BlackYakuzu94 Posted September 23, 2013 Posted September 23, 2013 Because Terumi has to bust out the extra trolling to keep Hakumen off his ass.
LiveWireX Posted September 23, 2013 Posted September 23, 2013 Can it really be said you "lived" if you've been essentially reduced to a 'ghost' that has to inhabit bodies anyway?
HoudiniJr100 Posted September 23, 2013 Posted September 23, 2013 Can it really be said you "lived" if you've been essentially reduced to a 'ghost' that has to inhabit bodies anyway? ...why does this make so much sense? XD he's practically immortal to troll haku for all eternity if he can somehow find a body to take. Unless...hakumen kills relius before he makes another new body
Volt Posted September 23, 2013 Posted September 23, 2013 Well, considering that no one screws with Hakumen and lives, and that Terumi did and he's a ghost now... I don't really see a contradiction.
Ehecatl Posted September 24, 2013 Posted September 24, 2013 curious as to why terumi only seems to really dislike rachel. not that obvious reasons aren't obvious, just one really doesn't expect her to be there with ragna being so directly bent of stopping him, and rachel being in the sidelines. he also seemse to tease her often enough to seemingly not take her seriously despite saying she is able to 'keep up with him'... whatever that means. maybe he really just hates cats and the elegant vampire is always toting around her faithful cat servant?.... l just find it interesting she, of all things is his only dislike. perhaps more info will be shed on that. it was also funny Rachel remains one of his most powerful threats. Not necessarily in terms of fighting power as it's safe to say he's surpassed her ability to destroy him with her own power. However, Rachel is cunning, manipulative, strategic, and hellbent. She can undo all of his carefully laid plans in an instant if he's not careful and he is aware of that very keenly. In fact, she's been actively attempting that for thousands of years and during Calamity Trigger, he had to tread carefully around her because she really was a huge threat to him. Really, she's the only opponent he's had that can match him in terms of wits. The others can be goaded to do as he wants easily. Ragna, Jin, Kokonoe, and Hakumen are easily moved by their anger, hatred, and self-righteousness. The emotionally unstable like Noel, Litchi, and Tsubaki and can be broken and turned against each other (though Noel has finally toughened up and I think Hazama'll have to take her more seriously). Rachel remains one of the truly unaffected as nothing he says or do will bend her to his will. He knows it and he hates that. It means she'll always think rationally and make her next moves strategically rather than play his head games. And when she does that, she tends to gather and employ powerful figures to her side that CAN be a threat to him. In Continuum Shift, he outdid her as he had the upper hand in knowledge and had observed more than she, thus enabling him to steps ahead of her. But she was still a threat to be removed which is why he made a point to quickly incapacitate her with the Phantom's magic, which was his ace in the hole that Rachel didn't know about. Without her, the group opposing him essentially has no head. Of course, she'd already played all her hands before her capture and her careful nurturing had payed off at just the right time. Of course, he also got away with what he wanted because he's no dummy. Also, she is one of the few characters he's never successfully trolled. Even when he had her at his mercy to gloat, belittle, and kick, she never once gave in to his taunts. Never once would she cry out for mercy. Never once would she give in to despair. And never once would she bow her head. He revels in destroying a person's dignity and identity. She wouldn't give him that satisfaction. Instead she threw his insults right back in his face right up until the end until he just wanted to kill her in anger. On top of that? She probably had something to do with stifling him in the past. His hatred for all things cat comes from his hatred of Jubei who had screwed him but usually his weapon to switch places with him and lock Terumi in the boundary. Who knows? Maybe Rachel played a role there too.
TD Posted September 24, 2013 Posted September 24, 2013 Thank you all for the detailed answers. I highly appreciate the shared wisdom on the situation regarding terumi and rachel. I only knew what the story told me after sort of skimming through in cs1, trying to get mu. There has proven to be far more interesting relationships on second glance, especially regarding hime. Once again, thank you guys. More than you know.
Tsuki Garyuu Posted September 24, 2013 Posted September 24, 2013 Hakumen didn't even know Terumi was released until Jubei told him. Had he known, pretty sure he would have went straight after him instead of trying to get in Ragna's shit. ....Damn Ragna, your archenemy doesn't even consider you a threat. How's that for a kick in the balls. And oddly enough, Hakumen's still to stubborn to consider that maybe, just maybe, take the "enemy of my enemy" approach with Ragna. I could care less if he backstabs him afterwards. And yeah, Ragna's still considered a maggot to Terumi and a convenience/obstacle (can't decide which) for Kokonoe. He'll never be taken seriously. Aiya...
