[Xrd] Venom Q&A Thread

[antonymichiru]

Any anti air strategy?

[Kirnupiima]

Any anti air strategy?

I've found 6H to be surprisingly good against IAD but you kind of have to yomi it. 6P is fine and on counter hit combos to 6H and set. You can also S Double Head Morbid  to shoot K and P balls straight up, it's really neat when it hits :D

 

Oh and air throw is the name of the game!

[freelander]

What can we do about Sin's slide?  It seems to low profile a lot of our stuff.

use more S Carcass Ride in neutral and at the end of blockstrings

[DaiAndOh]

Any anti air strategy?

 

 

I've found 6H to be surprisingly good against IAD but you kind of have to yomi it. 6P is fine and on counter hit combos to 6H and set. You can also S Double Head Morbid  to shoot K and P balls straight up, it's really neat when it hits :D

 

Oh and air throw is the name of the game!

2HS still seems worthy of some burn, but c.S seems pretty bad now for AA purposes.

use more S Carcass Ride in neutral and at the end of blockstrings

While that will take care of his slide, beak driver (the thrust) will mess you up. That move alone (it also negates projectiles) is huge for Sin in that matchup. One matchup threads can get made, I'll post some of my theories on the matchup based on my experiences playing against him at NEC.

[nstalkie]

When I do a c.S > IAD > j.S > j.HS > j.D, I frequently get that the j.HS whiffs. Any tips on making it not whiff? Am I doing j.S too early / too late?

 

Edit: nevermind, found it in the combo thread:

General execution tips:
When doing one of his combos that requires a jump cancel into immediate airdash(8 66), input 8 on the move you want to jump cancel, and react to Venom leaving the ground to do the airdash. This gives you the timing for 8 66 which can only be described as an awkward delay.

 

Unless, this is not why the j.HS misses?

I do get the airdash.

I'll try this method when I get home from work.

[Epic]

It depends which method you'll stick with. I personally just do 96 and have to delay the jump cancel a bit for j.S to hit. But if it's easier for you try 866 or 766 since it comes out a bit slower. Me personally had problems with those two options as j.S wasn't coming out most of the time so I stuck with 96.

But yeah you justneed to delay it the jump for it to work like it's supposed to, as the character needs to fall a bit after the initial c.S(3).

[SnowMonkeyFunky]

Is anyone else having trouble timing ball oki, especially K ball, online? I know netplay is gonna be netplay, but even in +R I could manage semi consistent meaty ball mixups. I think the new K ball's position is a tiny bit farther forward, meaning the old timing for dash jump K will make the ball go past them and whiff. Anyone have any ideas to compensate for that? Maybe delay dash jump jK or walk forward jK?

[GodPress]

Is anyone else having trouble timing ball oki, especially K ball, online? I know netplay is gonna be netplay, but even in +R I could manage semi consistent meaty ball mixups. I think the new K ball's position is a tiny bit farther forward, meaning the old timing for dash jump K will make the ball go past them and whiff. Anyone have any ideas to compensate for that? Maybe delay dash jump jK or walk forward jK?

Someone else was having issues with this so there might be weight to it. Personally, I haven't had too much issues with meaty K ball oki. Like you said though, netplay is gonna be netplay.

[SnowMonkeyFunky]

^Out of curiosity, what do you use to set up K ball oki? IE: Dash jump K, regular jump k, etc.

[MasterXDrake]

So what buffs would you give him?

[DaiAndOh]

^Out of curiosity, what do you use to set up K ball oki? IE: Dash jump K, regular jump k, etc.

 

Dash j.K. Dash j.S works too and j.S covers a greater area for hitting balls, requires slightly different timing for opponent's wakeup though. In a twitch archive hopefully on youtube soon HEVEN opts for all j.S for K ball oki.

 

 

So what buffs would you give him?

 

While I'm not going to mod this nor stop anyone from answering, I'm not going to list anything. We JUST got the console version, let's play and figure things out we have now and get better!

