[CP] Relius Clover vs Noel Vermillion

[TD]

Discuss the Noel matchup here.

The Neutral Game

Long Range: Your Tools vs Her Tools

Medium Range: Your Tools vs Her Tools

Close Quarters: Your Tools vs Her Tools

In The Air: Your Tools vs Her Tools

Offense

Your Offense:

Her Offense:

Defense

Your Defense:

Her Defense:

Gimmicks and Resets

Match Summary

[Iron Savior]

I have no idea what to do against d spammers, if you get close she can use her d moves, if you are fullscreen you can't use your long range Ignis moves because of optic barrel, i tried doing Lanto when close like Myoro suggested, but her 4d went right trough it

Maybe you can 2b+4d, but i haven't tested if 4d hits her out of 2d

Also how do you deal with her d strings?, if i block i'm probably getting hit, especially in lag as you can't react to her assault trough, if i evade it, Lanto doesn't work as she can go right trough it with 4d, the assault trough you if you tried to do anything with Relius

 

I also tried to J.B her as she jumped out of a Lanto in the corner, but she used J.D and hit me out of it

[Poultrygeist]

If she's just in your face mashing D can't you just 236A and punish?  

[NecroTheReaper]

If you're in the air right on top of her, pretty much any j.D move will beat out her D moves. They all have projectile attribute and ignis absorbs projectiles. j.214B is a great tool to bait a lot of her stuff and its getting buffed in the patch. Also, outside of 50 heat for gatling gun DD, she can't do anything except anticipate or jump out of a meaty grab setup (and you can just OS jump with BC+4D). Optic Barrel can be a pain, but it has gaps, and Relius can exploit those gaps. Full screen away, her C optic barrel cant hit, so if you backstep it (dunno how many actives it has, may be impossible) and hit 214B after, she either has to block, jump, or get CH'd trying to get another optic barrel out.

If you wanna make things simple, just try to stay at or slightly outside of 5B max range and use j.xD moves to close in. Noel doesn't have a poke to really challenge us (though she does have a better air to air game). Also, a 214C in pressure can bait her drives hard. If she 2Ds, I think ignis' crossup hitbox tags her, and if she does 4D and doesn't cancel it into full through, she'll get CH'd.

And no, you cant wiff punish drives with 236A because they're cancellable on wiff. She'll just go into a move with long actives and get you with a painful CH combo.

[Myoro]

I, Myoro, summon anyone with good MU knowledge to this thread.

 

So what do. Why do all of her drive moves seem conspicuously safe? I want to punish things like noels using 4D>assault through to just bypass my Ignis zoning, but blocked or whiffed Assault through seems safe. Even if I react and 5B it seems to trade which I don't want.

 

Can someone give me answers to the various things a Noel will do in combat? Give me some ways to get sure fire punishes on her? I feel like if I master blocking her high low mix-up she can't touch me on the defensive, but rando invuln on my offensive or my counteroffensive into 20 minute long combo anywhere (give or take an hour if, god forbid, she resets you) is giving me some headaches.

[Errol]

4d assault through can be punished before it goes active with bigger stuff. this is if she does it at neutral. probably best bet is throw, though.

 

if you block it, IB 5A. you won't be able to punish with 5b.

[Myoro]

Ah thanks Errol, that tip is immediately useful!