TPPR10 Posted September 24, 2013 Posted September 24, 2013 For all we know, all what he wanted to do is kill Celica and when he saw she was nursing some kids, he went "Eh, what the heck. Mind as well scar one of these brats for life before I'm out of here" Speaking of her, how old was she during Dark War?
harmless kitten Posted September 24, 2013 Posted September 24, 2013 For all we know, all what he wanted to do is kill Celica and when he saw she was nursing some kids, he went "Eh, what the heck. Mind as well scar one of these brats for life before I'm out of here" Speaking of her, how old was she during Dark War? He was there to nab Saya too. He carries off Jin and Saya and just leaves Ragna for dead, though oc I'm sure he knew Ragna wouldn't kick it. Celica is said to be in her mid-teens in Phase 0. 15-16? Phase 0 takes place sometime in 2106, so she would be about 18-19 by the end of the Dark War (1/1/2110).
Ehecatl Posted September 25, 2013 Posted September 25, 2013 And oddly enough, Hakumen's still to stubborn to consider that maybe, just maybe, take the "enemy of my enemy" approach with Ragna. I could care less if he backstabs him afterwards. And yeah, Ragna's still considered a maggot to Terumi and a convenience/obstacle (can't decide which) for Kokonoe. He'll never be taken seriously. Aiya... Never is a strong word. Ragna is the protagonist after all. Terumi hasn't and doesn't consider Ragna a threat at all, but Ragna has a way of exceeding people's expectations. I predict the end of this story will see Terumi cowering in fear of Ragna. Rachel and Jubei, the few enemies Terumi DOES worry about, have complete and absolute faith in Ragna as someone who will win in the end. They've carefully been building Ragna, Jin, and Noel up to be the saviors of this world and even if Rachel loses her temper and patience with them at times, she understands that nothing will ever change without them. So for thousands of years, they've been waiting for all the right conditions to fit just right to see them rise and then have actively been preparing them. During Calamity Trigger and Continuum Shift, Ragna and Jubei focused on Ragna almost exclusively. Now with him having learned what he needed and hardened his resolve, they've moved on to focusing on the other two. Rachel has been taking care of Noel while Jubei has been taking care of Jin. Past mistakes aside, I'd say they have good reason for focusing so closely on these three whom Terumi sees as irrelevant pawns. And I think his game'll bite him in the ass when he reaches the end of his rope. As for Hakumen? Well... what can one say? He's principled. And utterly predictable. Paladin types usually are. He's not an idiot but when he's locked on a course of action, he almost never deviates and that is something his enemies easily use against him. As for him helping Ragna? I wouldn't be surprised if he did in the future. It's not like he actually hates the guy. Hakumen's been developing subtly. He believes he needs to kill Ragna. That the world will be doomed if he doesn't. But when he had his chance in Continuum Shift, he chose mercy. It shows he isn't as robotically about his mission as he'd like others (and himself) to believe. He doesn't actually WANT to kill Ragna. And when seeing the man do something as selfless and heroic as he did to save Noel, Hakumen couldn't bring himself to deliver the killing blow in that moment. One wonders if he's starting to believe (hope) Ragna to be capable of more than being a destroyer of the world. He still carries on like he's going to kill him and tells others not to step in his way, but I think he really doesn't want to admit that the "softness" he criticized Rachel and Jubei of having is rubbing off on him. He is stubborn though. However, if Hakumen were to fight at his side later, I wouldn't be surprised. Hell, it could even be comical; with both bickering, criticizing, and threatening each other the whole time. "Do not mistake my intentions, Dark One. I fight with you now only to destroy a greater enemy. Once we are done here, I will bring an end to you myself." "Tch. Really? Whatever, freak. I've already kicked your ass once. So how bout we just make it through this; then afterwards, if you're still alive, we can find out together just how much punishment that mask can take." "Hmph. As you wish, beast." "Bitch."
Tokkan Posted September 25, 2013 Posted September 25, 2013 In the "Character Trailer"(?) at the end with Kokonoe and Hazama on the stages ceiling, isn't that an emblem(?)/drawing of Take-Mikazuchi. Are Terumi planning to shoot open the gate at the floor? It does look A LOT like Take-Mikazuchi, but Take-Mikazuchi can only fire once every few years right? Rachel says that it won't be able to fire for another four years. Some guy over in the JP BBS story thread reported that the stage you guys are referring to has "The 0th Rune City ISYANA" as its location.
