[CS1] Taokaka Combo and BnB Thread

[RinHara5aki]

5d~9? Isn't it a 9d?

Anyway, what I do is quickly input 8 (to jump cancel) while pressing C and immediately shift the stick down to do the 236 input. I get all 5 hits without any problem. If you get four hits it means Tao is not high enough (so either you were a tad slow during the JC bit or you screwed it up somewhere else).

People keep correcting me saying 5d~9 or 9d~9 or 8d~9 it's all the same imo it just gets annoying...

Anyways thanks for the input. Yeah, it might be my laggy inputs messing up the combo. I never was used to JC j.c combo's, I always used to do drive loops.

On the other hand, ANYBODY know ANY 6d drive loop combo's off of 3c?! It seems there is no way to end it... I can't j.a j.c 9d~9, can't j.a j.a 9d~9... T____________T

[Ronove]

I think you can do the horizontal drive loop and end it with the JC j.c 236bx5, but it won't do that much damage.

Anyways thanks for the input. Yeah, it might be my laggy inputs messing up the combo. I never was used to JC j.c combo's, I always used to do drive loops.

Same for me, that's an old CT habit a lot of us have since we simply used to hold the direction rather than doing jump cancels. With a little practice it will be smooth though, I'm already pretty consistent with that ender.

[XDest]

I'm having trouble ending combo's

I keep recieving 236bbbb(drop), instead of 236bbbb~wallbounce...

My combo i've been using is 5b -> 6a(1hit) -> JC -> 5d~b -> taunt -> 236cc -> 2d~9 -> j.c -> 5d~9 -> j.c -> JC -> j.c -> 236bbbb (Miss or hit wallbounce?!?)

Single taunt combo's for now.. but I dunno, it obviously has to do with height. It really irks me.

I'm coming to the rescue!

You're adding in an extra j.C. It's j.C JC j.236bx5. The extra j.C is for when you want to start cat2 looping.

So either j.C 9D~9 j.C JC j.236Bx5 or j.C 9D~9 j.C JC j.C j.236B j.2D~6 j.236Bx5. The latter won't work off some startups. Another possible one is j.C JC j.C j.236B j.2D~6 j.236Bx5.

Off a drive loop, you can do something like 5B 3C 6D~6 j.C 6D~6 j.C 6D~6 j.C j.236B j.2D~6 j.236Bx5 for around 3050. Any non-taunt combo off 5B is going to end up in the 2800-3200 territory.

You're only getting single taunt combs because you aren't delaying enough between 214D and j.2D~B. Use visual cues to help your timing out. Taunt loops are a balancing act of keeping the opponent a certain height above the ground at all times.

[Silfer]

So the timing of the taunt combo is harder or just as hard as in CT?....will this thing even be possible online? :S I tried CS the other day on a local arcade and the B cancel is more forgiving (thats as much as I managed to test, I'm really really bad with sticks)...but with all those changes in rythm I'm not so sure that this can be pulled off in a semi-lagged match :S

[Ronove]

This is definetely not a combo you can do online, unless you have ZERO lag. Reason is: once you get to the corner you have to shift your timing, and since that is a visual clue (delayed by latency) it'll be pretty hard not to make it whiff or bluebeat. It's already pretty tricky offline, I can't even imagine what would be online. Tao is definetely not going to be a popular character online unless people are willing to sacrifice her best offensive tools and stick with no-taunt BnBs that deal half the damage.

[Silfer]

This is definetely not a combo you can do online, unless you have ZERO lag. Reason is: once you get to the corner you have to shift your timing, and since that is a visual clue (delayed by latency) it'll be pretty hard not to make it whiff or bluebeat. It's already pretty tricky offline, I can't even imagine what would be online. Tao is definetely not going to be a popular character online unless people are willing to sacrifice her best offensive tools and stick with no-taunt BnBs that deal half the damage.

Man..that sucks...I'm playing from south america, there's always a bit of lag on the matches I play.

Well...I guess its time to find a new main until a decent non taunt b&b is found...or until a new BB comes out...shit I really liked the character :S

[XDest]

Well, the best you'll do without taunts is like 3200 off 5B and 4200 off 6C, pretty much.

[Silfer]

Well, the best you'll do without taunts is like 3200 off 5B and 4200 off 6C, pretty much.

Sucks to be me then...I'll learn the combo and see how it goes online. Who knows, it might yet work. If it doesnt I'll trade the game and wait until BB"3" comes out.

-btw- are 3C combos gone?

