Tari

You have a couple ways of doing George + Pumpkin oki in the corner if you really want to. It's probably not always what you'll want to do, but it's not unsafe, either. You'll be in neutral before the opponent can tech and attack you. Off of most crap into the corner, you can do... - x > 5CDC > 214A > (dash) 3C (1 hit) > 236A > 214B > dash 5CC > dash 3C (1 hit) > 214C > 3C (1 hit) > 214A The above combo is actually a decent corner ender. You get your wind back and set up a frog and a pumpkin for oki. You lose the rod, however, which can be useful to have around. That said, if they block George, you can throw another rod out if you really want to. If you hit them with George in the corner, you can do this: - x > frog hit > 5C (as late as possible) C (also as late as possible) > 214B > dash 3C (3 hits) > 214A While this is actually a pretty nice combo for setting stuff back up (costs no wind, summons a fresh pumpkin and frog), the timing is fairly strict if you want a safe frog summon at the end. If it's mistimed, you're likely to have a slight gap between the opponent recovering and you completing the frog summon. I also find it somewhat annoying to do, due to having to delay the second hit of 5CC. If you don't delay it enough, the opponent will tech far too early for you to even continue the combo. === The rest of these combos are sort of gimmicky and not suggested. They all cost you about half a wind and leave you with a pumpkin in a strange place after you use it for oki (the only useful wind direction after these combos is 4D, which leaves the pumpkin off behind you somewhere). - x > frog hit > 5CC (as late as possible) > 214B > 3D > 5CC > dash 3C (1 hit) 214A (requires very early confirmation of frog hit) - x > frog hit > sj., dj., j.2C (lvl2), j.214B > 2D > 5B > 5CC > dash 3C (2 hits) > 214A - x > frog hit > 236A > 5CC (as late as possible) > 214B > 3D > 5CC > dash 3C (1 hit) > 214C > 3C (1 hits) > 214A

The triple 5B > Sweep > Super will usually work, unless you used way too many high proration moves in the pre-burst part of the combo. It's possible to make it fail at the sweep, lol. OMB is indeed one hit, forgot about that. "It takes 10 hits for SMP detection to fail" is more along the lines of what I was thinking. You could be right about the j.214A/B only counting as two hits. Haven't had a reason to test that before, honestly. It does only have two active hitboxes, apparently.

If you mean the 22x swords, then yeah, I believe you can make them meaty. It's not the most common thing to get a good [5B] in the corner for that, though. If you mean the 236x chains, then... I guess you can make them meaty? But if you mistime it, you're pretty much boned, hahaha. I guess you could try to bait the opponent into a punish by chain whiffing and then letting go of the 22x sword when they try to move?

I'd say it's worth knowing, it's just not the most likely thing that you'll have a chance to land it. Sort of like Brutal Impact red axe combos. The basic SMP combo is pretty easy to do, so it's not hard to learn. Non-awakening SMP combo: 5AA > 2A > 2B > sjc j.B > j.BB > j.C > j.214B, OMB, [5B], dash [5B] > 22A, 5A > 5B, dash [5B], dash 5B > Sweep > 236236D Practically speaking, you'll rarely have a chance to actually do it, of course, but it's still useful to know. It's actually pretty good damage from a non-fatal counter 5A starter without a super ender (it does 4.3~4.5k meterless). It gains 25-27 meter mid-combo (depends on axe level when you start), and if you do manage to hit 50 meter, you can still super cancel the ending into an extra 2.8k damage. If you start from green axe (the axe gauge must turn yellow before the second hit), you gain 25 meter and do ~7100 damage with super. If you start with yellow axe, you gain 26 meter and do ~7150 damage with super. If you start with red axe, you gain 27 meter and do ~7300 damage with super. It's 10 moves prior to the OMB, not 9. There's actually a proration limit before the OMB, as well. If you use moves with too much proration (ie: 2A starter, for example), the SMP combo will still fail. The typical SMP combo starter is this one: 5AA > 2A > 2B > sjc j.B > j.BB > j.C > j.214B > OMB > etc. The 10 hits are 5A, 5AA, 2A, 2B, j.B, j.BB, j.C, j.214B (3 hits). Multi-hit projectiles, ala j.C, only count as one move.

Pretty much.

Sure, it'd be nice to fill in those gaps on the wiki. Thanks.

From a potential buyer's perspective, that sounds very attractive. If it's cheap enough, I think quite a lot of people will probably jump on. It sounds less attractive from a developer perspective, but I guess you've already got that end figured out? I agree. :P

Sorry, I didn't realize her astral input had changed, so I didn't bother to check what it was. Adjusted it on the character page as well (since Chao already fixed the frame data page). edit: just realized that Rachel can't even do non-CH 2C and follow it up with another 2C as a gimmick. You'd just get counter-hit, lol. So good, Rachel.

