OrionXElite

Char. Specific Detail: Special Throw combo off of Back Throw(4BC): Back Throw: 4BC>RC>Rozen>9D>[W]j.A>j.236A>j.236B>C>j.B>j.B>Land>5B>JC>D>[H]j.B>dj.B>dj.C (3022 Damage, 23 Heat gained back)

Ok so I was in training and noticed something funny when I was trying these out some more. Turns out that the Back Throw>RC combos are actually character specific and then theres an even more specific way to pick it up with Tager. So when you Back Throw>RC, the ability to pick it up is based on whether or not you can make the opponent get stuck on Valk for a split second and slow them down. So after figuring that out, I went through and checked who it worked on and I got this: Ragna, Hakumen, Lambda, Mu, Tager Now you do the normal combo on everyone except Tager. Tager moves you with him so you can do the Tager specific. I'll add these side notes to each matchup thread as a Char. Specific Detail.

Yeah you can get some other funky tricks to happen too. If you Back throw>RC>Dash towards the thrown body, Valk will always backdash if you do it instantly and they graze his head for a second before flying over him, pick up is the same though so it doesn't matter. Best part is all those combos corner carry from corner to corner.

So the way it works is like this, I'll break it down step by step and hopefully it helps: 1) 236C connects, 9D cancels into Wolf and you approach the enemy. 2) Hit the j.B right about where the Wolf's Tail will hit them, meaning very high on the hitbox. 3) Wait for the j.B to recover then just before you hit the ground, hit the j.A. You'll be very close to the ground while the opponent will be above you a little bit. 4) Just land on the ground and hit the D Button and you'll go back into Human Form. 5) Back in Human Form, quickly hit the 2C and continue into 6C. When you hit the 2C, they should be right about Valk's Chest height. This is easiest way to break it down. Its not a very easy combo but if you just make sure you get each step right, you'll be fine. Steps 4 and 5 are gonna be a lot faster than 1-3 so if needed, just try and get used to hitting the D Button when you hit the ground before you move on to hitting the 2C. But practice this and you'll get it soon:keke:

If you can confirm its gonna be CH, you can get a bit more out of it: [W]CH236A>C>D>[H]2C>6B>2C>5C>JC>D>[W]j.AAA>j.236A>j.236B>7C>D>[H]j.B>j.214B>9D>D>j.B>dj.B>dj.C (3950 Damage, 49 Heat Gain) I was also toying around with his throws. Its possible to pick them up midscreen with a Rapid. I've got 3 Throw combos, 1 for back throw, 1 for forward throw, and a Tager specific Back throw combo. Front Throw: Throw>RC>D>5C>D>[H]2C>JC>j.B>j.214B>D>[W]j.236A>j.236B>C>j.B>j.B>Land>5B>JC>j.B Double Jump D Oki (3117 Damage, 21 Heat gained back) Back Throw: 4BC>RC>Rozen>9D>[W]j.A>j.236A>j.236B>C>j.B>j.B>Land>5B>JC>D>[H]j.B>dj.B>dj.C (3022 Damage, 23 Heat gained back) Tager Specific: 4BC>RC>2C>6B>2C>JC>D>[W]j.AAA>j.236A>j.236B>C>j.B>j.B>Land>5B>JC>j.AAA>JC>D>[H]j.C (3549 Damage, 28 Heat gained back) The Tager specific is what used to be the Bang/Arakune specific, RC the back throw and Tager gets thrown with Valk in front of him so you can just stand there and pick it up once he hits the ground :3

I'm gonna be sure to look into every matchup as soon as I can. I've already put a lengthy writeup of Valk vs Tao as a start and added a bit to the Valk vs Ragna threads. I'll hopefully have at least something useful to put into each thread by the time Revalations comes around. My goal is to have writeups to the caliber of my Tao writeup before EVO but that'll depend mainly on my ability to get adequate experience in those matchups to contribute. But I'll at least add basics of everything soon:keke: Oh and Nick, Congrats on Mod status :3