[GodPress]

^Out of curiosity, what do you use to set up K ball oki? IE: Dash jump K, regular jump k, etc.

I use Dash j.K. I should definitely use j.S more as Dai mentioned though. 

[SnowMonkeyFunky]

I did some testing with both dash jS and slight delay dash jK so here's another long winded write up: (Zato as dummy but it 'shouldn't' make a difference unless there are wonky hitboxes for some characters as they get up)

-Dash jump jS is almost* always better for K ball oki midscreen than dash jK.

Why?

-In situations where the dash jump causes a crossup (IE almost* everything ending in 2D), the jK would make the ball push the dummy away, making the low mixup of 2K clS come out as 2K fS and not allowing a followup normal on P QV from the high option. The dash jS has an easier time hitting the ball in such a way that the dummy is pushed towards you as you go to the other side and land 2K/reverse airdash jS. This makes both followup combos not only possible off K ball oki, but also far easier than done from a neutral state.

-for knockdowns off of 6HS, the dash jS hits the K ball at a more shallow horizontal angle, and at a faster speed. Both jS and jK are possible, and overall very easy to set up, but for the sake of consistency it's probably a good idea to drill in that jS is, for the most part, the go to normal for midscreen K ball oki.

*The only situation midscreen where dash jK is favorable is off of 1-2 low pushback hits into 2D. The awkward range seems to be the knockdown distance between dash momentum 2K 2D xx K ball and point blank no dash momentum 2K clS (1) 2D xx K ball. This is because if they decide to crouch, the jS' ball hit angle will make it whiff. If you feel like you really would rather set up dash jS midscreen off of a close 2K or something similar, do either 2K clS (2) 2D xx K ball stuff or 2K 2S 2D xx K ball stuff. Be aware of this range when setting up K ball off of 2D from a gatling.

What about the corner?:

-Corner K ball oki actually benefits more from dash jK's vertical angle and slower speed for both primary knockdowns. I couldn't really find any situations where dash jS would be favorable here.

How do you time dash jS for K ball oki?:

-The best way I can describe it for off a 2D is that you are reacting to their rising animation and inputting dash jS as they're getting up. This is a good bit later than dash jK's preemptively timed hit. To test if you're timing it right, record the dummy to stand there for about a second, then hold up for five or so seconds. Hit playback, then do 2K 2S 2D xx K ball, react to rising and dash jump jS. If they get hit by the ball and they're still standing, you timed it right.

-For off of 6HS it's only a miniscule delay. The extra speed and shallow angle make it so that there isn't much difference between using dash jK and dash jS.

And that's it, at least from what I could find. If anyone finds any discrepancies or flat out inaccuracies please let me know and I'll fix it.

On a semi unrelated note, do you guys mind these long ass write ups? I'm by no means the best Venom the world, but I do my best to try and figure out every nuance of a given situation. I try to go into as much detail as I can for the sake of people like me who are still in the learning process for this character. If it's too much I'll cut back next time. Also, if this post should be in the combo thread or general discussion instead of Q/A, I'll delete and move it. I just figured since we were already talking about different normals for K ball oki that I'd post it here.

[Venussail91]

Does anyone know what the recovery frames are on Sol's dashing fire punch thingy?  I don't want to attack because it looks like it's + on block, but if it's actually negative, should we go for something like f.S to punish it or should we just play neutral again?

[DaiAndOh]

Important stuff

 

This explains a lot. I was wondering why I would get 2K, f.S or 2K c.S(1) on standers after K ball oki. If you don't mind posting it in general discussion, and leaving a referral link in your original post, that would be great! I'd also like to use a lot of it on the wiki, unless someone else wants to to start on the Oki section first (ah it'll probably be me anyway :P).

 

Does anyone know what the recovery frames are on Sol's dashing fire punch thingy?  I don't want to attack because it looks like it's + on block, but if it's actually negative, should we go for something like f.S to punish it or should we just play neutral again?

