yeah, tried it again and you can definitely BS the GF > throw the 2K unfortunately. So if they are doing that, spaced outside throw range options are gonna be that much more desirable.

If Bandit Revolver connects later in the animation it's better on block, that can happen from far away and especially if you crouch block it. Then you also have a 3f normal to worry about after it. So you want to do something other than crouch block it from a distance if possible, otherwise he gets more pressure.

Sounds like it, but was this on normal block of the GF? And maybe not absolute minimum height airdash j.S? which is best as far as mixing up high and low I believe. On that note I tested minimum height airdash j.S > j.D on everyone's crouch block except Sin and Leo (will test them next time I'm on PS3). A problem that can occur is j.S hits then j.D whiffs. On almost everyone with that problem, you can slightly delay the j.D to solve that issue, but j.HS instead is foolproof for slightly weaker combo followups. Delaying j.D slightly is better to do anyway to give better advantage on block after landing and be safer to bursts or Dead Angles. Results I got: Must delay j.D on - IN, MA, ZA OK on - AX, BE, CH, EL, FA, KY, PO, RA, SO, SL, VE Never works on - MI If someone has different results, or tested on Sin/Leo already feel free to share. Keep in mind this is talking about lowest possible airdash j.S > j.D, from higher up it tends to have less issues.

The neutral falling YRC doesn't seem that strong to me. I haven't looked at it in detail yet though. You can eat reversal input with it but all they have to do is put it in again if they're ready for it. I think the slowdown isn't long enough to help much vs 6P+HS OS but I could be wrong, need to look at it again. On the 6P > delay 5HS > BR GF YRC, yeah your findings match mine, but you can space yourself outside throw range by walking so 2K hits them out of their throw whiff (at no cost to the advantage of the GF, which is what the delay 5HS is accomplishing). Speaking of GF YRC, I looked at something a bit more. It is actually possible in standard ender Kudakero 6P BR to get immediate backdash GF YRC > empty jump 2K to be gapless even on IB (I didn't think it was at least). I got this on every character except Venom (49f face-up), very difficult on Ky (51f) though. You have to get the backdash, GF, AND YRC as soon as possible. I think the neutral jump outside throw range methods would still be worth knowing, since if you're 1f off it can mean the 2K is throwable. I may record this later for the hell of it and to have a reference for the timing. I know there's no gap because when I IB GF and let go of the stick, you see the ! symbol for not blocking low. That only shows if you're in stun or were blocking the wrong way unless I'm mistaken. Symbol wasn't showing when I missed the timing, and I could throw the 2K. While I'm at it some stuff that's made its way into matchup threads but not here yet iirc: On Sin and Chipp (58f) you have time to simply walk back out of throw range after standard BR corner ender into high advantage GF YRC > neutral jump (so delay 5HS isn't necessary, plus it makes BR whiff on Sin). On Potemkin, low airdash j.P and j.K hit his crouch, making it harder to react or jump out of. j.K goes to j.D so that'll leads to stronger combos and only 1f slower than j.P. and working on getting a list of characters which low airdash j.S > j.D can cause j.D to whiff on crouch hit at certain heights. Right now I know of I-no, May, Millia, Sin? Need to double check, and curious who else has noticed the problem and on what characters. Stand hit 2K > 6P range where it combos is also character specific, based on how wide their hurtbox is I'm guessing. It's pretty annoying when going for neutral jump 2K spaced out. I know of this problem on Millia and Chipp so far. EDIT: Need to correct what I said earlier for the backdash GF YRC, it's not really getting each of those out as soon as possible, if you do it too fast you can get red RC depending on wakeup time. I think the important part is getting the YRC as soon as possible after GF, so very slight delays may be needed before that point so they've started wakeup. Lowest airdash j.S still tends to lose to IB 6P's, but they're less inclined to do that if they can't OS it with throw since 2K hits that. Here's a vid demonstating it on Venom (gap) and Ky (no gap): http://youtu.be/l9QMJLNk86w This post keeps going but...another element to fuzzy guards in corner. If you do the usual higher j.S > j.D to possibly hit them for switching to low block too early, you can fuzzy off that j.D too. So then they'd have 3 high hits to block in a row. Works really well with dash momentum, not so well without. If the j.D hits your fuzzy attempt will combo and you can continue.