No as far as I can tell, the only viable option is to grab him if hes close enough as hes at about -2 When he dashes. But it still means hes at disadvantage so use that and try to stuff whatever he does next. I'd guess they'd try to go for a 5B to stuff you in which case you could try and use 6A if you're feeling godlike but I tend to opt out for 2B as it goes under his 5B and nets you a CH. Sadly though, you can't go CH2B>Rozen so if you have meter, you can opt out to do 2B>5C>Jager>RC>2C>etcetcetc follow up You just wanna out footsie Ragna. His defensive options are too strong to try and run a lot of Wolf mixup even if we can avoid it with 4/7C cause all he has to do wait and throw it late or just not throw it at all and back up. You'll wanna play just outside you max 5C range as that puts his 5C out of range as well. The hitbox on Ragna's 5C can actually rival that of Valk and Litchi so you do have to play a bit cautiously. But if you're just outside his 5C range you can hit him should he whiff. Also the reward for him hitting a max range 5C on CH is minimal without meter so the Risk of playing against it isn't too high. Valk gets CH5C>Rozen from any distance so Ragna is at a big disadvantage there. If he gets in on you, be sharp and pay attention to pressure, IB'ing Ragna's pressure is very easy so any time you can react to him throwing a 2D or Dead Spike, do so accordingly. If you have meter, you can IB>Sturm through his 2D and if you catch Dead Spike, IB>SJ>D>3C>[W]j.B to punish it. Its possible to do it without the 3C or the super jump but its a bit harder. I'd say this matchup is even. Both characters are very strong and have amazing normals. Its the battle of the footsies. EDIT: Turns out Ragna can get something for CH 5C if he does Dead Spike after but at max range thats pretty much all he can get without meter.

I can start this thread since I play a very strong tao player regularly here. This is a fairly even matchup. I'll list the normals/specials she can and can't crawl under: Char specific details: Can Crawl: 5A, 2A, 6A, 5B, 6B, 5C, 6C, [W]5B, Rozen, [W]j.A, [W]236B Cannot Crawl: 2B, 2C, 3C, [W]5A, [W]j.B, Jager, Jagd, Command Grab, [W]236A Strategy: So with that in mind, sadly, this matchup got worse for Valk. With Tao's pressure becoming ridiculously powerful and Valk's defence being quite lacking, its a very hard fight. Add onto that the fact that now Damage output is relatively the same for both characters means the risk/reward scales are skewed. Also probably the biggest annoyance is the fact that now, Tao can completely crawl under Valk's 5B which is not how it was in CS1. In CS1, Valk could hit Tao out of Crawl when she at about his knee length on the hitbox, now it completely whiffs and we lose one of our best footsie tools. Thankfully enough though, Tao still has major issues with Valk's outstanding normals. Whore out 5C like hell cause it will beat everything she can do on the ground. Both characters are incredibly offensive characters with very lacking defence which means you need to be more aggressive than the Tao player. Use Wolf form to dance around her and once you can get her stuck on the ground, pressure her till she gets hit. I honestly do NOT like Wolf mixup against Tao, with Dashes being slower and Tao being very nimble, options are very limited in most cases to the point where either she can jump away for free or Crawl for free. But you can use the Wolf mixup to bait her into jumping and nailing her with a command grab. Also I tend to not run a lot a high/low mixup on Taountil I have meter cause she can Crawl under 6C on reaction. I save my meter for when I can do instant overhead j.C combos as she cannot crawl that most of the time. Spacing is a bit weird for it but its the most viable option, I run lots of 2B>5B strings to scare her as 5B is jump cancellable. Stagger 5B>2B and trick her on the overhead. Punishes: You must keep in mind though that you will almost never punish Tao for anything because shes at disadvantage. All of her moves are safe so you will have to take a lot of risks and hit some buttons to get some momentum going. What you can punish though is her being to cautious or predictable. If you notice she is constantly doing 3 jumps around Valk in an attempt to avoid or bait an AA, chase her down. If you notice she likes to jump cancel something like 6A/5C and jump away, chase her down. Air grabs or IAD j.B>j.214B are very strong ways to do this. If you she is gonna whore out Crawl against you, run 2B>5B ALL the time then. 2B>5B with Valk is the best answer to Tao's neutral options as it picks up into a normal combo and it acts as a footsies tool to go with it. Not to mention I've used 2B as a low profile move before to get under some of Tao's jump ins. Anti-airing: When shes in the air, you do have to bit more careful as her j.C is insanely strong and will beat most attempts to hit her. I personally use 2 options against an airborne Tao: I look to trade a 2C with whatever she does cause Valk will always win the trade or I look for an obvious spot to 6A her. [W]5B can serve this purpose as well, but its a bit harder to work with given the transformation time necessary to do it. Zoning: This is more Footsies than anything. Tao's ground neutral game is ass compared to Valk's. NOTHING Tao has on the ground can deal with 5C so use it. CH leads into a nice 4k combo and provides corner carry. 5B can stuff a lot of her dash in moves so space yourself at just past your max 5B Range. Throw it out in an attempt to stuff her throwing something and throw 5C when you think they'll try a more aggressive plan. Their game plan: Tao is gonna wanna be in your face at all times. Valk is weakest on defence which is where Tao thrives so be weary of lots of stagger pressure, Drive Shenanigans and throw setups. Your best option on defence is going to be IB>Backdash as that will get you out of most of their mixup with ease. If shes dancing around like a pixie in the air, shes waiting for you to throw something out to try and CH you. Be patient when shes in the air. Remember she only gets 3 aerial actions in the air. That means 3 jumps, 1 Jump/2 air dashes, 1 jump/1 air dash/1 drive cancel etc. A/B/C DRIVE CANCELS USE UP JUMPS!! Thats vital to remember as you will always know when she vulnerable to rush in on. So for those of you who don't know, A Cancel makes her fall to the ground, B Cancel makes her pass through you and C Cancel is a Command Jump. Her forward and backward cancels do not take jumps. So count to 3 and if once you do, shes gonna do something. It may be attack, it may be in an attempt to run away but she is at that point forced to do something. My honest opinion of the matchup: 50-50 Even. Matchup is all about momentum and who can stay aggressive. Risk/Reward is still in Tao's favor but Valk still hits like a truck in comparison.

