OrionXElite Posted January 4, 2011 Posted January 4, 2011 Also, a Taokaka & Hakumen specific combo(I'm surprised this does not work on Tager)off basically the same combo, but with an extra attack. I know this combo only does around 100 extra damage and somewhat impractical, I'm just noting something that is at least possible. Don't ever use that in match. If you add in that 5B before the ender, they can tech immediately after the last hit of the Super which means Tao gets a free 6C CH into 6.6k Taunt Loop and Hakumen gets whatever damn punish he wants. He could probably Mugen into a 100% if you did that...
NickExtreme1 Posted January 4, 2011 Posted January 4, 2011 Don't ever use that in match. If you add in that 5B before the ender, they can tech immediately after the last hit of the Super which means Tao gets a free 6C CH into 6.6k Taunt Loop and Hakumen gets whatever damn punish he wants. He could probably Mugen into a 100% if you did that... Thanks for the the heads up. Wouldn't have dreamt of it anyways, which is why I noted it as somewhat impractical, but possible. Tao is the only character I haven't played against with Valkenhayn yet; none of my college buddies play her and I haven't come across a Tao online yet
OrionXElite Posted January 4, 2011 Posted January 4, 2011 Thanks for the the heads up. Wouldn't have dreamt of it anyways, which is why I noted it as somewhat impractical, but possible. Tao is the only character I haven't played against with Valkenhayn yet; none of my college buddies play her and I haven't come across a Tao online yet I've got a friend who plays a great Tao. He gets fucking annoying sometimes since Tao has so much bullshit she can do. I've played him a few times but not recently since hes been gone for winter break. I'll be playing him later this week. Gonna be hype to pull out all the crap I've figured out :3 Also just throwing this out there. [w]236A is the MOST vague crossup EVER. if you wanna go for a quick reset and you get something like etc>5C>Rozen>9D>[w]j.A>Delayed j.B>Land and wait a second. You can meaty a 236A in Wolf form and if you time it just right, it becomes a crossup. Its very easy to pick up too as if you hit it, just go into 236B>j.236B>ender. Best part, its insanely vague and near impossible to determine if its a crossup or not. Worst part. its hard as FUUUUUUUUCK to hit it right. there are only about 2 active frames that'll cross up like that and its hard as shit since you have to take spacing into consideration and all that crap.
BatousaiJ Posted January 4, 2011 Posted January 4, 2011 So I was playing BB again after a week or two of not playing and dropping a few more combos earlier than I normally would which is understandable given my rusty status but I've totally forgotten how to use ground wolf grabs in mix ups. Obvious one would be to wolf cancel any cancel-able move into (a)5A->5B->delay->grab given you've conditioned your opponent to block low for (w)5A on the ground but I can't seem to work it naturally into trickier mind game setups that I know I should be doing. You guys have any go to setups for command grab that you've had good success with?
OrionXElite Posted January 5, 2011 Posted January 5, 2011 I've only got 2 tech traps right now. Haven't really tried them out much but I imagine they'll be good to throw out every once in a while. Do your combo into Rozen and you can make a trap out of the following combo: starter>Rozen>9D>[w]j.AA>j.B>3C>j.A>Land and just wait a second and if they're mashing tech, they'll air tech in which case you TK a Command Grab and it'll catch them. Or if you have you combo into whatever starter>[w]j.236A>j.236B>5C>j.B>j.B>Land and wait. If they Neutral Tech and don't know its coming, you can land and go straight into a Command Grab and they should fall right into it. So in the corner it may be something trying every once in a while to keep them scared Also throwing this on here. [W]j.214A/B is a really good move to stuff an AA. If you know a Ragna is consistent on his 6A, throw this out to beat it since the delay should mess up the invul frames. Also on CH, they bounce on the ground a tiny bit and can link into [w]5B most of the time which picks up into 236B>j.236>enders. If you think they're too far to hit with just [w]5B, walk a bit and go 5A>5B. The combo will still work just fine.