That stuff will get added eventually, it's important in any fighter. The reason you see more of just hard data in these threads so far is that it's easily verified in training, the rest takes a lot of time/experience/discussion. And we have a rather sad amount of matchup discussion going on but that's par for the course these days. People are still learning matchups though including myself so it's understandable. But thanks for sharing your own input, it pretty much matches my current knowledge of it. Some other 5HS shooting over your head punishes are listed in the 2nd post here that can work, but not quite as far out as GV.

I wouldn't say this match is bad necessarily, we have some good things for it that many others don't. It's scary though for sure. Her backdash is easily one of the better ones in the game and can be very hard to punish without a hard read like running 5K (if they get predictable with it that's not so uncommon). Sometimes your best bet is to just chase it and trying to apply more pressure and drive her to corner. Low airdash j.P should hit it if they do it on your safejump every time. You can also just put an OS dash in to get close. For dealing with her normals at neutral, I recommend reading Teyah's first post in her matchup thread to see it from her perspective. To deal with her f.S, we have dashing 2D. To deal with our 2D, she has her own 2D at max range. To deal with her max range 2D, we have f.S and 5HS. Anti-air 5K works well usually but not if they are higher up and pin you in the face. Just be mindful of her height/angle when you decide to use it. Speaking of pin, lots seem to talk as if pin is a lot less useful, which is true I'm sure, but I still fear it and treat it similarly. Try to avoid it, even blocking is not ideal since then she gets pressure. Usually jump or highjump back will dodge if you think they're about to throw it. Backdash too but it can catch if you did it too early. Once pin is gone I find her a lot less scary in neutral, keep track of where it is and guard it. Don't get too defensive though. If they're dashing/flying around an excessive amount, ground BR, Fafnir, and Kudakero can be good at stuffing movement and bringing her to ground. GF doesn't feel too useful to me in the match outside of pressure (and feels weaker there too) because she's so fast. When you do land hits you must get the knockdown if possible and stick to her at all costs. Round start is kinda like neutral at her max 2D range. If you think they'll go for that, CH f.S and 5HS can work. Dash 2D will go under a lot including f.S. BR can catch jumping around. Or to play it safer you can just dash brake or stay put and low instant block. Watch some vids of better Sol's and see if you can understand the thought process going on in different situations. There's a lot to this matchup and maybe others can correct me on anything or chime in.

This video shares some tips for timing reversals. If you don't have a good feel for the timing, these cues can help you learn. In a match it may be hard to always watch for them, but I find them helpful. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJs3rd-4174

Note you can only YRC or PRC a hit that kills the shadow. That means no VV RC or Dead Angle RC anymore. GV RC wouldn't work either. TR YRC is probably the only safe-ish invulnerable option to kill it when you have 75%. It seems harder to kill the shadow now that he can send it underground to dodge GF. Also you have to air FD Nobiru (shadow anti-air).

2S is very strong in neutral, more than before now that his 2HS range sucks. If he forward dashes through it you recover in time to throw him. It easily stops Dandy Step stuff or typically recovers in time to block if he managed to dodge it. It can stop Mappas too. He can beat it with well timed Mappa or 5K, but it seems like his 5K can't outrange it, need to double check that or any other ways he might have of dealing with it. I don't think his 6HS is a problem here either. GF is useful as always in neutral and pressure, since he's mostly mobile on ground. His j.HS doesn't bounce on CH anymore either so even if he punished one with that you aren't hurting as bad. He can forward dash through but if you YRC'd it's easy to punish. Safejump oki gets complicated with his numerous BDC/Dandy wake-up options. It's still good but you need some fancy OS to keep him pinned well. I have been looking at a bunch but need to iron them out more before posting. GF oki is good since it can shut down pretty much everything. If you get cornered, for the love of Sol be careful trying to poke your way out. His normals can dominate here. Safest bet is FD and look for chances to superjump or otherwise out.

