Raven Pre-Release Speculation and Analysis Thread

[Zouf]

Trained the character and played online with him.

He's definitely fun to play, but I don't see how Kokosare (214K) can be useful yet. For now it looks really situational, almost useless. The recover is too long so you cannot use it as a parry, and the fact you can only cancel with a DD makes it pretty unsafe.

Also, Kokosare IS NOT 1F, so you will lose to meaty if you're trying to reversal with it. This is a major flaw. So he's pretty free at okizeme, as his only reversal is 214214H.

His neutral game requires good knowledge of MUs imo. As his moves are very slow, you will have to play carefully when pressing buttons.

I haven't really tested the command grab yet, but outside of combos I don't think it will have any use. It's way too slow, and doesn't grab when you are too close of the opponent.

We'll see how the character turns out, but I don't think we'll find anything that will make us go "wow this is broken". He looks OK but that's it.

[Cozby]

214K YRC can hard punish almost anything, including 2Ps. I think that move will grow into being a huge part of his game. Implementing the YRC punishes can be an efficient way to build his masometer. Projectiles knock him back very far.

For standing NH, If he gets a bit of a dash - cS > 6P > cS > 2H might be his strongest normal string for damage.

For CH, 5H (1 hit) > 236H > IAD S H(2 hits) cS 2H seems the best for now.

__

Some things:

although being +2, cS being two slow hits means its easy to IB, so it will be important to mixup his normals.

6P works very well against alot of f. S and such. It does a surprising amount of damage, and can confirm into jS on CH after the animation of 6P ends.

For 2D 236H Oki, airdashing on top of the ball loses to most reversals, alpha counters, etc. so using the invincibility well timed forward dash, mixed with later AD mixups make the oki more scary. It may be obvious but its important to confirm how many hits of the ball the opponent will have to block when dashing. This will give more consistent stagger setups.

jK can instant overhead some characters. If the opponent blocks airdash late S, H (2 Hits), jK can beat fuzzy guard. Works on Sol and Zato for sure.

[MoralHazardPay]

On 6/12/2016 at 7:45 AM, Zouf said:

Trained the character and played online with him.

He's definitely fun to play, but I don't see how Kokosare (214K) can be useful yet. For now it looks really situational, almost useless. The recover is too long so you cannot use it as a parry, and the fact you can only cancel with a DD makes it pretty unsafe.

Also, Kokosare IS NOT 1F, so you will lose to meaty if you're trying to reversal with it. This is a major flaw. So he's pretty free at okizeme, as his only reversal is 214214H.

His neutral game requires good knowledge of MUs imo. As his moves are very slow, you will have to play carefully when pressing buttons.

I haven't really tested the command grab yet, but outside of combos I don't think it will have any use. It's way too slow, and doesn't grab when you are too close of the opponent.

We'll see how the character turns out, but I don't think we'll find anything that will make us go "wow this is broken". He looks OK but that's it.

You don't use it on wake-up. You use it as a threat to stop people from poking out of your pressure or a punish predictable moves. Don't pop it unless you have a YRC on deck.

 

What I like to do is to use it after a blocked normal and mix that up with pressure resets such as the needle, ball, and IAD. If Elphelt's looking for a late 2S to beat a of your followups or be safe against others it's a full combo punish. 

 

 

Also, something to test tonight; is his meter gain via that move governed by hits or damage absorbed? 

[VandelMarchen]

Its by hits I think its about 10 to get to max meter.

 

Also Combo thread would be great!

Also Whats the objective to playing Raven right?

What are good combo starters for raven mid screen? Also what should you do in the corner? to best get out?

[Clamper]

I'd say he's a zoner with a good surprise attack factor in his air dash and vortex based on his offensive. His command grab seems good tho. It's slow but doesn't have a hurtbox apparently and since there's an anti air version it's not like they can just react and jump... 

I also don't like his parry. Too much startup and when he's hit he's pushed back making punishing things harder. It'd be better if he stayed in place. Honestly i'd rather just blitz. 
 

[Jenrai]

I'm not a huge fan of the parry so far but I think it will have its uses here and there. Definitely hugely risky without yrc ready, probably inadvisable in those situations. 

Worth noting that if you're looking to create space, ground strings ending in 2D can be followed up with 236P for the slowdown effect, allowing you to back off with more safety.

Definitely seems to have potential ad a character, though I'm not sure his offensive options are oppressive enough to put him in top tier. Need to see how most of the cast deals with his zoning potential, as it's pretty strong and varied from what I can tell so far.

[Zouf]

He's definitely not top tier. Mid tier i'd say.

His command grab is pretty good actually, I'm starting to use it more and it's a nice tool.

His parry on the other hand still looks useless to me.

