BB:CS Match-Up Chart

[Afrikaan]

Let's give him unblockables too if we wanna make him AC Potemkin.

Why not go all the way? Rip AC Potemkin straight up.

One idea I came up with was a CSledge while I was riding how. Except instead of being like the other 2, it would be a type of counter sledge that only activated if you were hit by a mid or high attack, and put the opponent into a knockdown state a la slidehead. It would deal with all the retarded Hakumen/Litchi nonsense and make other characters more wart

[Zoogstin]

Holy shit. You mean he plays like a grappler?!

I didn't mean it like that was some new revelation.

[Leo7]

Tager's normals are fine. They really buffed the block/hitstun and hitbox on a lot of his normals, and they all have a lot of priority. He can actually play a decent ground footsies game against most characters.

IMO he just needs a slightly better anti-air. Tager's 2C is like Potemkin's 2HS, but what Tager really needs is Potemkin's 6P. 2A comes close, but still too situational.

[smooshman]

if we get another potemkin..... I will fucking ragequit BB forever, I hated that guy......

[Shugotenshi]

His C Sledge should be Tager doing a Barrel Roll across the Screen!

[A.X.I.S.]

Tager's normals are fine. They really buffed the block/hitstun and hitbox on a lot of his normals, and they all have a lot of priority. He can actually play a decent ground footsies game against most characters.

IMO he just needs a slightly better anti-air. Tager's 2C is like Potemkin's 2HS, but what Tager really needs is Potemkin's 6P. 2A comes close, but still too situational.

give tager the flick lol...lambda will face roll.

seriously give 2A a bigger hit box or head invul, something like 3F invul...I'd love that.

[Spirit Juice]

give tager the flick lol...lambda will face roll.

seriously give 2A a bigger hit box or head invul, something like 3F invul...I'd love that.

Sigh. No.

[Manta]

Sigh. No.

So give your own opinion, what would raise Tager out of the doldrums without interfering with his own archetype?

[Drges]

So give your own opinion, what would raise Tager out of the doldrums without interfering with his own archetype?

turn his 720C into 4C and give him a dash that has autoguard

[A.X.I.S.]

Sigh. No.

even I knew they were bad idea's I was just humoring folks.

I rather have them make gadget...you know better.

and make it easier to approach or make it so tager can make it harder for others to approach.

[Heavy_Mental]

So give your own opinion, what would raise Tager out of the doldrums without interfering with his own archetype?

Since when has this thread title changed from "BB:CS Match-Up Chart" to "Let's Theorize About What Buffs Will Make Tager Not Suck hard"?

turn his 720C into 4C and give him a dash that has autoguard

"Hurr durr rook at me Ma, I maed uh funny. Hurr hur hurr.."

All that aside though, I believe the main problem with Tager doesn't lie with him (though he certainly has his flaws) as much as it lies with an overpowered top-tier. Getting outzoned is fine, getting outranged is fine, getting rushed down is fine, but getting outdamaged is ridiculous. Thank God Tager actually has better ways to get in now, but Gadget Finger doesn't have much to do with that.

The top-tier definitely need damage nerfs. I don't know how Tager's matchups with Carl, Arakune, Lambda, or Taokaka will be improved. Though most players seem to drop the tauntloop, getting outdamaged by a light bruiser is definitely not acceptable. I expect the tauntloop will be dealt with soon enough anyways. Against Lambda, the only thing I can think of is to give Spark Volt some projectile invulnerability on startup. Tager seems to do decent against the rest of the cast, which is like only Noel, Jin, Tsubaki, and Rachel (not counting Mu and Makoto).

[AdamNW]

In general, I don't think it should be possible to throw Tager (except by Tager's command grabs). Not sure how that would affect tiers though.

Honestly, the tier list wouldn't look nearly as bad if those 35's were 40's. Those can easily be fixed with damage buffs/nerfs.

[TheGreatReptar]

In general, I don't think it should be possible to throw Tager (except by Tager's command grabs). Not sure how that would affect tiers though.

