Balguna

A couple things I picked up from toying around in the lab: -5D/2D have different starting item orders, but 2D also throws the item further, like in P4A. -If you hold D long enough for Kintoki-Douji to throw two items, you can press D again to throw a third item before he disappears. -Mystery Teddie SP actually has differences between the two versions. The A version throws the items with increasing distance, while the B version throws with decreasing distance. So if both orders are on Robot Deacon, with the A version, the Deacon will be closest, the Oil Drum in the middle, and the Motorcycle Key the furthest away, with the inverse for the B version (the order the items are thrown are still the same). -Despite what the frame data says, you can actually OMC Nihil Hand (the initial hit), but only on block. I'll probably stick it in the combo thread at some point, but here's a gimmicky Mystery Teddie SP item reset: 5AA 236A 236236A (Vanish Ball, Vagna, Muscle Drink) 5AA AoA AoA mash etc. The idea is to use AoA in conjunction with the robot for a high-low at the same time. This also ends up pushing the opponent into the Muscle Drink, so you can delay the AoA mash for just a tiny bit to get a reset. Since Teddie's obscured by the Vanish Ball, it's also harder to see the mix-up and you could even just not do AoA if you suspect the opponent is going to mash DP. You can do 5AAA 236B (autocombo) leading up to the 236236A as well; the resulting 5AA is harder to combo, but it's not a big deal since it'll just mean a 5AA blockstring into the high-low mixup. It'll also push the opponent into the corner from midscreen, so you can use the D fatal ender for some big damage.

There isn't really a lot of Teddie activity, so I don't know how much interest there would be, but if there are enough people wanting to get one going it'd be worth a shot.

Depends on what kind of combos. Mitsuru, Sho, Minazuki, Kanji and Teddie have easy midscreen BnBs (Mitsuru's is basically her autocombo), but someone like Marie has easier higher-damage corner combos since her combos have very similar sections for each of them, just pieced together differently or with extra moves. It also does depend on your playstyle. Charge characters like Mitsuru, or timed releases like Yukiko, can be easy for some and a pain for others.

Best guess is you're either doing j.C too low (such as if you hit them with the tip of its hitbox) or too high (ideally both of you should be just above the ground during j.C). You should be buffering the 2369B during the j.C. to optimize the chances of hitting afterwards. The opponent's position prior to 2C might be a factor - I haven't tested to see if the timing is different for an air FC instead of a ground one. The combo should also work with a j.2C FC. I haven't really needed a backdash if you do the j.A while jumping forward, but that's just in the lab.