 

 

[Jenrai]

The parry will cover you vs Johnny's post-throw unblockable setups, which is nice, and since you can combine the parry inputs with the reversal super (214K214H works nicely) it's strictly better if you're supering something on reaction since you'll heal the purple health during the animation. Mostly pretty situational, but I'm finding a couple of spots for it.w

[Blackhearth]

I think he is high in the lower high section  atm(B+?) his pokes are really slow, 6p lose with air crossups  and 2p CAN'T HIT EDDIE LOL. he lose trades at mid range with a bunch of the cast with pokes faster than his owns. The needles are meh and easy to maneuver around them without yrc, the ball needs yrc to throw it safe during pressure. the air dash is a mix of feelings, for one side can surprise the opponent by how fast can reach them but can be easily be punished at  short distances and is only useful to escape the corners with a SJ. The masogauge is crap and most of the times can't detect the yrc input. He wakeup timing is weird, a lot of times I find myself doing BS or any reversal to see Raven standing doing nothing. His mixup game is scary, not godlike like millia or zato but he had high chances to break someone defense with his dash cancel. He can easily bait BS attempts . Aerial combos are plain simple but with knock down that can convert in ball+dashcancel mixup. The command grabs are slow but can cash people of off guard (be ready to yrc if you see nothing happens)

 

Overall I feel he is like Bedman when he was released, so I guess they are gonna buff him a lot but nothing broken, also he eat tension like a monster and we need more Top JP videos from him, Kazunoko already grasp the idea with him but I think there is more room to see awesomeness with the crow, also his is not easy to use, the airdash cancel had so many routes that you need to call the right answer constantly (from messing the dash cancel with J.K or j.S to wiff j.HS to instant j.K, to bait pokes etc etc.)

[MoralHazardPay]

On 6/17/2016 at 4:14 PM, Blackhearth said:

I think he is high in the lower high section  atm(B+?) his pokes are really slow, 6p lose with air crossups  and 2p CAN'T HIT EDDIE LOL. he lose trades at mid range with a bunch of the cast with pokes faster than his owns. The needles are meh and easy to maneuver around them without yrc, the ball needs yrc to throw it safe during pressure. the air dash is a mix of feelings, for one side can surprise the opponent by how fast can reach them but can be easily be punished at  short distances and is only useful to escape the corners with a SJ. The masogauge is crap and most of the times can't detect the yrc input. He wakeup timing is weird, a lot of times I find myself doing BS or any reversal to see Raven standing doing nothing. His mixup game is scary, not godlike like millia or zato but he had high chances to break someone defense with his dash cancel. He can easily bait BS attempts . Aerial combos are plain simple but with knock down that can convert in ball+dashcancel mixup. The command grabs are slow but can cash people of off guard (be ready to yrc if you see nothing happens)

 

Overall I feel he is like Bedman when he was released, so I guess they are gonna buff him a lot but nothing broken, also he eat tension like a monster and we need more Top JP videos from him, Kazunoko already grasp the idea with him but I think there is more room to see awesomeness with the crow, also his is not easy to use, the airdash cancel had so many routes that you need to call the right answer constantly (from messing the dash cancel with J.K or j.S to wiff j.HS to instant j.K, to bait pokes etc etc.)

Don't use a macro button for YRC off stance, you need to hit PSH as you are holding down K. It also only has YRC points when the meter ticks up, not at any point

[Zouf]

It's quite easy to YRC his stance, no need for some shenanigan like pressing PSH or whatever...

The biggest flaw of his stance is that it has wayyyyyyyyy too many startup frames (5f or something?). It can only be used in neutral or during very specific gaps in pressures.

This needs to be a reversal to be useful. It's still a high risk high reward tool, nothing amazing.

Most of the matches I win are when I don't use his stance at all during the match. When I'm playing around it, I often lose. Which is not appealing :P

[susano]

On 7/13/2016 at 11:03 PM, Zouf said:

It's quite easy to YRC his stance, no need for some shenanigan like pressing PSH or whatever...

The biggest flaw of his stance is that it has wayyyyyyyyy too many startup frames (5f or something?). It can only be used in neutral or during very specific gaps in pressures.

This needs to be a reversal to be useful. It's still a high risk high reward tool, nothing amazing.

Most of the matches I win are when I don't use his stance at all during the match. When I'm playing around it, I often lose. Which is not appealing :P

I agree about stance. I find myself not using much either but when I did use it, I used it as a reversal with the super. He should get a super that charges it to max automatically.

Anyway, I'm still learning with this character so the journey has been tough. 

[Zouf]

1. [Raven]
2.  
3. - Glide
4. No longer possible to Air Throw during the movement
5.  
6. - Schmerz Berg (236P)
7. Hitbox increased downwards
8.  
9. - Koko ni Saretai
10. Raven cant get hit until the animation is over
11.  
12. - Getreuer
13. Stun rate adjusted

 

Can't air throw during Glide... Wtf ASW ;_;. Like it was remotely strong.

[MoralHazardPay]

I guess I can stop practicing swoop airthrows.

 

And hitting PSH isn't a weird technique, it's literally how you RC without using K