If I had to guess since its probably based on how high they are, you could try it on Makoto. She lifts higher than anyone else in the game when she gets hits.

How strict is the timing for this part? I was trying it out for a few minutes earlier and I couldn't get the j.A to come out and even when I could, I couldn't get Tager low enough to get hit by it. Might be a character specific thing but i only tried it for about 20 minutes.

Tager has more than a few even or close to even matchups now. Lambda, Platinum, Litchi, Jin, Tao, Valk, Makoto, Noel are even or close to even. 45/55 at absolute WORST. I'd honestly say Tager/Ragna is 55/45 since with good yomi and meter, Ragna can't do a damn thing without getting punished. CS2 promotes aggression to get the upper hand, so when you play passively, you lose to mixup you're letting them have. Don't let them reset pressure or do fancy little tricks on you, hit a damn button. Thats the first I learned about the Tao matchup, if you're aren't willing to hit a button, you will lose 100% of the time.

If rides to Revelations are becoming an issue, I could probably snag a car for the weekend to drive there and back so long as I can collaborate on a hotel room with someone. Rin this mainly applies to you as you have a TON of shit to move around and you've seen my Mom's car, it can hold all of it like nothing plus whatever 3 other people wanna bring. I'll talk to people over the next couple days and see if thats a good idea or not.

You have to be extremely careful of tick throws as her old DP is still throw invul from Frame 1 and to make things worse, its only -2 so you can't even punish it without meter and an IB. So keep pressuring her and call out backdashes accordingly.

Apparently great minds think alike since 3 of us posted practically the exact same combo Oh and Geno I wanted to say something about doing 3C>236B>RC>5C midscreen. I was playing around with it today and I noticed that while its a great confirm when you can hit it, the one big issue with it that a lot of the time you'll hit 3C and not be close enough for the 236B to link after. So I do like the idea of 236A being a midscreen guaranteed hit and keeping 236B in the back pocket as a situational confirm.