[Ronove]

Some of them are (the good ones like those that used j.C > 236B > j.2D~B), the ones involving D~B cancels are still there but they deal way less damage making them not really worth it IF you can use taunt loops. Instead, combos using the CS2 loop off situational antiair are pretty good.

[Silfer]

Some them are (the good ones like those that used j.C > 236B > j.2D~B), the ones involving D~B cancels are still there but they way less damage making them not really worth using them IF you can use taunt loops. Instead, combos using the CS2 loop off situational antiair are pretty good.

Well, that might be worth looking into...I dont understand why would aksys do something like this considering the user base on consoles...but what do I know...

CT still has some juice left on it, and maybe the CS netcode is even better than in CT. But still I dont see much hope for tao online (at least not for me), I sure hope I'm wrong though...If not, well, it was fun while it lasted.

[Ronove]

You can stick to no taunt loop combos, just don't expect to deal 4k damage off a 5b. You'll be doing 3.2k at most.

[Silfer]

You can stick to no taunt loop combos, just don't expect to deal 4k damage off a 5b. You'll be doing 3.2k at most.

Its a possibility, but its like playing with a crippled character. At some point I'm gonna need the dmg. I'll try anyways, as I said, I might be surprised.

-btw- How about a single (or double) taunt combo? (like in CT) are those still doable?, maybe the entire loop is out of the question but fewer repetitions could be more "lag friendly"?

[Ronove]

Single taunt combos "might" be possible with lag but you won't go past 3k.

[Silfer]

Single taunt combos "might" be possible with lag but you won't go past 3k.

Jesus...this is fucking hopeless. Guess there's no point in dwelling over it until the game releases :S

[RinHara5aki]

I'm coming to the rescue!

You're adding in an extra j.C. It's j.C JC j.236bx5. The extra j.C is for when you want to start cat2 looping.

So either j.C 9D~9 j.C JC j.236Bx5 or j.C 9D~9 j.C JC j.C j.236B j.2D~6 j.236Bx5. The latter won't work off some startups. Another possible one is j.C JC j.C j.236B j.2D~6 j.236Bx5.

Off a drive loop, you can do something like 5B 3C 6D~6 j.C 6D~6 j.C 6D~6 j.C j.236B j.2D~6 j.236Bx5 for around 3050. Any non-taunt combo off 5B is going to end up in the 2800-3200 territory.

You're only getting single taunt combs because you aren't delaying enough between 214D and j.2D~B. Use visual cues to help your timing out. Taunt loops are a balancing act of keeping the opponent a certain height above the ground at all times.

THANK YOU for clearing my 236bxn problem up. So now its basically gonna be always 8/92346bbbbb every time i finish a combo huh...

I'll definitely test out that 3c combo. It looks interesting.

As for taunt loops, I can't even get past two without dropping. How much do taunts prorate for combo's? Someone test out the damage difference for these two bnb's-

5b -> 6a(1hit) -> JC -> 2d~b -> taunt -> 214d -> j.2d~b -> taunt -> 214d -> j.2d~b -> taunt -> 236cc.. (dont finish the combo)

5b -> 6a(1hit) -> JC -> 2d~b -> taunt -> 214d -> j.2d~b -> taunt -> 236cc..

I just want to see how difficulty trades off for damage in her taunt loop game. If I can't get 13 freakin taunts off of 6c then I want to figure out another way to get in damage.

So the timing of the taunt combo is harder or just as hard as in CT?....will this thing even be possible online? :S

I tried CS the other day on a local arcade and the B cancel is more forgiving (thats as much as I managed to test, I'm really really bad with sticks)...but with all those changes in rythm I'm not so sure that this can be pulled off in a semi-lagged match :S

Taunt combo's are easier to execute. But doesn't mean their brainless either.. as you already know probably.

I think the hit-frames for ~B cancels went from 3 frames to 5 because it does seem easier to ~b cancel.

I have feeling as well Tao is going to epically fail online. She already did poorly in CT, I think CS is gonna kill her for good

[XDest]

A cat2 loop combo. seems to supplement the damage for only one extra taunt. The max of a non-taunt combo from 5B is 3200, and from 6C is 4200. With 6C, just 2-3 taunts puts it over 5000 if I remember correctly, but you need at least 10 to get it over 6000. And a 5-taunt combo off 5B->6A is 3661 if I remember correctly, to get to 4000 requires a little more effort. Also, poorly online? I proved that wrong every day. Just step up that game! I'm even starting to get some double taunt combos in online. It's just that it takes a good amount of work and that dropped combos in the air spell out doom. While a dropped taunt loop isn't that big of a deal, j.2D~B has fast recovery anyways. There's a lot of times where people tech from a dropped taunt loop, just to get 5B'd back into it, haha. There's also no change in rhythm until you get to the corner. All of the non-corner is hip level, all of the corner is head level. If you have the input and timing down, you probably have half the battle done already. Just play people closer to you geographically so you cut down on input lag. You simply can't fight the speed of light, you'll never win lol.