It's mentioned above; the ideal 2C Fatal is 2C > j.A > j.B > j.A > j.C > t.k. 236B > 5AAA > j.A > j.A > j,B/j.236A. It's a bit hard on the execution, but very solid on damage. If you want corner carry (since t.k.236B sideswaps), 2C > j.A > j.B > j.A > j.C > 5C > d.c. > 2B > j.A > j.A > j.B/j.236A works as well. For those playing Shadow Teddie, this should be your standard BnB midscreen: 5AA > 2B > j.A > j.B > j.A > 2B > j.A > j.A > j.B. Respectable damage for Teddie (does more than standard Teddie's BnBs for the most part) and builds plenty of meter. Corner BnB will likely be 5AAA > j.C > 5B > 5C > 2B > j.A > j.A > j.B. The 5AA > 5B > s.j.C route is still available, but for Shadow Teddie, in my opinion the much better SP gain from the first combo (builds over 40 meter) is worth the slight loss of damage. I'll probably get to finishing updating the wiki at some point. It's just been busy lately and I've been playing with other characters as well. In the meantime, have the Shadow Teddie combos in the video above, transcribed: Corner 5AAA > j.C > 5B > 5C > 2C > Shadow Fury > 236236[D] > 2AB > j.236B > j.236A > j.236236[D] > 214A > j.236A > ]D[ > 236236[C] > 214214AB 5729 damage + 2 counts of Poison j.C > dash > 5B > 5C > 2C > Shadow Fury > 236236[D] > 2AB > J.236B > j.236A > j.236236[D] > 214A > j.236A > ]D[ > j.236A > j.236236[D] > 214A > j.236A > ]D[ > 214214AB 8207 damage + 4 counts of Poison 2C FC > 236C > 5B > j.236B > 2A > 214A > Shadow Fury > j.C > 5C > s.j.236A > 236236[D] > 2AB > 214A > ]D[ > j.236A > j.236236[D] > 214A > j.236A > ]D[ > 236236[C] > 214214AB 8174 damage + 6 counts of Poison 2C FC > 5D (Parachute Bomb) > 5B > t.k.236A > 2A > 214A > Shadow Fury > j.C > land > 214A > j.236A > Parachute Bomb hits > j.236236[D] > 2AB > 214A > ]D[ > 5C > s.j.236A > j.236236[D] > 214A > j.236A > ]D[ > 236236[C] > 214214AB 8481 damage + 8 counts of Poison 2C FC > 5B > j.C > j.B > 236C > 5B > 236C > j.A > j.236A > 2A > 5B > 5C > d.c. > 5B > 236D > Shadow Fury > 236236[D] > 236D > 5B > 236CD > 236236[D] > 236D > 2AB > s.j.236A > j.236236[D] > 214A > ]D[ > 214214AB 7780 damage + 2 counts of Poison Carries opponent from corner to corner Back against corner j.B FC > air dash > j.A > 236C > 5B > 236D > 2B > 5B > t.k.236A > 2A > 214A > Shadow Fury > j.C > 5C > s.j.236A > j.236236[D] > 2AB > 214A > ]D[ > j.236A > j.236236[D] > 214A > ]D[ > 236236AB (Dry Ice, Vanish Ball, Lightning Drum, Amagiya Buckets) > 214214AB 6930 damage + 6 counts of Poison + Panic Sideswaps opponent into the corner

Multi-hits don't cause any more scaling than single ones (though for some moves you to have to cancel a multi-hit move earlier), unlike Marvel, it all depends on the proration. j.A does have SMP, but it isn't very noticeable in shorter combos and doing a j.A > j.B > j.A extension adds more damage overall because of the extra j.B you tack on in the combo.

You can use Arrow Rain in oki in some cases, but generally it's also used to launch enemies in longer combos or to keep enemies in hitstun long enough for Risette: Live on Stage. It's worth looking at some combo videos online, which should also help in learning new BnBs, but the two you've listed are good neutral options. If you want damage, you can substitute Rock You for No Touching into Hysterical Slap. Scan can be used in neutral, but you can land it in situational mid-air combos. There should be some in the combo thread. As for her neutral, it really depends on who she's fighting. Rise really just suffers midrange, where it's too unsafe to get 2C/scan out. She does have some good normals, you just have to space well and keep an eye on Himiko since she's very vulnerable whenever she does a move.

1. You just have to delay the input. 2. Just checking to see if you have the right combo - are you talking about AoA combos (which is A+B), or throw combos (C+D)? If it's the latter, the input is CD > 5B > s.j.C > j.B > j.A > etc. In either case, it might be because it's an invalid combo (if you set the dummy to recover and block after the first attack, it should fix that issue).

Yes. Teddie's combo rate was buffed, so the chain is easier to do now. It's a staple for extending combos and corner carry off some anti-airs, or moves like 5C. Shadow Teddie can also do 5AA > j.A > j.B > j.A > j.A > j.B as well.

You're most likely either doing 5B too early or teleporting at the wrong time. It's just one of those combos where you have to feel out the timing.

Midscreen TVs FC combo: FC 236C/D/CD > 236C > j.A > 2B > j.A > j.A > j.B > j.A > j.C > j.236B The j.236B can be pretty hard to connect; one could just go for j.236A after the j.A in that case. If you manage to hit them with 2B low enough so that you can do the j.A > j.B > j.A > j.C > tk236B > 5AAA > j.A > j.A > j.236A, then that's much more damage, but I wouldn't bet on it.

