[Xrd] Slayer Gameplay Discussion

[P10]

My friend has a Zato and he likes to get out of trouble by flying above me and then coming down swinging with a j.K - I'm wondering if there's a good way to really punish him for that. Is the best option just 6P and hope it counterhits so I can convert a good combo?

(preferably simple options - consistent anti-air BDC something might be beyond me atm - I'm new!)

[P10]

double post

Edited December 14, 2015 by P10

[_Sey]

5 hours ago, P10 said:

My friend has a Zato and he likes to get out of trouble by flying above me and then coming down swinging with a j.K - I'm wondering if there's a good way to really punish him for that. Is the best option just 6P and hope it counterhits so I can convert a good combo?

(preferably simple options - consistent anti-air BDC something might be beyond me atm - I'm new!)

AA'ing Zato flight is quite troublesome.
Your best option is BDC air throw, YRC air throw or just try to get away from that situation with backdash/bdc dandy or something like that.
2S/5P are kind of bad in this scenario, and 6P may lose to flight jS.

[fogelstrom]

7 hours ago, P10 said:

My friend has a Zato and he likes to get out of trouble by flying above me and then coming down swinging with a j.K - I'm wondering if there's a good way to really punish him for that. Is the best option just 6P and hope it counterhits so I can convert a good combo?

(preferably simple options - consistent anti-air BDC something might be beyond me atm - I'm new!)

As Sey already pointed out air throw is your best friend here.
Due to the angle of all of Zatos air normals except j.D he even beats 6P. The variation in timing from Zato makes the risk/reward kinda iffy. Obviously don't throw 6P out the window but it's not that good in this particular situation. 2S is imo better but it's still not good.
You can even attempt 6H but requires some nice spacing and you will probably get beaten most of the time anyway.
BDC P Dandy CWH is quite nice though. But also requires you to be more on point. Check it out at least

I try to dash forward/backward and chill most of the time and try to catch Zatos coming down to the ground a lot of the times.

Fly = sodium inducing like hell

[P10]

P Dandy CWH seems like it beats everything if I can predict when he's going to come down swinging. Dashing out from underneath him also seems important - I was freezing up and letting him fly right over me, and when in that position 6P and especially 6H can go the wrong way. I'm not sure I understand the BDC air throw option though. Am I trying to time the BDC invincibility to go through their air normal and immediately throw them?

[The Adventurer]

Hi, new to the Forum, and enjoying the hell out of Xrd on PC. I like Slayer a lot, and I kind of want to main him for a while. I just have one question.

What the heck is Undertow good for? The Wiki doesn't have any detail on it, and its start up is so slow I have no idea what its purpose is. Does it reflect projectiles?

[fogelstrom]

7 hours ago, P10 said:

P Dandy CWH seems like it beats everything if I can predict when he's going to come down swinging. Dashing out from underneath him also seems important - I was freezing up and letting him fly right over me, and when in that position 6P and especially 6H can go the wrong way. I'm not sure I understand the BDC air throw option though. Am I trying to time the BDC invincibility to go through their air normal and immediately throw them?

BDC Air throw is so that you get the 6F invul and hopefully you will use them to not get hit out of pre-jump frames so you get airborne and can airgrab extended hitbox from air normals. I find BDJC air throw quite difficult. I try to use it when Sol players use safe jump oki to low air dash j.PPPPPPP butclearly I'm no Ogawa that even throws that without any invul.
 

1 hour ago, The Adventurer said:

Hi, new to the Forum, and enjoying the hell out of Xrd on PC. I like Slayer a lot, and I kind of want to main him for a while. I just have one question.

What the heck is Undertow good for? The Wiki doesn't have any detail on it, and its start up is so slow I have no idea what its purpose is. Does it reflect projectiles?

Undertow is a gimmick move. It's unblockable but due to huge startup it has no value outside of RRC and even then it's not guaranteed.
For example if your opponent has ~5% HP left you can 236K, RRC, Undertow on block and they only get a small window to do anything besides DAA/burst. So you can steal wins that way. It's possible to both backdash and Blitz but due to RRC the timing is difficult.

If you got 100% meter you can do 236K, RRC, Undertow, RRC, 214KP, 5H, 2H, c.S, air combo.

It's a nice thing to know about and it got better uses if you can crank upp RISC guage so you can combo with only 50% meter. But in the end it's just a gimmick.