You can CH 6P or VV horizontal dolphins. 2D whiffs under them. If you were close enough you can IB > (dash) f.S punish on block iirc (double checking). Vertical dolphins can also be CH 6P or VV. 2D looks useful here though, it dodges the dolphin and hits May. Done early enough it will be CH and combos to BB. I like how this option looks because you have more time to react with it, and it reaches farther horizontally in case they were trying whiff into low. Also the input can't be crossed up if she happened to go over you. These are also punishable with f.S on block (double checking if IB required). Speaking of dolphins if you happen to CH f.S or 2D her out of their startup, it will typically be air hit and combo to BB. Just a weird thing that can happen in this matchup. You can 2D under her j.2HS but unless you time it perfectly so it connects as she lands (forcing her to block it), it doesn't look great. If you did it too early and whiff, you recover after her it seems and can get thrown. Might get away with it but better to time it so it connects, if you weren't already ready with stronger punishes like CH 6P or VV. Oh and Kudakero is wonky on her. Can connect extremely far out from corner and tends to whiff 2nd hit if you were anywhere close to being deep. General rule seems to be nj.D in any combos where you normally fj.D, and deep dashing j.D, j.K (JC) > bj.D (or just don't get dash momentum) in any combos where you normally deep dashing j.D, j.K (JC) > nj.D. Best answer to beach ball seems like just jump IB it. You can destroy it with GF and 2nd hit of Kudakero but neither of which are easy get away with.

Didn't know this until recently but his 236HS, the long electric stab, will blow right through GF and hit you so watch out for that. Absorbs it like Axl DP. I also managed to CH 6P that move once but I was pretty close. I'm curious how far away that would work, will have to look at it, although probably pretty risky to try for. The full charge version of it can't be GV under surprisingly so if he's charging it don't try that. It reaches the floor.

Fafnir feels strong in neutral in this match. If you mix it in well with dash f.S and 2D to beat her sword f.S especially. It can whiff punish her 2S which she might do to hit 2D. You just need to watch for the fast horizontal set sword cause that can hit you out of it. If set swords are mid swing and she gets hit or has to block Fafnir, they stop swinging. GF seems pretty bad in neutral because giant swords everywhere and her high mobility. Seems hard to keep her cornered, her high jump goes extremely high and she has a far airdash. You have to respect her j.P air-to-air up close, move is gigantic and fast. Unless you wanna air VV lol. Same speed as our j.P so if you clash j.P with it I think you can both repeatedly mash j.P clashes. If she has sword, don't bait throw with jumps, the 4HS hits straight up really high. Look for the +3 string overhead. It's only doable in 2 of her strings so once you get the hang of it it isn't that hard to see. They also seem to prefer it over the low options in those places so if you have to guess, high would be a good bet. If you can 5K or VV it that's good, since it is +3 on block. Also a probably pretty important punish, if you IB her 2K>2KK (spin kicks) it's a f.S punish.

Oh that would explain why I never got better than a trade with his K. iirc 5K beat his P but I haven't looked in a bit.

Seems like you can bully him at f.S range. His mobility is terrible so GF has more use in neutral, just be wary of the projectiles going through it. The big one can be GV under, or CH BB over it if close enough. He can YRC though. If he does it with YRC and chases after, jump and IB it for some meter or try to avoid it. After the air special to Brynhildr stance, he's +1 according to wiki. I've found 5K to trade or beat any buttons he presses after that except D, the counter, or combo Overdrive. so you can throw that in there. He might be able to whiff punish it if he just backs up, I'd have to check.

Pretty much never a good idea to throw GF out anywhere in this match without YRC. He will IAD CH j.D your face in. Not to mention he can avoid it so easily with his mobility. Pick your times to press buttons very carefully. He's really good at whiff punishing you for stuff you throw out.

I looked at this briefly before. It results in crouching FD though on sideswap so in reality is it worth worrying about? If I recall correctly, if he does 4214/6236S+HS to get high FD, he gets Grand Viper on the sideswap which is really bad. I suppose he could switch to high block right after the 3/1S+HS input if there was time.