Couldn't you do safe jumps for Teddie and Chie at least, since their DPs are counters? Possibly Naoto as well, and Labrys/Shabrys because that DP is pretty bad.

Went back to Yukiko for a little bit because Flame Dance combos seems easier. With the tweaks to her moves though some quick questions: 1. Should I be using SB Flame Dance combos whenever possible, or conserving for Agidynes? It seems Agidyne finishers aren't that impressive now without notable Fire Boosts. 2. Does she have a good corner carry combo that puts her in a good position to maintain close range pressure? 3. Is the Kanji matchup more slanted in his favour now? Primal Force seems to shut down most of Yukiko's tools outside of 4/5/6D, weakening her zoning greatly.

Throwing items is more risky now, since Kintoki-Douji stays out longer. Against characters like Chie and Akihiko, you should be fine. That said, if you really need a 'safe way' to throw out items, super jump j.2C > j.D is relatively hard to punish. Only Yukiko, Junpei, Aigis and Kanji can punish that from full screen without meter reliably. As for the new items, Motorcycle Key is arguably the best due to its great use in neutral. It causes spin state, so if the opponent isn't aware to tech it you can combo into a throw from it, but it's not really worth it that much to do so. The blue robot hits low, so you could do a pseudo-unblockable with AoA, but it's pretty odd timing to do so especially in a blockstring. There'll likely be more discoveries in the months ahead.

I don't have footage, but essentially you want to hit the opponent with j.C. as low to the ground as possible, which should allow you to go t.k. Bearscrew into 5AA. I'd do the j.A. right around when they're starting to fall from 2C. It's tricky timing though, so if that's too hard, you can just go j.A > j.B > j.A > j.C > 5C > d.c > 2B > j.A > j.A > j.B for about 3.8k. Or if you can't get the 5C down either, j.C > dash > 2B > j.A j.A j.B for ~3.4k. Note that the combo side-swaps after the t.k. Bearscrew, so if you want to push the opponent into the corner instead, skip the 2369B. Ending the combo with 5AAA > 214214B ends the combo at around 5.6k for 50 meter. Another quick few: j.C CH > 5C > d.c. > j.A > j.B > j.A > 2B > j.A > j.A > j.B. 3134 damage, 21 SP Note: If you them with j.C or 5C too high, you'll have to settle for 5C > d.c. > 2B > j.A > j.A > j.B. This combo can also technically be done without a CH, but you have to do j.C very close to the ground and you'll have to do the 2B combo after the dash cancel, for 2.6k. Alternatively, you can just do: j.C > t.k. 236A 1673 damage, 9 SP j.C > 236D 1499 damage, 8 SP The latter can lead to Tomahawk if needed. 236B (CH) > 236A 2011 damage, 10 SP j.236A > OMC > j.A > j.B > j.A > 2B > j.A > j.A > j.B ~2800 damage j.236B > OMC > 5AA > j.A > j.B > j.A > 2B > j.A > j.A > j.B 3167 damage Also usable with 236B, for about 200 less damage. j.236A/j.236B (air hit) > OMC > j.A > j.B > j.A > j.236A 2677 damage (j.236A starter)/2912 damage (j.236B starter)

Anyone got a list of her Fatal Counters and Recoveries?

It's a nice idea in theory for Hassou Tobi, but I presume that if Margaret has multi-hitting moves she'll need to watch out for them during combos.

That sounds useful at least, and it's an option if you're not in a position to do either missile combo. Plus it should be unburstable after Mystery Food due to Silence. I might try to go to the lab with Shadow Teddie sometime and work out some of his cancels. He would have loved regular Teddie's autocombo, though; 5AAA 214A would have been nice for him for corner carry and to make up for his lackluster damage, plus it allows him to easily cancel into Sweep > Shadow Fury combos. Interestingly, it seems S. Teddie's 5AAA isn't cancellable into j.2C, though it can be cancelled into j.C. I'm also working on some standard blockstrings for Teddie, but a simple frametrap is 5AA > hop cancel > j.A. Beats mashers who try to do anything but DP.