[_Sey]

6 hours ago, The Adventurer said:

Hi, new to the Forum, and enjoying the hell out of Xrd on PC. I like Slayer a lot, and I kind of want to main him for a while. I just have one question.

What the heck is Undertow good for? The Wiki doesn't have any detail on it, and its start up is so slow I have no idea what its purpose is. Does it reflect projectiles?

Undertow is really good at messing up your P dandy input and making you waste 25% for a YRC
Thankfully this can actually be good at times, I've hit waaaay too many people who were dumbfounded by 6H > Undertow because they expected me to NOT fuck up 6H 214P~S. (don't do this intentionally, undertow is easily one of the most useless move in the game).

[koufdell]

best case scenario against characters without reversals in corner 
2D knockdown > undertow yrc if backdash rrc on hit then go for air combo

stick a 2PS os and you get air combo if they backdash 

[The Adventurer]

Okay, that makes sense. I missed the fact that it was unblockable. Which explains its less then exceptional startup.

[fogelstrom]

6K Mortal Counter, IK? Doesn't work. Sad face.
BUT
Danger time 100% meter and opponent in corner...
xx, 236K, RRC, 632146P MC, IK

Random Mappa MC, IK also works.

Needs more IK :D
 

[Melo]

I see Hase use bite > 2H a lot and while not a true string, he more often than not gets a black beat combo and usually follows up with throwing the opponents air tech attempt. I 've always found it hard to air throw with SL so whenever I would attempt it myself, I would fail lol.

However, I messed around with inputting my airthrow as 66, 32147896 P+HS and I can get the air throw every time.

[IreulTheSlayer]

So, with Xrd finally and unexpectedly rolling out on PC, I finally tried Xrd Slayer for real (sold PS3 after crushing the pad in frustration over AC+R), and I have just one question.

What kind of antidepressants are you guys using?

Xrd summary is "Press X to humiliate Slayer". Continuing without happiness pills seems likely to make me leave the room without using a door in quest to reach terminal velocity.

[fogelstrom]

Maybe you should try your hand at Elphelt.
All of Xrd Slayer is a struggle so if you couldn't handle AC+R might as well go for ezpz S tier right away.

[IreulTheSlayer]

3 hours ago, fogelstrom said:

Maybe you should try your hand at Elphelt.
All of Xrd Slayer is a struggle so if you couldn't handle AC+R might as well go for ezpz S tier right away.

For best, or, much more likely, worst, my character is set. All I know about guilty gear from 10 years of rolling in it is seen from slayer's perspective,  and expanding it is simply beyond my brain capacity. Not to mention it will completely nullify whatever little I can do, will deprive me of every advantage of experience, and will severely clash with all the reflexes I worked to build. Trying my hand at Elphelt (or any other phelt) is simply not an option.

Speaking of options, I have 3: quit guilty gear (and suffer severe withdrawal for the rest of my pathetic life), quit life (seems to be the best option at the moment), and get some pills which will make me stop caring and be like everyone else.

I figured people who still play slayer are closer to the latter option and asked if they are. Are they?

[fogelstrom]

I can only speak for myself but I'm almost always having a blast playing Slayer and would not want to play any other character in Xrd Sign or Revelator. I don't have any sub characters and only use other characters when recording in training mode. I just have too much fun playing Slayer every single time and that is drug and alcohol free.
 

[IreulTheSlayer]

30 minutes ago, fogelstrom said:

I can only speak for myself but I'm almost always having a blast playing Slayer and would not want to play any other character in Xrd Sign or Revelator. I don't have any sub characters and only use other characters when recording in training mode. I just have too much fun playing Slayer every single time and that is drug and alcohol free.
 

Thank you for your input.

But is there something else except becoming hardcore masochist?

[fogelstrom]

But seriously there isn't any shortcut. Practice and play until you win.

[IreulTheSlayer]

49 minutes ago, fogelstrom said:

But seriously there isn't any shortcut. Practice and play until you win.

Practice and play until you quit life, since winning and slayer have no intersection in Xrd. I got you.

ED: Oh and forgot to thank you for being a jackass. You have no idea how much of the effort this trash character has wasted away from my life.

[Melo]

1 hour ago, IreulTheSlayer said:

Practice and play until you quit life, since winning and slayer have no intersection in Xrd. I got you.