BlackYakuzu94 Posted September 25, 2013 Posted September 25, 2013 Terumi cowering from Ragna? Maybe at the end of the series.
Zedar90 Posted September 25, 2013 Posted September 25, 2013 Some guy over in the JP BBS story thread reported that the stage you guys are referring to has "The 0th Rune City ISYANA" as its location. Isyana? Is that how Ishana is supposed to be written in English I wonder.
Tokkan Posted September 25, 2013 Posted September 25, 2013 (edited) Isyana? Is that how Ishana is supposed to be written in English I wonder. Ishana = Hepburn romanisation. Isyana = Kunrei-shiki romanisation. That's how I look at it. They are both the same; use whichever until localisation decides on which, though if the the localisation team is smart they'd go with Ishana because Hepburn romanisation is more compatible with the English phonology. Edit: Looking back at what it looks like where the name "Ishana" came from, probably should stick with Ishana regardless of romanisation methods. Edited September 25, 2013 by Tokkan
Tsuki Garyuu Posted September 25, 2013 Posted September 25, 2013 Never is a strong word. Ragna is the protagonist after all. Terumi hasn't and doesn't consider Ragna a threat at all, but Ragna has a way of exceeding people's expectations. I predict the end of this story will see Terumi cowering in fear of Ragna. Rachel and Jubei, the few enemies Terumi DOES worry about, have complete and absolute faith in Ragna as someone who will win in the end. They've carefully been building Ragna, Jin, and Noel up to be the saviors of this world and even if Rachel loses her temper and patience with them at times, she understands that nothing will ever change without them. So for thousands of years, they've been waiting for all the right conditions to fit just right to see them rise and then have actively been preparing them. During Calamity Trigger and Continuum Shift, Ragna and Jubei focused on Ragna almost exclusively. Now with him having learned what he needed and hardened his resolve, they've moved on to focusing on the other two. Rachel has been taking care of Noel while Jubei has been taking care of Jin. Past mistakes aside, I'd say they have good reason for focusing so closely on these three whom Terumi sees as irrelevant pawns. And I think his game'll bite him in the ass when he reaches the end of his rope. Of course Ragna is gonna make due himself and kick ass, I'm simply saying nobody gives a shit about him except Rachel, the only one who needs him to be an important asset. Terumi doesn't consider him a threat even AFTER getting a bludgeon beatdown because he had an ace in the whole, hence why he was provoking Ragna to kill him. There is also, again, Kokonoe, seeing Ragna as just a convenience (i.e. a tool) when he's at the right place at the right AND as an obstacle when, apparently, he's either getting in her way or is keeping intel to herself and Tager. The fight between Ragna and Tager wouldn't have happened if it weren't the latter. It doesn't help that neither parties have any incentive to consider working together (so much for Ragna joining Sector Seven). In short, Ragna has a shit ton of shoes to fill on his own merits. However, if Hakumen were to fight at his side later, I wouldn't be surprised. Hell, it could even be comical; with both bickering, criticizing, and threatening each other the whole time. "Do not mistake my intentions, Dark One. I fight with you now only to destroy a greater enemy. Once we are done here, I will bring an end to you myself." "Tch. Really? Whatever, freak. I've already kicked your ass once. So how bout we just make it through this; then afterwards, if you're still alive, we can find out together just how much punishment that mask can take." "Hmph. As you wish, beast." "Bitch." This is Blazblue, it would be a sin if this doesn't happen. And going back to Terumi, I gotta ask: remember when Ragna was hesitant to kill Terumi because of this supposed "Life Link" he has with Noel? The term itself should obviously imply that their very lives are connected. Terumi dies, Noel dies. So why didn't that occur when Relius killed Terumi?
Tokkan Posted September 25, 2013 Posted September 25, 2013 And going back to Terumi, I gotta ask: remember when Ragna was hesitant to kill Terumi because of this supposed "Life Link" he has with Noel? The term itself should obviously imply that their very lives are connected. Terumi dies, Noel dies. So why didn't that occur when Relius killed Terumi? What? No, the life link means that in order to permanently kill Terumi, he'd have to also kill Mu and make sure he killed them both simultaneously. If Terumi dies while Mu still lived, Terumi would just come back to life and vice versa.