Double Post, sue me. Been working on some combos using Valk's new normals and tricks. Its really REALLY fucking nice having a lot of time to hit j.C>RC>j.C now so its something that must be learned. Heres the result of my findings: Near Corner(crouching only): [H]5B>5C>Rozen> 9D>[W]j.B>j.A>Land D>[H]2C>6C>2C>6B>2C>TK j.214B>2D>[W]236B>j.236B>5/7C>D>[H]j.B>dj.B>dj.C>Konig Flug DMG: 3942 without Super; 5062 with Super Heat Gain: 56 Utilizes Valk’s new ability to link into a [W]j.B after Rozen ANYWHERE on screen so this gets them to the corner in time for the 6C to wall bound from about half screen at the furthest. Works on everyone, the only part that is in need of tweaking based on characters is the j.B>dj.B>dj.C part at the end. On the thinner side of the cast(Hazama, Litchi, Carl etc.) the 2nd j.B will miss A LOT unless you hit the first REALLY high on its hitbox. I tend to just go 5CD>j.B>dj.C>Konig Flug as my ender on those characters to make it 10000x more reliable. You can also start this from a CH5B or 5C and it’ll work the same just now you can do it on standing opponents. Works anywhere, starts with instant overhead j.C(MUST be point blank when you hit the j.C): j.C>RC>j.C>Land>2C>6B>5B>5C>Rozen>9D>[W]j.A>j.236A>j.236B>5C>j.B>j.B>Land>5B>JC>j.B>3C>j.A>Land>5B>JC>j.B. DMG: 3978 Heat Gain: About 27 A simple instant overhead combo that leads into [W]j.B>double jump D oki. It’s a good option to have should you dash in on someone and bait a grab tech as the dash will always put you within the necessary distance to use this combo. If you think you’re spaced too far for both hits of 6B to connect, you can opt out to do Land>2C>5C>Rozen if they’re crouching or just Land>2C>Rozen if they’re standing. Midscreen 3C confirm: 5B>3C>236A>RC>2C>SJC>j.B>j.214B>5D>[W]j.236A>j.236B>5CD>[H]j.B>dj.C DMG:3103 Heat Gain: About 20 Easiest way to pick up a 3C midscreen 100% guaranteed. On some characters, you can't even walk>2B unless its a CH which makes it really hard to want to use it in mixup. BUT add this with the added threat of instant overhead j.C and Valk becomes very scary to deal with Human or wolf form. Theres a corner variant you can use should you be too far for anything else to hit as well. You can hit a 6C after the 236A>RC>2C and go from there.

In all honesty, I'd say avoid the 236B~236B wallbound for combo at all costs, the 50% secondary proration on the 2nd hit makes any decent follow ups impossible. But if that's all you can get, then I'd say save your wolf meter and just go for a basic combo afterwards. After the wallbounce, you can do 5B>2C>j.B>dj.B>dj.C. Assuming your best case scenarios, you can link 3C into 2C and get his full corner combo into a wolf combo and end it in super for about 5.2k. If you wanna know it, I'll put notation here: 5B>3C>2C>6C>2C>6B>2C>jump cancel D>[W]j.A(1)>j.236A>j.236B>7C>D>[H]j.214B>9D>D>j.B>j.B>j.C for about 4100 damage. End in air super and it's 5200 damage. This is assuming you're point blank which isn't often but when you confirm right, the damage is well worth it. Now for a more practical combo since you'll probably be not quote point blank a lot: 5B>3C>2B>5C>j.B>j.214B>9D>[W]j.A(1)>j.236A>j.236B>5C>D>[H]j.B>j.B>j.C gets you about 2950 damage. Not much more than with 236B~236B filler, but the proration is much easier to work with and the spacing doesn't get weird either.

His 2C still has an amazing hitbox so you can still throw it with the intent to trade or stuff something early. Just no head invul makes it harder to use. Its still his best starter too so when you hit it, it still hurts like a fucking train :3

If you block 3C, 360B is a clean punish oven you're close enough. 720 is also A free punish on normal block. It's -6 so on IB, you have the option of 5A/2A if you're too far but best option is to wait for a chance to 360/720 them. Also 6A can be useful if you think they'll try and punish you with a 360 as you can still special cancel it to 360B and get a throw counter.