Please check frame data for those kind of questions! It's all available on the wiki!

I don't have enough Sol experience to give a big comment, so he's plus, but what you retaliate with, should you choose to, depends on his spacing.

[nstalkie]

On a semi unrelated note, do you guys mind these long ass write ups?

 

On the contrary. The more complete information is, the better.

[GodPress]

Does anyone know what the recovery frames are on Sol's dashing fire punch thingy?  I don't want to attack because it looks like it's + on block, but if it's actually negative, should we go for something like f.S to punish it or should we just play neutral again?

Fafnir is +4 on block. IBing it will be as close as you can get to resetting it to neutral. 

[skiller41]

What is THE go-to combo vs. crouchers mid screen (I’m new to Venom and GG so full notation would be really appreciated >< )? I have the most trouble getting the ball hit after something like, say,  c.S(1) > SQV, 5p BH > IAD > j.SHSD > …. I don’t seem to have any issues with any QV stuff in the corner.

 

I guess I just generally need tips for mid screen QV combos. 

 

Also sorry if this would have been better posted in the combo thread D:

[GodPress]

 

What is THE go-to combo vs. crouchers mid screen (I’m new to Venom and GG so full notation would be really appreciated >< )? I have the most trouble getting the ball hit after something like, say,  c.S(1) > SQV, 5p BH > IAD > j.SHSD > …. I don’t seem to have any issues with any QV stuff in the corner.

 

I guess I just generally need tips for mid screen QV combos. 

 

Also sorry if this would have been better posted in the combo thread D:

 

SQV>5P BH > IAD > j.SHD > 6H > Set as far as I know is character specific, there are others you can do: SnowMonkey listed this in the combo thread which is universal.

PQV >5P BH > 6H

Alternatively you can do this below for a bit more damage:

c.S(1) > SQV > 5P(BH) > 6P > 6H > Set works on:

Sol, Ky, May, Chipp, Slayer, I-no, Ram,Venom

[Kirnupiima]

Thanks for the alternative combo! I was wondering why I whiffed the IAD jS on I-No today.

 

Any tips for I-No and Millia matchups? I played both a little in +R but as Venom now it's really tough. How do you make the space to summon balls and protect yourself from HCL and hoverdash air throws while doing it?

[DaiAndOh]

So this is me mostly going off past experience since I haven't fought much of either (or really much of any character other than Zato and Sin and some Pot).

In matchups like these when characters are either really fast (Millia) or have a powerful neutral tool (Horiztonal Chemical Love) you're going to have to really be careful on when you summon, even more than usual.

Full screen should be safe on I-No to get 1 out, maybe 2, and if she doesn't approach with her note right away, you can absorb it via QV charge.

Aggressive Millia's you shouldn't bother much with raw summon. They will chase you down too fast.

You can of course, summon off knockdowns and connected pokes as well as "random summons" and QVs in your pressure.

Most of all though, you have YRC summon! This is getting used more and more in Venom matches and is a great way to ensure you not only get balls out, but can use them effectively!

[Kirnupiima]

Alternatively you can do this below for a bit more damage:

c.S(1) > SQV > 5P(BH) > 6P > 6H > Set works on:

Sol, Ky, May, Chipp, Slayer, I-no, Ram,Venom

I can't connect 6P to 6H for the life of me. Maybe doesn't work? It's supposed to be a gatling right?

[DaiAndOh]

Yeah, you'd need the 6P to hit, the ball to hit, then the 6HS in that order.

[GodPress]

I was doing a little testing with it:

c.S(1) > sqv> 5p(BH) > 6p > 6H > Set

from absolute point blank the 6H will whiff. You can omit that for just 5p>6h>set.

Shouldn't affect it from j.KS/SH combos though

[DaiAndOh]

6HS does indeed have a blind spot at point blank...