Honestly, the tier list wouldn't look nearly as bad if those 35's were 40's. Those can easily be fixed with damage buffs/nerfs.

Removing a mixup option against a particular character is no way to balance them IMO.

[Lord Knight]

Since when has this thread title changed from "BB:CS Match-Up Chart" to "Let's Theorize About What Buffs Will Make Tager Not Suck hard"?

"Hurr durr rook at me Ma, I maed uh funny. Hurr hur hurr.."

All that aside though, I believe the main problem with Tager doesn't lie with him (though he certainly has his flaws) as much as it lies with an overpowered top-tier. Getting outzoned is fine, getting outranged is fine, getting rushed down is fine, but getting outdamaged is ridiculous. Thank God Tager actually has better ways to get in now, but Gadget Finger doesn't have much to do with that.

The top-tier definitely need damage nerfs. I don't know how Tager's matchups with Carl, Arakune, Lambda, or Taokaka will be improved. Though most players seem to drop the tauntloop, getting outdamaged by a light bruiser is definitely not acceptable. I expect the tauntloop will be dealt with soon enough anyways. Against Lambda, the only thing I can think of is to give Spark Volt some projectile invulnerability on startup. Tager seems to do decent against the rest of the cast, which is like only Noel, Jin, Tsubaki, and Rachel (not counting Mu and Makoto).

It's not an overpowered top tier. A slow grappler in a high movement game is always going to be on the weaker side. It's really difficult to balance a character like that in an anime game without fucking up. :/

[atdsutm]

if theres any changes needed it would be......

top 2 char bang/litchi = nerf damage and 5 guard primers for bang(even 4 tbh for a pure rush down char).

bottom 2 rachel/Tsubaki = buff damage and faster charge for tsubaki.

Tager = needs a drastic change not just damage buffs, he does get out-gunned by 2 top tier faster characters (Bang/Litchi) and also outzoned is just fucked up.

[Dragonslayer9]

There might as well be a thread called "What would be your CS patch?" with all this patch discussion going around, who knows? Maybe Aksys might take a idea here and there lol

[Afrikaan]

if theres any changes needed it would be......

top 2 char bang/litchi = nerf damage and 5 guard primers for bang(even 4 tbh for a pure rush down char).

bottom 2 rachel/Tsubaki = buff damage and faster charge for tsubaki.

Tager = needs a drastic change not just damage buffs, he does get out-gunned by 2 top tier faster characters (Bang/Litchi) and also outzoned is just fucked up.

I think Bang would need more of a health nerf along with that to say 11000. He shouldn't have near the highest mobility in the game save Taokaka and nearly infalliable approaches with B/D nails. I think the point for having such high health from CT is pretty far gone.

[atdsutm]

There might as well be a thread called "What would be your CS patch?" with all this patch discussion going around, who knows? Maybe Aksys might take a idea here and there lol

thats not a bad idea tbh, it will give Aksys an idea whats wrong with some characters and prevents them from doing overnerfs or overbuffs that are unnecessary.

[Spirit Juice]

You guys seem to forget that Tager is SUPPOSED to get outzoned.

[Afrikaan]

You guys seem to forget that Tager is SUPPOSED to get outzoned.

This is true. The thing is there's a point where he can only do so much without rising getting his ass counter-hit into big damage while the opponent is almost completely safe while doing so a la Litchi. I think that extent is a little extreme in a balance sense, not to mention the obvious disparities in reward.

[MisoSowee]

Imagine if IB added to sparkbolt/charge meter

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[Afrikaan]

Imagine if IB added to sparkbolt/charge meter

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

I think I just came.

[AdamNW]

Removing a mixup option against a particular character is no way to balance them IMO.

I wasn't worried so much about balance as something making sense.

I shouldn't be able to throw Tager with Carl. That shit makes no sense.

[ZONG_one]

Imagine if IB added to sparkbolt/charge meter

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Lol this would make no difference at all.

spark bolt is FRAAAYYYYY.

/carl elitism.

[MisoSowee]

Tsubaki still free too? :[