BlackYakuzu94 Posted September 25, 2013 Posted September 25, 2013 Life Links are fucking weird, has it ever been established how they work? And from his Arcade ending, don't Ragna & Nu still have theirs?
harmless kitten Posted September 25, 2013 Posted September 25, 2013 Ragna stops beating Terumi up because he knows he's just wasting time and effort. Terumi had planned for Ragna to actually kill him, but he doesn't. Relius ends up using Ignis to tear out his throat (probably because Terumi has to die for a moment in order to sneak into Takamagahara). I think that by undoing her tempering and causing her to lose the power of the Eye (temporarily?) Ragna also broke the life-link. Hazama was going to kill Noel after Mu was defeated, but the Imperator showed up and told him to stand down before then. AFAIK Ragna and Nu still have theirs. Certainly nothing else has been said of it since. I remember somebody comparing life-links to Schroedinger's Cat, but I think nothing has actually been established in series. Aside from what Terumi tells Ragna and some of Kokonoe's mutterings, there's jack.
Volt Posted September 25, 2013 Posted September 25, 2013 Ragna stops beating Terumi up because he knows he's just wasting time and effort. Terumi had planned for Ragna to actually kill him, but he doesn't. Relius ends up using Ignis to tear out his throat (probably because Terumi has to die for a moment in order to sneak into Takamagahara). I think that by undoing her tempering and causing her to lose the power of the Eye (temporarily?) Ragna also broke the life-link. Hazama was going to kill Noel after Mu was defeated, but the Imperator showed up and told him to stand down before then. AFAIK Ragna and Nu still have theirs. Certainly nothing else has been said of it since. I remember somebody comparing life-links to Schroedinger's Cat, but I think nothing has actually been established in series. Aside from what Terumi tells Ragna and some of Kokonoe's mutterings, there's jack. It's more like Terumi needed to die for a moment to not be detected when he entered Takamagahara. Or did Rachel die to get in there?
harmless kitten Posted September 25, 2013 Posted September 25, 2013 That's why I said sneak into Takamagahara. Or he just needs to die to get into the Boundary in general. I don't like going by Rachel's example because she does all sorts of weird shit when it comes to the Boundary (showing up in Nu's dreams, Noel's CT arcade ending, Phase 0 near the end, Phase Shift 4, etc). Of course, if you believe Terumi's taunts to her, she's not even fully alive in the first place--he calls her undead. Some guy over in the JP BBS story thread reported that the stage you guys are referring to has "The 0th Rune City ISYANA" as its location. Just watched the new videos posted in the gameplay thread with those stages. "Old Gate," with the stage quote of "Certa amittimus dum incerta petimus" (We lose what is certain when we seek what is uncertain). Where is Ishana supposed to be anyway? The other stage is Yggdrasill Seed (and fittingly enough shows a tree with glowing blue leaves in the background of what appears to be a NOL facility) in the 6th Hierarchical City of Yabiko, stage quote is "Speak fair and think what you like."
BlackYakuzu94 Posted September 25, 2013 Posted September 25, 2013 Yggdrassil Seed is probably Kagura's stage.
Alpha to Omega Posted September 25, 2013 Posted September 25, 2013 Just watched the new videos posted in the gameplay thread with those stages. "Old Gate," with the stage quote of "Certa amittimus dum incerta petimus" (We lose what is certain when we seek what is uncertain). Where is Ishana supposed to be anyway? Ishana is on the Atlantic Ocean.
cr1ms0n Posted September 26, 2013 Posted September 26, 2013 You know, I'm surprised it took them 725+ time loop scenarios just to get them to chronophantasma. So much trial and error.
ChaosAlt222 Posted September 26, 2013 Posted September 26, 2013 Slight change of plans for when BBCP is released on console. Instead of just enforcing the CS thread's rules in this one, I will make a new thread. (no reason for people to have to start on post 4137 or whatever it ends up being to get to the "meat" of the thread) If I have time to pull the useful, confirmed info out of this thread, this one will be deleted. If I can't find the time to sift through these 3800+ posts within a month, I'll lock it instead.
Tokkan Posted September 26, 2013 Posted September 26, 2013 If I have time to pull the useful, confirmed info out of this thread, this one will be deleted. If I can't find the time to sift through these 3800+ posts within a month, I'll lock it instead. Uh... can you please just do the latter? I don't want a thread that begins with posts taken from another, no longer existent thread. I'd prefer the new thread for consoles to start completely fresh.
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