Well, at least that info doesn't really change how we use the move already, haha. Sorta annoying to realize that Rachel mirrors have the potential to be far more irritating than they already are, though. On an unrelated note, I played BB for the first time in a while at the Carnival Burst monthly here and got destroyed by a bunch of stuff. It was both hilarious and sad to realize that I am horribly inept at this game right now. :|

2C's frame data hasn't changed. It's just continuing to be crappy. The only reason it's usually not punishable on-hit in the current game (and previous versions of the game) is because it causes opponents to go airborne on hit, and most characters don't have fast enough downwards aerial moves to take advantage of Rachel's recovery, don't land fast enough to use a ground normal, or don't have ground normals that are both fast and long-range enough to take advantage of Rachel's disadvantaged state. Just to clarify, 2C has 13 active frames, 42 frames of recovery, and is a level 5 move. That means that if you hit on the earliest possible frame, you still have another 12 + 42 frames (54 frames) of recovery. The opponent, on the other hand, has 21 frames of aerial hitstun + 15 frames of aerial tech time (36 frames to recover), which leaves Rachel at a whopping -18 frames. It's worth pointing out that Rachel is out of counter-hit state by that point. If you hit the opponent with 2C on the ground, and they choose to neutral air tech, depending on the character's falling speed, they might be able to punish Rachel with a ground or air normal. Spent a little while doing some testing to compile this approximate list of frame (dis)advantage from hitting grounded opponents with non-CH 2C: ************************************************ Values in parentheses are character's jump durations, while values after the colons are frame advantage for 2C on ground hit if opponent neutral air techs. For approximately every 2 frames longer a character stays in the air when they jump, Rachel gains 1 frame of advantage on 2C ground hit. This holds true for odd numbered jump frames, while even-numbered jump frames seem to have some extra variance (see Carl and Hakumen). === Taokaka (33): -8 Tsubaki (37): -6 Noel (39): -5 Ragna (39): -5 Jin (39): -5 Hazama (39): -5 (untested) Makoto (39): -5 Platinum (39): -5 Relius (39): -5 (untested) Valkenhayn (39): -5 (untested) Bang (40): -5 Carl (42)*: -5 Hakumen (42): -5 Lamda-11 (42): -4 Mu-12 (42): -4 Litchi (43): -2 Tager (43): -2 Rachel (52)*: +1 or +2 (tested, but difficult to confirm; likely +2, as it would match the value inferred from Litchi's data) Arakune (54)*: +2 or +3 (untested, likely +3, inferred from Rachel data) ===== *NOTE: ===== Carl, Rachel, and Arakune can all perform falling aerial moves as a punish for the 2C. Carl and Arakune can both do falling j.A, though probably not much afterwards. Rachel, however, can neutral air tech and do j.5DA or j.5DB into a full combo midscreen. ************************************************ Generally speaking, the only characters who can really punish 2C on hit are Taokaka and Rachel. However, if you hit an opponent in the corner, or if you hit a low airborne opponent with the first frame of 2C, a couple more opponents can get real combos off of falling air normals or off of ground normals with short reach.

Fwiw, against players who know how Labrys works, air guillotine will rarely, if ever, work as a double overhead, due to the first hit not hitting high. It would probably be a tad bit more likely to hit if you use the A version, as it's faster, but it's still very risky if you don't have the meter to cancel.

He was just saying Polka used it well, haha. And then he misinterpreted the counter hit and thought 2C was punishable on hit.

Hahaha, wow, I feel dumb today. xD I realized after many hours of failing to IAD properly for Bridget's 6S > yoyo recall combo that I could just hold 9 during the yoyo recall.... Been waiting for Bridget to recover completely and then trying to get my IAD out, but I couldn't time it correctly like that, and my inputs are so bad I can't do it anyway. Tried playing P4 again yesterday for the first time in a long time and ended up trying to hit the comm button (from Gundam) and then trying to set a yo-yo as Labrys. Oh man, I'm so ready for EVO.

Ughhh. I still need a copy of that. Pretty nice to see. I imagine it won't work after longer combos, but those tend to not end in j.2C knockdown anyway.

I'm already dead. D:

If needed, I can bring yet another monitor, ps3 with GG and BB, and streaming equipment. I don't have a 4G card, though, and I'm not sure using my 4G phone for that would be a good idea, lol.

Got my pass. Had to pay extra, and I couldn't transfer dj's. Apparently, player transfers aren't allowed for legal reasons. At least I got a pass, though. :D

Good luck! Hahaha. :P

Ignorant people unite! ./I'm still freaking out Anyway, if you guys need even more gear, I can bring my monitor, laptop, and bmi shuttle. I sorta doubt we'll need it, but let me know if something comes up. I don't have an hdcp stripper (looking into buying one of those converters on amazon) at the moment. I'd offer my PS3, but it's not got all the DLC, nor am I planning on buying most of it (might get Arios). There'll be a million sticks there, so me bringing mine is sorta unimportant.

Probably not. But I don't know N-O's name, so one can hope. :P

It'd be even more hilarious if he entered P4 just for the hell of it and he doesn't actually play the game. He just comes by to body us all in BB.

Okay. Got a response from mr.wizard. He says to have DJ e-mail him (mrwizard(at)shoryuken.com) from the e-mail address DJ registered with. It might be worth mentioning that he's one of the guys I was talking about, but I'm not sure it's necessary. Anyway, I emailed him as Arthur. If you could pass that info on for me, that'd be great. I don't have DJ's contact info at all.

Hmmm. Sent another e-mail to evo reg to find out if we could transfer the badges (either by buying them again or by paying the original purchasers). I wish I could just buy a badge off of someone or something, but the ID check makes that pretty much impossible. :/

Oh, is someone unable to attend? I actually need to find two passes (hopefully no more than that) at this point. Already e-mailed the guys in charge, but I haven't heard back, and I'm under the impression that the spec passes were sold out. :/ There's someone who's entered in P4 who might not make it, so I might end up with his pass and a random entry in P4.... Not sure how that'll work. Hell, I don't even know how you get your passes for evo at this point, lol. Do they mail them or something? ./not sure why scalping would work

Good luck, guys. I opted out of entering P4, haha. That said... we seem to be having issues with getting the actual event passes at this point, so I'm sorta concerned.