Teyah

Copying some posts over from the Dizzy forum that discuss the other side of this matchup:

Moving some defensive notes from the matchups thread: Vs Jam, Dizzy, Millia.. basically any character who spends a decent amount of time in the air: Defense is key. - Avoid spamming drills at neutral, this will get horribly eaten by an opponent who sees the huge opening for an IAD. - Limit your air time. Avoid flight in close; chances are that your opponent will have far better priority/more damaging setups/better reward from random air to air hits than you. Superjumps can still be a good way to move around if you have to, provided you're not predictable with when/where/if you airdash. Covering yourself with j.K near the landing of your sj is usually safe. Regular jump-back j.D mixed with jump-back, AD back j.K cover is another movement option you have. - Watch for predictable air patterns from mid-far range, throw out early Shadow Summon -> Nobiru when you see your opponent jump and suspect a followup dj or late AD. Risk/reward is in Eddie's favour since on CH, your followup 6P(2) -> shadow combo leads to about one third of their life + good stun damage. If spaced correctly, this is hard to punish well on whiff since the Nobiru takes up so much space and may even act as a meat shield. The alternative to Shadow Summon S is try for an early 6P/2H antiair... both of which are much faster, but leave you open to if your opponent just lands and doesn't AD or move in. And of course, you can always just reposition yourself if you want, as explained above..

If the enemy is too low or has a strange hitbox, j.D might whiff on them at the end. If the enemy is too high but has a nice hitbox that allows for it, j.D may be techable on hit but j.H xx S Pin will not be. Also, j.H xx S Pin, land 6H xx H Disc allows you a more meaty disc and leaves you at the perfect range to not get thrown out of your 6K or 2K/2S, while also allowing you to pick up your Pin immediately. Not much of a downside to this, if you're close enough to pull it off.

Hm you're right DH, Eddie's shadow doesn't freeze at all when he does his air super - or if it does, it's for a very very short time. For the ground super, the shadow freezes [edit] almost as usual, but gets to move a few frames before it normally should. For Eddie's IK, the superfreeze for the shadow is very short (shorter than for the enemy). If the enemy Eddie does super / IK, superfreeze time is as it should be; the opposing Eddie's shadow is frozen, though the Eddie performing the super / IK can move his own shadow early. In other situations with any other character performing super freeze on Eddie/shadow, everything behaves as normal. Very strange stuff, seems like a bug with Eddie since it applies to all of his superfreeze moves to varying degrees.

Eddie has a key super? And no, Eddie's shadow is not a projectile, it stays frozen during super freeze.

Oh there it is. One more nonsense hitbox problem you can add is the basic Eddie command grab -> puddle combo not working in the corner against Axl. You have to do it like a #R-style mine unblockable, otherwise Axl gets OTGed immediately by the puddle because of his spread eagle air hitbox. As with any Eddie j.S + something UB there is always a slight chance for error on Eddie's side, and Axl's chances of escape are better since he can wakeup super through the UB attempt. Though Eddie will usually land and block in time, it's better than getting dizzied and killed.

Good review overall. Maybe add info about the neutral / far-screen game? It's also important to note that 6H goes over Eddie's best ground pokes, those being 2P, 2S, and drills. It also flat out beats 5P at medium range. 6H also builds a ton of guard guage for you in the meantime, and leaves you about even and in close, where your 5K and 2K can avoid Eddie's close-range pokes (2P/5P/5Sf) quite easily. Eddie can't reactionary 6P an Axl 6H, because it hits deep enough to go through the upperbody invul. It's also very difficult to react and beat a 6H with a mid-range poke such as Eddie 5P or 5Sf, since those pokes are both sort of slow at 6F of startup. That means you have to react in 16F or less to the 6H if you want to beat it out, which is very difficult and not worth the risk. This leaves Eddie with only random early 2H or 5Sf to punish this move, which are both easily baitable by doing anything else. Oh, you also forgot to mention that Axl cannot be IKed out of his dizzy animation. That's a big plus.

4r5 - I think JOFan means is suggesting one matchup thread with one large post per character, sort of like what Kyle has done over at the May forums.

To easily get around Dizzy's AA (which isn't too great), you just need to use the Pin to make your opponent wary of trying to AA you. A simple way to do this against AA-happy players is to IAD in as if you're going to attack, then throw the Pin just before you land. This should CH and stagger them, and you can follow up with your double AD -> j.S -> land 5S-2H, aircombo. If you're finding it a bit hard to time AD j.S -> land 5S, you can try using AD j.K-P-K land 5S-2H, or just land from your CH Pin and do 5S-2H. To get rid of fish that are hanging around, you can just 5P them. If it's a low laser fish, you can either block, or double AD forward/back and Turbofall to descend safely if you have to. Just run or crouch under high laser fish. Roll also evades every fish. To beat the floating spike, it is pretty slow moving so as long as you are constantly shifting around (via BD, FD break) you should be fine. If the Dizzy is using it as a shield and you feel like attacking, just run up and throw her, or hitconfirm a 6P (to 6H or Emerald Rain on hit, or Roll on block) if she tries to poke you as you run in. If not, just block - there's nothing wrong with being patient since you should be able to avoid the fish quite easily anyway. Sure. Yes, on the way up - and yes, they do have enough time to recover and block. That's why I said you get a free mixup, not a free combo. :P You won't even need the Pin to mixup after a whiffed poke, if you were in the air - just jump or AD in with a j.S, which they will block. Then you can either ADC that j.S into high attacks, such as j.K-S, j.S, or j.K-P-K. Or, you can land and go low with 2K-5S (into 2H if you hit, or 2S -> jump-cancel stuff if they block). Or land and throw them. Well... you can just wakeup Winger super if you want to be an ass and beat out stuff, but don't expect that kind of stuff to fly too often against any competent player. It's also a bad habit to get into due to the riskiness of the move, so I'd advise patience and blocking instead.