Coopa, I have to thank you for setting this up. I know you issues at the beginning of the day but shout outs to you for toughing it out and making the hype ass stream. Looking very forward to coming up to Davis in the near future with the Wheres Dacid? Crew :3 Congrats to David for winning and having to WORK for it. Edward/Steve/WhiteBread/Willy...Good shit :3 Team Yellow Fever for life! Everyone else, its always great to see the scene make it out and have fun.

You have to cancel into the 720 within the first 10 frames of XYH. Basically you'll do 360D>360C to make it work. Once I'm warmed up, I get the motions down to the point where I'm plinking D~C basically. Visually, you have to hit C and have the 720(540) motion completed before he puts his hands together. Thats the ONLY time you can cancel out of XYH.

If you have a godlike confirm and you're pointblank and have Spark Bolt you can break 3k: 6B>2C>AC>Spark Bolt>j.2C>2B>2C>AC>BGadget does 3.1k...Other than that I do some weirdo confirm combo since it actually uses a Fatal only link: 6BFC>6C>ASledge>5C>6A>AC>BGadget does 2.5k. I fucking hate his 6B now... But 5C>6A standing is fucking amazing now. Makes 5A on Gadget oki kinda dangerous now since you actually get some decent damage off of it on CH. But it really sucks they changed the P1 of his 2C to 90. Makes most Fatal combos not work anymore. Mine sure as hell doesn't. Instead of 2CFC>AC>ACWhiff>6C>j.2C>2B>ASledge>5C>6A>2C>AC>BGadget I have to do this: 2CFC>AC>ACWhiff>6C>j.2C>2B>ASledge>2B>2C>AC>BGadget for about 3800 DMG and 50/51 Meter. OH and 6C>2D in the corner on Fatal is fucking hot. But its really retarded if they're magnetized, sometimes the pull will make them fly the wrong way out of the corner:v:

Apparently when they were making CS2 Mission Mode for Tager, they thought it would be a good idea to either give the Bang dummy unlimited Magnetism, or no magnetism at all depending on the combo...One fatal problem though, this little factor makes Mission 9 literally IMPOSSIBLE to complete because Tager's Drives yield no Magnetism on the Dummy and it requires a Collider Whiff after 2D>RC The Sample Dummy can't even do it so it just bugs out and starts whiffing shit. Looks funny as hell though :3

They increased the untech definitely. It was their way of making it a bit easier to combo after it cause as it stands now, AA Rozen is useless against anyone other than Tager which is dumb cause its a GREAT Anti Air if you're in a footsie fight against Ragna or Litchi. While they toned his damage down all around, they made his damage much more consistent to obtain off of most hits. Now max range 5B>5C>Rozen on crouching is actually problem for the whole cast rather than those with big hitboxes.

I know what it is, so the way the Dash works is you can cancel out of the Dash startup by hitting C and its does the Command "Brake." So in the video, Masashi utilized that for hit confirming purposes by doing the first j.A then canceling it into the Dash then immediately canceling the Dash with C and then doing another j.A. So I did it in Training Mode(Works in CS1 too) and the inputs are as such: C(before the j.A)>j.A>C(Start the Dash)>C(Cancel the Dash)>j.A>5B>etc. Shortened version would be: C-Dash>j.A>C>C>j.A Its a bit tricky but I've already thought up some dirty tricks to use it with. One big issue is that it isn't as useful in CS1 since the Dash takes way more Wolf Meter than CS2. One important thing to note about this is that it can ONLY work off of the 5C Dash as the rest of them have committed startups. I'm going to a casuals session on Friday, if any of my matches get recorded I'll see if I can work this in and show some of the ideas I came up with for it. Hope this helped clear things up:keke:

My guess is that its not the most reliable anti-roll option as Valk's 2A can't be mashed as fast as say, Ragna's 2A. But thats a minor downside at worst. Other issue I've noticed is if they roll and you tag them with 2A and go to 2C, sometime's they'll be on the wrong side of Valk when you jump which would mean unless you butcher the combo, they'll be out of the corner. Not to mention that in some cases, Valk is facing the wrong way when you jump cancel 2C and that makes the pick up weird but the easy remedy to that is to always confirm 2A>2C>5C jump cancel etc since the 5C would correct Valk's direction.