ATG Warlord Posted January 9, 2011 Posted January 9, 2011 (edited) how do you bait DPs in wolf form? tried 7D and 4D after (h)236A but nearly every DP in the game hit me. Edited January 9, 2011 by ATG Warlord
GenoWhirl Posted January 9, 2011 Author Posted January 9, 2011 maybe you need to delay the 4D more? Alternatively, 4D right away and cancel the forward momentum by pressing C
ATG Warlord Posted January 9, 2011 Posted January 9, 2011 (edited) I did some experimenting on Ragna's and Jin's DPs ... all the techniques I tried (4C, 7C, delaying, cancel to human and block) .. worked like 40% of the time ... first, timing the wolf cancel to avoid a dp varies from dp to dp .. jin has 4 so .. delaying too much worked to counter ragna's dp but not jin's C dp. second, timing varies if your opponent IB'ed the the move before wolf cancel like 236A or not. Am I doing something wrong or is this DP bait not reliable enough? EDIT: any other wolf DP bait option or situation you guys know? Edited January 9, 2011 by ATG Warlord
OrionXElite Posted January 9, 2011 Posted January 9, 2011 The Wolf Cancels are very committing in CS1 as you can't Transform the same way you can in CS2. Using Wolf to bait DPs is quite risky. Since you can't do anything about the Cancel until he starts dashing forward, if they IB 236A, its a free punish on Cancel. In my opinion, best option against DPs is [H]6A. Time it to make the DP hit the guard point. Option select 5C/2C on Clash depending on the Character as if they don't know its coming, you'll get a free CH combo. If the guard point takes the whole hit, you'll get a CH 6A and them out of your face.
GenoWhirl Posted January 9, 2011 Author Posted January 9, 2011 The Wolf Cancels are very committing in CS1 as you can't Transform the same way you can in CS2. What do you mean? Is it easier to bait DPs in CS2? Also IB'D 236A shouldn't be a problem since you can just 4D appropiately no?
Guardian Posted January 9, 2011 Posted January 9, 2011 236A should only be used in combos. Outside of that it sucks. You should only go for a wolf mixup on hit, and even then it's not foolproof vs srk. If you REALLY wanna bait it, you're going to have to do something like 236A, 7D~5C~5D. If done correctly, you should go back to the max height of the 7D cancel, flip in a neutral state and transform back. No SRK can punish that (on a 236A HIT), and it's somewhat difficult on block. Ragna can still run up and srk punish on block however.
STenSatsu Posted January 10, 2011 Posted January 10, 2011 Can technically just block if you think they are going to dp. Most people aren't going to react to transforming with 5d so they will generally just stick out the jab or whatever, especially if you toss some late wolf cancels. Funny thing also is doing the fuzzy guard [w] 5c>j.b>dj.b into either j.214a or b, I forget which. It looks like it lands you on the other side of them if blocked but you actually stay on the side you started on.
Doggie Posted January 10, 2011 Posted January 10, 2011 Sup everyone, noobvalk here. I've got a question regarding a particular combo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDDR6DN7OcE#t=00m39s I see lot of Valk players doing this, instead of doing to good old sj.c j.AAA into wolf cannon into falling j.B combo. Is there any particular reason why? The falling j.b variation definitely seems to do more damage. Does it have something to do with wolf meter?
ATG Warlord Posted January 11, 2011 Posted January 11, 2011 (edited) I just realized ending block strings with 236A is horrible in high level play .. you just surrender ur self to them if you do, and timing the wolf DP bait after it is hard. In another note, wolf DP bait works wonderfully off 6C (whiff, wolf canceled). I used to either go with 6C on their wakeup in the corner or just block if I think they're gonna DP but now it will be all 6C about the wolf j.b fuzzy guard thing, any combos off it? EDIT: and yeah 236A works well to AA far air moves like jin's air ice swords and arakunes j.d .. etc here's a combo I made for 236A AA CH (midscreen and corner) 236A AA CH > 5C(or 2C) > j.B > j.214B > 5D > 236A > 214B > 5C > j.B > j.B > 5D > 5B > 5C(or 2C) > j.B > JC j.B > j.C (DMG=4456, MG=44) better modifications of this combo are very well welcomed 236A can also be used to escape the corner since it advances Valk forward with good speed. Good to add to your corner escape options. Edited January 11, 2011 by ATG Warlord
OrionXElite Posted January 11, 2011 Posted January 11, 2011 What do you mean? Is it easier to bait DPs in CS2? Also IB'D 236A shouldn't be a problem since you can just 4D appropiately no? If I recall correctly, they changed the way Wolf Cancels work in CS2 compared to CS1. In CS1, say you do [H]236A>4D on block. Now what happens is he back dashes and charges forward. You can't do anything until he starts charging forward. From what I've seen in CS2, Valk has the option to do [H]236A>4D>D and Cancel back into Human Form before he starts going forward. It makes Wolf Cancels to get out of unsafe situations more viable since you can go 4D and right before he dashes forward, hit D again and he'll cancel the dash and go right back to Human Form at neutral.