Keep your hands 'lower' on the joystick while performing the commands - stay away from the 7/8/9 directions as much as possible while still getting the moves out. If you're failing because you are now doing something like 321 instead of 63214, slightly adjust your motions to go more vertical until you become familiar with the stick's amount of sensitivity. For the psp's analog stick.. same idea I guess. But if that thing sucks as much as the psp d-pad, it could just be a design flaw in the hardware.

Millia doesn't really specialize in beating out other characters' grounded moves (generally), so outpoking is usually out of the question. Also, risk/reward is usually not in your favour when you try to beat out moves since Millia can be so much more effective when advancing from the air. The only realistic way for Millia to beat stuff like a 2D is with her own 2D (outside of enemy's range) or with a point-blank low attack that goes active before the enemy's attack does. The first option is decent and especially good to use when you don't have Pin, the second isn't really advised at all since you don't get anything off of it and it is far too risky. I guess you could 6K over a 2D too, but again that's just not safe at all. This is exactly right. If you sense a poke coming, just jump and react to if it comes out (free mixup if it does), if it doesn't then you can AD back or use Pin and mixup from there. Or you can use dash breaking: dash in, then stop (FD) just out of range of the poke you're expecting, then dash back in after it whiffs. Once you're in their face, a 2K/throw mixup can be effective to score decent damage and knockdown, or you can just throw them outright if their whiffed poke has enough recovery.

Be patient, don't give her opportunities to CH you into her B&B combos. Don't risk moving in without the shadow at neutral - it's easy to eat a 5H CH if you are too aggressive, or get pressured by dolphin FB / whiff-dolphin grab shenanigans. -S- is a huge help in getting aerial May to the ground where you can mix her up. Get her to block something, gatling to 2S-22H to keep her pinned, then -K- to move in with the mixup. Always use 6P as your antiair, it works in all scenarios except for when May is very deep in and coming down with j.2H. Do not even try 2H, it gets stuffed by most or all of May's jump-ins. On defense: When you get knocked down, block low for a few frames and then FD jump away to avoid her command grab if you sense it coming. If you're decent at guessing her grab attempts (as that's her only real way to force damage on you), you can 2P-2D to interrupt them and then unblockable her into potential stun -> death. Backdashing is also a decent way to get space from her, as it's hard for May to convert a random mid-distance ground hit to any sort of damage or a setup.

Huh? I wasn't implying that you were trying to / should preemptively punish 2D, I was just saying that a 2D as oki is very, very weak and can simply be blocked or escaped very easily. As for outright punishing a blocked 2D, it's not really possible against most characters. What you DO get every time though, is frame advantage that you can spend to either position yourself, escape any further pressure, or move in for a mixup. This can all be done by blocking for the first few frames of wakeup, then doing either a Backdash, or FD Jump to escape. And if you can't block 5D on reaction, this has the added bonus of getting you out of any rudimentary 2D/5D mixup that Jam may be trying. And if you choose to just block the 2D - which you should, most of the time - you can forward dash or IAD in (have Pin ready) since you are able to act before Jam. However note that Jam has many outs from a 2D, she can just jump-cancel away (or towards) you if you block it. If she lets it recover, you won't be close enough to connect with anything meaningful, so use the opportunity to move in. If she JCs forward, just AA her with 5P, 6P-2H, or j.K, if she jumps anywhere else, either reposition yourself for a mixup or go for the AA.

Just block, seriously. Block low as you wake up, and if a trip doesn't come immediately you can probably just shift to a high block (or better yet, backdash) since it sounds like your roommate is pretty predictable with these things. You can also FD jump to escape - just block low just as you're getting up, then perform 2147+PK to jump off the ground instantly while flashing FD. Also.. a standalone 2D doesn't lead to anything, so it shouldn't really make a huge difference whether you get hit or not. You would have to eat like 20 of them to die. While every time you land a hit, you should be able to force a mixup (if he blocks) or combo into basic ADC stuff for 30% damage / knockdown. If you can't do this just yet, hit training mode over and over while watching match vids for a visual example of what you should generally be doing in neutral situations. Also, 2K-2H gatlings, but does not combo. You have to go through a 5S or 2S first (eg. 2K-5S-2H).

My sig is an actual Eddie quote from the game. Such arrogance! And you mean the upwards kick from D-Step, yeah? I think it's called Crosswise Heel, and it has huge recovery at the end. You can pretty much just run up and do anything (short of a 6H) to hit him. Frame data lists it as -14, so 2H -> aircombo should do just fine.