ED: Oh and forgot to thank you for being a jackass. You have no idea how much of the effort this trash character has wasted away from my life.

Damn dude, you are being salty AF. I mean, coming straight from AC+R SL, it is understandable but it's not that bad really. Is the struggle real for Slayer in Xrd? Yes, across pretty much every match-up. However, with smart play, you can still win. And I'll echo Fogelstrom, Slayer is the most fun for me in Xrd.

I'd say most of my loses come down to my own mistakes more than the flaws in Slayer (dropped a combo, messed up BDC Bite/DoT/Mappa/Dandy, fucked up my oki set-up, got too flowcharty, etc). I've tried Sol, Ky and Millia and they all seem boring in comparison. It'll definitely take work, but it's not suicide inducing. SL is no PO.

[IreulTheSlayer]

2 minutes ago, Melo said:

Damn dude, you are being salty AF. I mean, coming straight from AC+R SL, it is understandable but it's not that bad really. Is the struggle real for Slayer in Xrd? Yes, across pretty much every match-up. However, with smart play, you can still win. And I'll echo Fogelstrom, Slayer is the most fun for me in Xrd.

I'd say most of my loses come down to my own mistakes more than the flaws in Slayer (dropped a combo, messed up BDC Bite/DoT/Mappa/Dandy, fucked up my oki set-up, got too flowcharty, etc). I've tried Sol, Ky and Millia and they all seem boring in comparison. It'll definitely take work, but it's not suicide inducing. SL is no PO.

I dunno if anyone normal can't be at least that salty. It's a thick skin miracle being alive (even though I got my hand in the cast for 3 weeks breaking the damn gamepad) considering what we have to deal with trying slayer.

Smart play seems to be the least meaningful of things to consider. Smart play shines with a lot of options. Slayer's options are at best choosing the corner he dies in. He simply doesn't have any options every other character wouldn't counter while the player controlling them is eating a sandwich looking outside the window.

I always told people that if you need "still" in "you can still win", then you have already lost pathetically and just extending your misery - it's going to be miserable even if you win by opponent self-destruction that way. The truth of those words is absolute - even if you beat someone because they mess up 4 times in a row after the floor has been wept with you, it's still miserable and pathetic thing which has nothing in common with victory.

You are just making silly and pointless excuses, blaming yourself for your losses. You would've lost even if you haven't dropped a combo. You would've lost even if you had the power to never miss a key. Your defeat happened in character select, and saying you lost because of a mistake is the same as blaming the opponent for not self-destructing. Meaningless excuses.

Work is ok for the result which is worth the effort. Slayer requires being a god to lose with opponent half-health instead of perfect. This is suicide-inducing situation at its finest: a perfect problem with no solution, other than quitting.

SL is not PO. I've beaten people with PO just rolling potemkin buster and backdashing, a 2-move power which exceeds entire slayer arsenal with an ease of spamming bridal express. The main problem of a slayer is that the character is so laughably weak and optionless that there is nothing you can do even if you know perfectly what people are going to do. PO doesn't have that problem, he has an arsenal full of stuff that predictable people will get in trouble with. And while I'm mad, salty, rusty and have terrible muscle memory, I've been at this game for 10 years and more than 30 tournaments. This was the toughest bit to swallow - that I have to use a character which has no power even over people I read like a book. I'm literally suffocating on this bit right now.

[_Sey]

tbh Slayer is about a few buffs away from being amazing (comboable 6K, better reward off midscreen 5HS/2HS would make him really scary without being really stupid buffs), he really isn't that bad as a character, personally I don't think he loses to every character in the game, he does have some impossible matchups though (Axl, Bedman... Pot?).
The new forward dust and blitz in revelator are also pretty good QoL updates for Slayer imho (for example the new blitz should may be really strong vs. Sol's GF setplay).

Yes, he doesn't have as much bullshit as some other characters.
Yes, he does require a bit of execution (bdc DOT, reversal bdc bite).
You are likely not paying 100yen for every loss you take.
Look, I hate losing as much as the next guy and I love whining about my characters in any FG, but considering I don't live in Japan I'm not losing any money playing this game and even if at times it's quite stressful to play Slayer, actually reading your opponent tendencies and exploiting them for huge reward is fun.
Slayer is actually the 4th or 5th most played character in the arcades too, stupid JPs just don't understand what "fun" is about.