STenSatsu Posted January 12, 2011 Posted January 12, 2011 Also, for baiting AAs when trying to get in, if you still have a jump left dj.d>j.214x is golden if you see the AA come out. If you get the CH just land and do [w] 5b>236b>etc. If you land the fuzzy guard [w] dj.b I think you can 3c>j.a>land>etc off it but you pretty much have to already be doing it.
OrionXElite Posted January 12, 2011 Posted January 12, 2011 Also, for baiting AAs when trying to get in, if you still have a jump left dj.d>j.214x is golden if you see the AA come out. If you get the CH just land and do [w] 5b>236b>etc. If you land the fuzzy guard [w] dj.b I think you can 3c>j.a>land>etc off it but you pretty much have to already be doing it. I actually run this as a reset all the time. It works well as it deters the opponent from throwing out a DP on wake up or something. Example being Starter>[H]236C>9D>[W]j.AA>j.B>3C>j.A>Land>D>[H]5B>(2C)>JC>j.B>j.C This leaves you with your double jump and you can delay it if you want to bait a DP or likewise double jump immediately and transform and bait one with something like 7C and punish. If you think they'll try and roll out of it, then just don't jump and land and make it a ground reset.
Tong Posted January 13, 2011 Posted January 13, 2011 Hello there Im still learning the oldman and wish to be proficient with him :D But...look here [h] Close 2A > 5B > 3C > 2B > 5C > SJC > j.B > dj.A > j.B > j.214B > 9DD > j.B > dj.B> j.C (2357 Damage, 30% MG) I dont think its possible to double jump twice, is that dj.A right?
kairless Posted January 13, 2011 Posted January 13, 2011 here's a combo I made for 236A AA CH (midscreen and corner) 236A AA CH > 5C(or 2C) > j.B > j.214B > 5D > 236A > 214B > 5C > j.B > j.B > 5D > 5B > 5C(or 2C) > j.B > JC j.B > j.C (DMG=4456, MG=44) better modifications of this combo are very well welcomed 236A AA CH > 5C(or 2C) > j.B > j.214B > 5D > 236A > 214B > 5C > j.B > j.B >5b >9j.b > 3c~a > 5d >5b >2c > j.b > JC > j.b > j.c DMG=4.6k MG=50 2nd version 236A AA CH > 2c > 6b > 2c > 5c > j.B > j.214B > 5D > 236A > 214B > 5C > j.B > j.B >5b >9j.b > 3c~a > 5d >5b >2c > j.b > JC > j.b > j.c DMG=5.7k MG=61
OrionXElite Posted January 13, 2011 Posted January 13, 2011 (edited) Hello there Im still learning the oldman and wish to be proficient with him :D But...look here [h] Close 2A > 5B > 3C > 2B > 5C > SJC > j.B > dj.A > j.B > j.214B > 9DD > j.B > dj.B> j.C (2357 Damage, 30% MG) I dont think its possible to double jump twice, is that dj.A right? No that combo does not work. Going into Wolf and back does not give you any jumps back. The technical although worse combo would end in j.B>dj.A>dj.B>j.214B>9DD>j.C So simply put, no that dj.A is incorrect. 2nd version 236A AA CH > 2c > 6b > 2c > 5c > j.B > j.214B > 5D > 236A > 214B > 5C > j.B > j.B >5b >9j.b > 3c~a > 5d >5b >2c > j.b > JC > j.b > j.c DMG=5.7k MG=61 Also just noting while this is a great combo in terms of heat gain and damage, its quite impractical as its greatly dependent on height and spacing. Getting the guaranteed 5C>j.B>j.214B is much safer while still giving you 50 meter. Edited January 13, 2011 by OrionXElite
GenoWhirl Posted January 13, 2011 Author Posted January 13, 2011 Edited the Close 2A combo how did that d.jA get there