[Silfer]

A cat2 loop combo. seems to supplement the damage for only one extra taunt.

The max of a non-taunt combo from 5B is 3200, and from 6C is 4200. With 6C, just 2-3 taunts puts it over 5000 if I remember correctly, but you need at least 10 to get it over 6000. And a 5-taunt combo off 5B->6A is 3661 if I remember correctly, to get to 4000 requires a little more effort.

Also, poorly online? I proved that wrong every day. Just step up that game! I'm even starting to get some double taunt combos in online. It's just that it takes a good amount of work and that dropped combos in the air spell out doom. While a dropped taunt loop isn't that big of a deal, j.2D~B has fast recovery anyways. There's a lot of times where people tech from a dropped taunt loop, just to get 5B'd back into it, haha. There's also no change in rhythm until you get to the corner. All of the non-corner is hip level, all of the corner is head level. If you have the input and timing down, you probably have half the battle done already. Just play people closer to you geographically so you cut down on input lag. You simply can't fight the speed of light, you'll never win lol.

I agree, but it doesnt really apply to my particular situation. There arent any players in my area (hell, the game is not even officially released here), but I'll make do somehow. Its good to know that you can reach decent damage with fewer repetitions. Besides, this is just beggining, maybe some heavy damage online friendly combo's will be discovered in time. Who knows.

[XDest]

btw, you do need the 5C 2D~5 D~A 9D~9 9D~9 3D~3 j.236Bx5 combo if you're planning to max out your taunt loop damage. It allows you to do one extra taunt and get that 6800 max off 6C. Just putting that out there.

[Ronove]

XDest, taunt combos online are simply impractical unless you're always playing online with the same people and with same latency (meaning once you've adjusted the timing once you can even attempt them, without needing to continuously re-adjust). Besides, any opponent with a brain who realizes that taunt combos might whiff due to lag will not let himself get fooled by casual resets, as Tao really gets punished hard in CS for making mistakes. I still think that no matter how much "muscle memory" you put, you still look for visual clues when doing them and that's where latency fucks it up. My personal verdict still remains the same. This character is definetely not suited for online play, even more so in CS. You may still play her but it's like playing not at full potential, and in her case it's pretty vital since she doesn't have a whole lot of offensive setups in terms of variety (either go for big damage taunt loop, or poor/medium damage no-taunt). On an other note: I'm trying to practice her oki ender 214D > j.2D~C > j.5D~A > 214D > 236Bx5 and the damn ~C cancel won't come out in time. It's obviously a timing related issue but I just wanted to know how soon you guys push C to get it to connect. It seems like the ~C cancel really takes its sweet damn time before going into its active frames.

[PlasticChicken]

I always thought bb online was always horrible for ANY character and not just because of dropped combos but for lots of other reasons. I have a good scene around where I live and I rarely play online but I do understand people who live in places that doesn't have a community for bb. Online is their only option but I don't really think the changes in the game should even consider online play. There just really is no way to fix it. I really doubt there will be other combos that doesn't involve taunts in them that will make them do any close to the taunt combo damage. And there really shouldn't be, since doing risky combos with strict timing SHOULD do more damage. Despite all the crappy lag, I still managed to pull double taunt combos online after getting a "feel" what the delay is after pressing some normals. The timing does not change at all, just press the buttons earlier and don't rely on visuals. I bet the taunt combos will more than possible online, just really hard. As soon as the taunt loops feel like breathing air, it won't be too bad. But as I said, combos are the least of your worries in online play... Tao is not online friendly and they won't fix that. I don't want them to dumb her down to make her more online friendly because I really enjoy how she plays currently. I'll try the low wallbounce variation of the ender with j.2d~c when I have a chance to play again. EDIT: An example of how much different combo enders can effect your damage 4B+C > 214d > 6c > 66 > taunt loop x 6 > 214d > 2d~b > 5c > 9d > 9d~9 > 3d~3 > 236bbbbb (4.4k) 236b (4.6k so far working on tager and arakune) 4B+C > 214d > 6c > 66 > taunt loop x 5 > 236cc > 2d~9 > j.c > 2d~9 > j.c > JC > 236bbbbb (4k) On 5b > 6a, after the first taunt, it seems each additional one adds around 200-300~ damage. Obviously different when it's started with something else like 6c. Note 5c allows one more taunt but only works in corner, but it's pretty much guaranteed to be in the corner after landing 6 loops + 5c. I think the 5c combo ender should be preferred over the 236cc one since it does add a nice chunk of damage. Also, anyone tried doing the taunt loop on arakune? Is it me or is it a lot harder to do it on him.