If you are that good at reading people but can't seem to beat anyone with Slayer you may have to go back to the drawing board: you are bad at playing Slayer.
You may want to switch to someone more like Sol.
I find it funny that you honestly think PO is that much better versus bad players than Slayer, do you just don't know how Slayer's tools work? Slayer is a scrubs killer.
 

Quote

a 2-move power which exceeds entire slayer arsenal with an ease of spamming bridal express

Have you ever heard of Pile bunker and It's late?

 

It's OK to be bad at something!
That's how you git gud.

Happy new year!

[fogelstrom]

10 hours ago, IreulTheSlayer said:

Practice and play until you quit life, since winning and slayer have no intersection in Xrd. I got you.

ED: Oh and forgot to thank you for being a jackass. You have no idea how much of the effort this trash character has wasted away from my life.

I've had win streaks against Goga without having to quit life.
If I hop online and don't play any really noteable names in EU online I usally only lose a handful matches during a whole evening.

[IreulTheSlayer]

6 hours ago, _Sey said:

tbh Slayer is about a few buffs away from being amazing (comboable 6K, better reward off midscreen 5HS/2HS would make him really scary without being really stupid buffs), he really isn't that bad as a character, personally I don't think he loses to every character in the game, he does have some impossible matchups though (Axl, Bedman... Pot?).
The new forward dust and blitz in revelator are also pretty good QoL updates for Slayer imho (for example the new blitz should may be really strong vs. Sol's GF setplay).

Yes, he doesn't have as much bullshit as some other characters.
Yes, he does require a bit of execution (bdc DOT, reversal bdc bite).
You are likely not paying 100yen for every loss you take.
Look, I hate losing as much as the next guy and I love whining about my characters in any FG, but considering I don't live in Japan I'm not losing any money playing this game and even if at times it's quite stressful to play Slayer, actually reading your opponent tendencies and exploiting them for huge reward is fun.
Slayer is actually the 4th or 5th most played character in the arcades too, stupid JPs just don't understand what "fun" is about.

If you are that good at reading people but can't seem to beat anyone with Slayer you may have to go back to the drawing board: you are bad at playing Slayer.
You may want to switch to someone more like Sol.
I find it funny that you honestly think PO is that much better versus bad players than Slayer, do you just don't know how Slayer's tools work? Slayer is a scrubs killer.
 

Have you ever heard of Pile bunker and It's late?

 

It's OK to be bad at something!
That's how you git gud.

Happy new year!

Another jackass, thanks you for being a prick.

First, he's a few buffs away from being below average, currently he's terrible.

Second, it's a pretty good QoL for everyone which automatically leaves terrible being terrible.

Third, he has no bullshit as he dies before making a move most of the time.

Fourth, no amount of execution changes third.

Fifth, I will most likely pay with my life for it. If it were just 100 yen I could escape the torment with, it would've been a cheap price to pay.

Sixth, even if you read your opponents like a book, an impotent character like slayer just cannot expoit it. I got another lesson of it just now - slayer will pathetically lose to any SABC-tier spamming 2-3 moves because his arsenal simply contains nothing which can be used to counter. Too weak. Completely unrewarding, permanent loss, feels like absolute rundown even if you manage to win by opponent self-destruction.

So, Japan has many masochists who have fun sucking. Their problem.

I'm as good as anyone playing Slayer. They lose due to character weakness, I'm the same. There are no ranks for slayers currently.

I find it funny you try so hard to perverse reality just to make fun of the guy speaking his mind. PO is just better. By a wide margin. Slayer struggles versus 6HS mashing scrubs, because his entire arsenal loses to average character's 6HS. Nothing more to it. He's not a scrub killer by any means, as it is very difficult to be even average among scrubs while using a character with 16 negative matchups.

Pile Bunker is automatic defeat, it's late is countered by every normal Elphelt has. Each and every. So stronk...

It's OK to be bad at insulting others, and I'm going to quit life over this issue anyway, so by all means, keep being a jerk and lie to me more so I do it faster, so you can feel you achieved something by driving me off.

Jerk.

[IreulTheSlayer]

4 hours ago, fogelstrom said:

I've had win streaks against Goga without having to quit life.
If I hop online and don't play any really noteable names in EU online I usally only lose a handful matches during a whole evening.

Me too, but, just like you, on forums only.

I wonder why people like you need so many bullshit? Is it where you get your kicks from?