Millia's backdash, being quick and moving her a good amounts backwards, is a safe way of dealing with D-step followups in general. Backdash out of the way, then reposition yourself to move in during his recovery time if he throws out a move. As for the kick followup itself, don't try to hit him out of it. If you know it's coming, just block it then run in and throw him or hit him afterwards.

Forward Megafist -> PB is like the oldest Potemkin mixup ever, even the XX CPU did it. You shouldn't really have a problem with this since it leaves Potemkin at a big frame disadvantage. Megafist forward is -4 on block so you can just block then backdash to escape for free, since Pot won't be able to catch you during your backdash. However since Megafist is pretty slow, you should be able to IB it on reaction to seeing it come out. If you do this, you can quite easily punish with a 5S -> Emerald Rain, or 5S-5H(-2D) if you don't have meter. You can also just block and TK a Pin (which is way faster than -4 and Heat Knuckle), then use that to move in.

Can somebody please upload all of the following vids onto a direct http site? (eg. megaupload, sendspace, etc) If you've already got these saved, it should be quick and easy.. http://www.filebank.co.jp/guest/trfggxx/fp/trfac password: nakanotrf http://www.filebank.co.jp/guest/trfggxx/fp/acoff password: nakanotrf http://www.filebank.co.jp/guest/trfggxx/fp/nakano password: nakanotrf http://www.filebank.co.jp/guest/honnnori/fp/abc password: neyagawa Many thanks! Also, thanks to rtl for posting up the latest Korean 5-on-5 tournament vids before I could ask.

Many thanks for translating Millia, PO. While most of that seems fairly accurate, I have to take issue with a couple of things: Rank should be much lower, C at most, probably closer to C-. f.S = good, but hitconfirming that into Emerald Rain requires extreme closeness, 50%, and a CH. Not too reliable, given the many conditions needed. j.D/j.H should probably be listed as decent pokes, as they give the best rewards for the risk involved, 2D aside. 6H is not really a good poke at all, as it leaves you open for much too long and does not do enough damage to be worth risking against an IAD/dash punish. Also has only decent priority and gives up momentum since you can't follow it with anything meaningful on block. I hope "General speed" refers to Millia's movement speed and not poke speed, because her effective pokes are some of the slowest in the game. 2D = 13F, j.D = 11F, j.H = 11F, 5Sf = 7F, 6H = 16F... Change "two" to "one" - only Chipp has lower defense. (Unless they're counting Kliff ) (Bacon = 1.17, Millia = 1.21, Chipp = 1.30) I'd always considered Millia vs Slayer to be even (or close to it) in both #R and Slash. The endgame #R tierlist even lists it as 11-9 in Millia's favour, so shrug

Run up on enemy wakeup as if you're going to do something, then FD to cut your running momentum short and remain out of normal grab range. Then use command grab just as their 9F of wakeup throw invulnerability expires.

I agree completely, lol Then stop spreading GG-related misinformation

"Frame delay"... I guess you mean super freeze. Since Millia's IK does not activate DURING super freeze, you can completely block it on reaction to seeing the screen freeze. This goes for every single non-throw IK in the game, as well as 99% of all supers in the game (Order-Sol's Savage Fang and Slayer's Dead on Time are exemptions, possibly one or two others). This is in AC; in GGXX, no super/IK had this property. Not to mention that if you were blocking while getting up before the freeze, you'd be able to block anyway. Try it and you'll see, this is pretty basic stuff. And no, there is no way to combo into Millia's 6H on the ground, aside from a 6P CH.

Doing good so far If Slayer dashed forward, you just lost If your opponent is anyone else, you just lost 20-70% life and are put into a disadvantageous position. While your IK bar eats away at your remaining health. 5S-6H is not a combo. You do know that Millia's IK is completely blockable? Just hold back while getting up or at any time. Oh, and Millia's IK is homing, not close range. If anything, it's far-range, because it takes the same number of frames to activate, regardless of where the opponent is. The only character who has near-guaranteed combos into stun -> IK is Eddie, and even those are situational. Possibly May as well, but those are less practical. Of course, this is all considering that you are playing against a decent opponent who knows what they are doing. If you're talking about the cpu, then arguing about the brokeness of IKs is pretty pointless because the cpu is pretty retarded anyway.

The teacup comments were edited out and replaced long ago, actually. I'd also like to say thanks to POscrub for the huge amount of time he's spent translating all of this info, as well as the Slash and AC framedata in the past. It's a big service to the community.

Limited guard will not guard the first sequence of attacks, but will block any attacks that should not normally combo. Example: you do 2K, 2H; 2K hits, 2H is guarded. In constrast, First guard will guard the first sequence of attacks, but will stop guarding if there is a significant gap in between hits. Example: you do j.S, ADC j.S; first j.S is blocked, the following ADC j.S hits. Didn't test if these exact examples work with these results, but that's the general idea anyway. Recovery is totally unrelated to the Guard setting, and can be set to either FW, BK, or NT in the Training menu.