[XDest]

Yeah, it always has been, unless you're in the corner. He's the troublesome case for the loop.

[RinHara5aki]

I need some loop advice. When I start taunt looping, I get to about 3 or 4 when I start either blue-beating or just completely whiff because they end up too high up. I obviously am doing the loop way to fast, but where? Which input needs to be delayed? taunt, 214d, or 2d~b? Because of this stupid habit of mine, I had to hack my combo's and in turn, hack my damage. Its a pain in the ass. ALSO, I really want to know what your guy's BnB is like. I like watching other people's BnB to see if I can either incorporate, or mix it into mine. Its also fun to see other people's simple combo's being used instead of taunt insanity. Mine are- 1) 5b -> 3c -> (5d~6 -> j.c)x3 -> 236b -> 2d~6 -> 236bbbbb~ (Courtesy of xDest lol) 2) 5b -> 2a(1hit) -> JC -> 5d~b -> taunt -> 236cc -> 2d~9 -> (j.c -> JC)x3 236bbbbb 3) 5b -> 2a -> JC -> j.a -> j.c -> JC -> j.c -> 236bbbbb (Lazy) 4) 5b -> 2a(1hit) -> JC -> 2d~b (taunt loop)x3/4() -> 236cc -> 2d~9 -> 5d~a -> 9d~5 -> 9d~9 -> 236bbbbb

[XDest]

The proper input is actually: 214D -> WAIT (until opponent is at hip level) -> j.2D~B -> Taunt It's actually the exact same timing you need in CT for a double taunt combo to work properly, and not be too low below the opponent. The main BnB enders you should use are: Taunt Loop -> 236CC -> j.C -> 9D~9 -> j.C -> JC -> j.236Bx5 Taunt Loop -> 214D -> NO WAIT (Important!) -> j.2D~B -> 5C -> 2D~5 -> j.D~A -> 9D~5/9 -> 9D~9 -> 3D~3-> j.236Bx5 (Highest damage off taunt loop in general) Taunt Loop -> 214D -> j.2D~C -> j.D~A -> 214D -> j.236Bx5 -> Optional Hexa-Edge (For knockdowns and resets near corner) And for the non taunt loop stuff, use the cat2 loop to get a bit more damage in.

[XDest]

The best non-taunt combo, period. 5B -> 3C -> D~B [hit] -> 5C -> 2D~6 -> j.C -> 9D~9 -> j.C -> 9D~9 -> ... -> 3D~3 -> j.236Bx5 [~3400] Heh, the ending is very familiar. It also works to shorten up taunt loop reps without losing that much damage. 5B -> 6A -> j.2D~B -> Taunt Loop x3 -> 236CC -> 2D~6 -> j.C -> 9D~9 -> j.C -> 9D~9 -> ... -> 3D~3 -> j.236Bx5 [~3700] 6C -> 66 -> Taunt Loop x8 -> 236CC -> 2D~6 -> j.C -> 9D~9 -> j.C -> 9D~9 -> ... -> 3D~3 -> j.236Bx5 [~6270] Not a significant amount of damage cut off, but you shave off the amount of loops by 30-50%. This might be a superb balance between damage and consistency. Please note that there is a HUGE delay between 9D~9 and 3D~3. Seriously. grab a sandwich, then come back and finish the combo. It's a freaking long wait. But it's still easier than doing double the amount of taunt loops.

[Ronove]

What?! I need to try this next time. So basically that "CT-like" ender cuts down the amount of loops and deals about the same damage? Could you make an example with that 5B combo with the "CT-like" ender and the one with more loops and different ender (oki ender for example)? I really gotta try this shit, if it helps increasing consistency it's truly all welcome. Although I'd still try to get more loops in and go for the oki ender though, in some matchups it's just too vital to be able to reapply pressure asap.