Eclipse

Well, I don't especially support the idea of arguing over something that technically may not exist in the long-run. But I see nothing wrong with speculation. Theory-fighting sounds kind of stupid. But people can hope/dream or just speculate. Since it's something to do, and helps us understand the different directions and possibilities they could go in with the final result.

I'd be all for them taking out many of his options, and replacing them with new ones that are just as stable. Like 3C > 214D~B > 4D~A > 4D~D > j.214B# Or making 236D comboable. As long as they balance him out in the end, and he can actually combo, it'll be fine. I'd be all for new combos and mixup since I love learning new things. I guess it's just a matter of how much faith we have in the company. And if we believe they really know what they're doing.

Uh oh, Hazama's dead. I hope they don't keep these changes... Getting rid of every BnB he has for good.

Wow, I never thought they'd take out something so important. I'm glad it's just a loketest, but if this sticks. We're more or less screwed. The only thing I can think of to balance it out, would be allowing 5B > 3C > 214D~B > 4D~D > j.214B#. Or something of that sort. He'd still be worse, but we should at least be able to follow up 214D~B without a CH or he has no BnB. Othewise, we'll have to start going for mixup and comboing directly from 214D~C. 3C will have no use though... Having the chains not replenish on block will also make it much more difficult to play Hazama, but still possible. I'll just cross my fingers and hope they don't keep this change.

I'd say Mizuchi Rekkazan is only practical if you're killing them with it and winning the round. Wasting 50 heat instead of gaining 30-40 and knockdown is simply a bad idea. But hey, flashiness is awesome. So if you can manage to win everytime doing it, go ahead.

I'm pretty sure he meant j.9D~A. But yeah, we've known that for a while now. Works on Litchi and Jin.

Thanks for the find, I'll edit this out within a few days. And I put adjust there just in case Hazama isn't at the right angle at the given time.

It's easier to execute the 2A > 2B > 3C one, but I believe the 2A > 5B > 3C does slightly more damage. The pushback may be greater though, making it necessary to dash ater 214D~C.

You want to input the dash at the last possible moment. And if you're getting 6C, try to Dash then let go of the D-Pad/Stick, and press C. What you want to be doing is: 66 > 5C not 66C. You can try inputting the first 6 during the ending of Hazama's 214D~C. If done at the last possible moment, it should work correctly.

Well, haha. That combos is extremely situational and difficult to pull off so I wouldn't worry about it too much. But if you really want to know. I believe you high jump then time your last C hit to hit Tager as he's falling to the ground. It's usually (Always) better to go with the reliable 100% heat combos if you're interested in high damage.

Thanks for stating this Zidane. People don't understand that Hazama hitting with a FC really makes almost no difference at all. It just has that "epic effect" and is known as a godly Fatal Counter, simply because it does Fatal Counter. In other words. Being a FC has nothing to do with it being so godly. The main thing that makes it great, in my opinion at least, would be the speed, invulnerable frames, and simply... the fact that it's such a good reversal that you can get massive damage off. If we're talking about what FCs are used the most, or which move is great in general, yeah, then it's wonderful. But it's amusing since it's power has nothing to do with the fact that it's a FC. (And wouldn't the "best FC" have to be because of what FC does, haha.) I'm done, but I agree with Zidane here.

I haven't used 5B > 2C much in netplay, so I wouldn't know. But I would assume it'd be easier. I'm getting the timing down for two chains in netplay much better now though. And to be honest, the whole three chain thing is kind of dead. No one uses that I guess. Not professionals, no one. Even though it is possible, the j.C's and risk involved aren't worth it. Not to mention that after the patch, the slower speed of ouroboros will probably make it impossible.

Fatal By Nature. I'm pretty certain that 5C in the combo does more damage as you can still follow it up with 4D~A > 4D~D. Also, maybe you're forgetting that you can hit with both parts of 5C yielding more damage. And maybe you haven't faced many good Hazama's, haha. Since most good players will go for that combo if they want to maximize damage. My only guess is that people are doing this: 5B > 3C > 214D~C > (Dash) 5C > JC [j.C x 5] > 2C > 4D~D > j.214B# Since it builds more heat. And it's easier to do in lag, since the netcode seems to be horrible right now. Lastly, and I'm with Zidane on this one. Most Hazama players just have no idea what they're doing, and don't do the full BnB's, etc.

I usually go for the j.214B at the end anyways. And surprisingly enough to my opponent, myself, and all lifeforms in the universe, it hits. Sometimes it hits even when you're facing the wrong direction anyways. You can always try to reset them into 4D~A's as well. And it's not for no reason. It happens to me sometimes too. It's because we accidentally positioned ourselves wrong for the subsequent j.C's.