OrionXElite Posted January 13, 2011 Posted January 13, 2011 Wanted to add a combo on here that starts with Wolf 236A and ISN'T just followed up by 236B :3 [W]236A>Land>D>[H]5C>JC>j.B>j.214B>6D>[W]j.236A>j.236B>5C>j.B>j.B>Land>5B>JC>j.AAA>JC>D>[H]j.C Midscreen Variant DMG:3474 Heat:39 [W]236A>Land>D>[H]5C>JC>j.B>j.214B>6D>[W]j.236A>j.236B>5C>j.B>j.B>Land>5B>JC>j.B>3C>j.A>Land>D>[H]5B>2C>JC>j.B>dj.B>dj.C Corner Variant DMG:3816 Heat:46 [W]236A CH>Land>D>[H]2C>6B>2C>JC>j.214B>2D>[W]236B>j.236B>5C>j.B>j.B>Land>5B>JC>j.B>3C>j.A>Land>D>[H]5B>2C>JC>j.B>j.C Corner Variant DMG:4493 Heat:54 Thing I love about this is that its easy to hit confirm and its better than the basic combo that just has you Beast Cannon all over the place. And while it burns a majority of your Wolf meter, it gets the opponent to the corner quite fast if you hit it. Another good thing about it is that its a good combo to hit off a basic reset if you have the Wolf meter. Meaty the [W]236A and if they get hit, go right into this. Given the proration on [W]236A, this is quite good for what you start with.
-Tsu- Posted January 14, 2011 Posted January 14, 2011 After hitting [w]236A you can do C dash>D>{h}2c>j.B>ect... for like 7% extra wolf meter (don't quote me, just eyeballing it). This does 2 things: 1. You get a lil bit more Damage out of the combo 2. Though the timing is tricky, you can pick which side you end up on, and since these combos carry over half the stage you can pretty much guarantee that you'll get to the corner for the [w]j.B>3C>j.A... extension Also for trolling/flash (both work on normal hit as well, the timing is just ridiculously tight): CH236A>9d (remember you cross them up)>D>236236C>RC>ect..... CH236A>5C>D>[h]2C>Astral (could probably do without the 2c, but it makes buffering the astral so much easier. make sure not to hit em too high)
OrionXElite Posted January 14, 2011 Posted January 14, 2011 (edited) After hitting [w]236A you can do C dash>D>{h}2c>j.B>ect... for like 7% extra wolf meter (don't quote me, just eyeballing it). This does 2 things: 1. You get a lil bit more Damage out of the combo 2. Though the timing is tricky, you can pick which side you end up on, and since these combos carry over half the stage you can pretty much guarantee that you'll get to the corner for the [w]j.B>3C>j.A... extension Yeah I was messing around with this too. I never tried non CH cause I assumed it either wasn't possible or ridiculously tight timing but given that works I went ahead and tried what you can maximize off a counter hit and you could go an extra step further and go [W]236A>5CD>[H]2C>6B(1)>5C>JC>j.B>j.214B>etc Only reason I cut out the 6B>2C part is because its a bitch to hit on most of the cast midscreen and to C Dash to the EXACT spot you need to be is quite difficult. This is the same result minus like 100 damage. Another quick bit, hitting the [W]236A as an AA non CH means you shouldn't be able to link [H]5C as its a pretty tight link already. CH is easy as shit though. Edited January 14, 2011 by OrionXElite
Sir Eti Posted January 15, 2011 Posted January 15, 2011 Is there any tips on reverting back to valk from his wolf form timing after 7c>b>b ?? D: I'm having a really really hard time with this I don't know why.
Recommended Posts