My personal opinion on Yukiko is that she didn't get the same amount of treatment most of the cast have. Quite a few characters got anti-zoning tools (Kanji, Mitsuru, Teddie), but Yukiko didn't get a good close-range option or defensive tool; the only real close range buff she got was her throw's startup time being reduced. Dancing Flames helped her keep her zoning distance, but she still has no good reversals to try to force opponents away aside from Maragidyne. Yukari also has horrible defense but she at least has a fast 5A, while Naoto's gameplay shifted to a more all-rounder.

Is this the first time they've used a Shadow character for the combo examples? Unless they really couldn't find anything for Mitsuru.

It can be tricky to define an anti-air. Aigis' 2B, for instance, is a very solid tool for controlling the air despite it being blockable and no head invul. On the flipside, I have difficulty using Teddie's 2B as an anti-air against characters such as Yosuke because of its angle of attack, despite having everything normally associated with an anti-air. 2C has no head invul or air unblockability, but its sheer range tends to give it more use as a defensive anti-air. I'd probably consider there to be two kinds: offensive ones or defensive ones. Mitsuru's Bufuydne would likely fit into both.

Maybe put down different reasons for using any particular variant; ease of execution, corner carry, connects more reliably at certain ranges, etc. If they wanted to drill the more effective combos, it's up to them, or if they want reliability, they can certainly go for the ones that are more forgiving on execution.

No FC combos yet, but here are a few more things for random neutral situations: 2C s.j.A j.B j.A j.236A 2732 damage 5C d.c. j.A j.B j.A 2B j.A j.A j.236A 2992 damage, 20 SP If starting around midscreen, can do j.236236C j.236B afterwards for 4104 damage total. You can extend this further by going: 5C d.c. j.A j.B j.A 2B j.A j.A j.236A j.236236C j.236B OMB 214214B 5791 damage, -100 SP, -Burst 2AB OMC 66 5AAA j.A j.B j.A j.A j.236A ~3052 damage Pushes opponent to the corner from midscreen. 5AAA 2AB OMC 66 5AAA j.A j.B j.A j.A j.B 5AAA 236B OMC 5AAA 2AB Alternative options if you need your opponent in the corner while Persona broken; pushes them to the corner from midscreen. The second combo does slightly less damage, but builds more meter before the OMC. 236AB 5AAA j.A j.B j.A j.A j.236A 2243 damage, -25 SP To get 5AAA to connect, you have to hold down 5AA so it pushes the opponent slightly further away. Incidentally, after toying around it seems you can use 236B as an alternative option to 2AB for missile combo extenders for about the same damage. It's slightly easier to connect from what I've found, but your mileage may vary.

Personally I don't think 5B losing backdash was too bad; it's still cancellable into 2D Teddie on block, it still gets punished by rolls with or without that ability, and now 2B and 2C can be backdashed. We probably gained more than we lost. 236236A/B existing is a bit annoying at times when I'm being panicky and mashing quarter-circles, but overall I think Teddie has more tools, situational or not, than he did in the first game, which is always good.

5D/2D and the DP nerf are Teddie's biggest hits. Fatal Recovery on Bearscrew as well and missile disappearing if he gets hit, so overall it does feel like his neutral game got toned down slightly. Still, aside from that overall Teddie feels stronger - Nihil Hand gives him a much needed reversal and Persona-less combo ender, his corner carry is stronger, and his item order takes some getting used to but the Key Bike is very good and the rest are at least decent in neutral. His combos are slightly harder now but not overly so. Incidentally, played around today and found a solution to Teddie's challenge 25 (use Nihil Hand three times), arguably slightly easier than the official method. Start by putting yourself with your back against the corner. Then do the notations: 2C 214214B 5AA 5B 5C 2B OMB AC 5AA 214214B 214214B For the first two 214214Bs, you want to hit Yu as high as possible without triggering the perfect hit; this causes the wallstick to last longer and give you more time to pick up with 5A. You want to do an Evasive Action (AC) after the OMB to put yourself back against the corner again. After that it's fairly simple.