Just try adjusting the height ghost beef. That's my best tip. Get a feel for distance between you and your opponent. Sounds weird, but it's crucial with Hazama. And thanks for the info about the 5C launch Zidane. I knew it worked on everyone but Mu-12, so thanks for the find. If I'm not mistaken, you're one of the best Hazama's on PSN. If not the very best in PSR at least. Any advice I could use to improve my Hazama. I know you haven't seen him or anything. Just general tips would be nice, message me if you want. And I believe 214D~B only combos on CH or FC. I've never got it to work otherwise, not even mid-combo. Since Hazama takes so long to recover.

Ghost Beef, Jakou to j.6D is nigh impossible on most characters. As for the combo with your back to the wall. It's easy to pick them up again if you mash 2B or 5C. If that doesn't work, you may need to hit them with Jakou at a greater height. Try this combo on Ragna and get back to me on your results. Neutral Throw > [6D~A x 2] > 623D > 2B > 5C > 2C > 4D~D > j.214B# It should work out quite easily since they'll be more than high enough after Jakou (Hungry Coils). Try this first, then experiment with different combos, and change the amount of 4D~A's or 6D~A's you do beforehand. You can also delay Jakou instead of retracting the chain. Sometimes that helps.

^ It seems like it'd work on them, but are their hitboxes big enough to allow the dash 5C to connect?

If it gatlings, combos should be just as easy, right? The only difference this would really make is with hit-confirming then? And Hit-stun, etc. This is only the first loketest anyways. I'd even be okay with them nerfing Hazama more since these changes are so slight.

^ So will we always have to followup 5B with 3C immediately now for the combo? I'm guessing because of the decreased level, you could no longer use 5B > 214D~A/C. No more serpent's benediction from that will change things a bit.

I don't know Spinzaku. Ragna's looking a little desolate, haha. No wallbounce on ID just seems awful to me. I guess it still does a little bit in the corner. I just hate the characters who can get ~5K without a specific setup. And I thought Litchi was one of them. She may need the corner, but it's easy to carry people over there. Honestly, I'm not a Litchi main or sub, so I wouldn't know. Anyways, I just read 3C causes float now. Good or bad? Not 100% sure on that term. Would that work like 214D~C? Sounds kind of sketchy, but I'll post the link anyways: http://www.dustloop.com/forums/showthread.php?9792-BBCS-News-only.-Anything-else-TEMPBAN.-Valkenhayn-DLC!-BBCS-2-for-arcades!&p=752791#post752791 (third post from the bottom)

If they take that away Black Onslaught, Hazama will end up really terrible. Or much harder to play. I think things looks pretty good as they are now. With the nerfs to other characters, I have a feeling Hazama could raise to S tier. In my opinion, all they'd really need to do was make the damage a bit less off of Jayoku, etc. But they certainly shouldn't get rid of his Jayoku followups or corner combos, since that would destroy all his high damage options.

Waiting a bit will make it even easier to connect the 2B afterwards. If you're working on the corner combo when Hazama is in the corner, it's very easy to 2B > 5C > 2C them back up after 623D. In other words, the timing isn't strict, you could even mash 2B and get it to work. Just make sure they're high enough when you use 623D. And make sure the proration isn't low enough that you can't continue the combo.

Yeah, even though they say the changes aren't terribly noticeable. We don't know if this is coming from Hazama mains or not. I'm sure any decent Hazama player would notice more subtle things about the character. As anyone maining a character in a game would. And all the Jabaki talk is mainly for fun. I'd enjoy being able to combo more off of it. And a 3K CH Jabaki combo mid-screen? RC'ing it doesn't really make it stable as is. I don't think it would be too overpowered with more combo ability. Since good players will be more careful about you scoring a CH.

Wondered what some of the better Hazama players here would think of the current changes. The list is so small now, but I think it's worth mentioning. Less hit stun for 5B shouldn't change his BnB's at all. I thought that at first, and was extremely afraid, but it'll just make an immediate followup preferable. It'll be a little harder to use 5B during his short blockstrings now, but it's hit stun wasn't that great to begin with. So depending on how much they reduced it, it'll probably be fine. I have a feeling that 5B > 214D~A/C will be taken out completely though. Since I think they're implying it doesn't gatling anymore, at least not into 3C, but we'll see. The chains won't make a difference since everyone says they're not noticeable. But maybe less 6D~A's in combos, which doesn't really bother me, or 4D~A's. What I'm hoping most from these changes is that he gets a new combo or two. I just want jabaki to be comboable without CH. Or even with CH, besides the few options it has.

With 5A? I honestly don't think so. I was thinking if you're near the corner, you could go for the 623D variation, but the proration might even be low enough to drop the combo. I think it'd work out though. If they're low enough, you may be able to do... 5A > 5C > j.C x 5 > 2C > 4D~D > j.214B# Anyone have any recommendation of the best AA for Hazama. I rely on 214D~B a bit too much, and 5A works wonders against other Hazama's, but when Ragna's use j.C, I always tend to get hit out of it. I think the range of my opponent's air attacks is my primary problem. In situation where my opponent has raged air attacks, is it best to use 2C?