Lord Knight

Whistler shared the vs Noel matchup on twitter - ノエル戦。開幕は安定がバックジャンプ、前ジャンプはノエルの開幕5C見てからJC確定なので相手の様子見て切り替え。立ち回りの基本は飛びながらヒットアンドアウェイ。ノエルの6Aと空投げに気をつける。まず地上で捕まえないと勝てないと分かってるノエルは、逃げの着地に6A起点に触ってくる なので、着地をわかりにくくするために、手を出したり相手の裏に回ったり、空中バックダッシュしたりと、安易に下を取れないようにする。 触られてチェーンリボルバーをガードしてしまった時は基本立ちガードから6D見てからしゃがみの方がガードしやすい。Aオプの隙消しガード後はこちら有利なので5B暴れ安定。離れてなきゃ2Dも潰せる。もし5Bを2Dで抜けられてしまっても5Bをレバー後ろに入れて打てば勝手にガードしてくれる。 そんで、2Dガードしたあとは5B暴れがわりと安定。向こうはぶっぱスプリングレイドで勝てるけど、それ以外は5Bで勝ち。とりあえずこれ見せとけば無理やりゲージ使う以外は対応できる ノエルに起き攻めされる時の対応。相手の選択肢が5Aばかりなら、たまには3Cぶっ放してビビらせる。 2Bや2A、端でのバクステ狩り兼ねた6C、投げや6Cディレイ投げなどは自分にゲージあるなら、バレるまでは1ABC＞ディレイ6ABで割と安定して返せる。これで最速投げを投げ抜けしつつ、バクステ狩りや当て投げにはカウンターアサルトが出て、遅らせ投げや遅らせ下段には6Bで回避しやすい。 暴れD連携に何が勝てるか。6Aは2Dを安定して潰し、4Dも潰せるが、噛み合うと4Dに負ける場合も。6Cは2D4Dを潰せるけど、ガト読まれると5Dに負ける。2Dに5Bは不利Fじゃなきゃ勝てる…はず(これはマトイさん調べ)。 ノエル戦の話題だったんで色々書いたけど、とりあえずこんくらいで… 抜けてること多分あるけど、ツイッターだしメモ書き程度ってことでｗ 立ち回りガン有利だけど、一発火力と起き攻めでやられかねないこと考えて、総合的には五分〜微有利かな。不利はないね。

no damage is also way lower, 6B is like 94p2 while 6D is only 80.

I think the Tech system is fine in BB. My main complaint with it (special cancellable rolls) was fixed a long time ago. Really, pretty much every character, with the right knockdown/combo ender, can create some sort of situation where the opponent can't use a disrespectful tech option. Obviously, you can't get it off all hits (we saw this last game in a certain S tier character), but it makes sense. To me, people who try to not tech/delay tech/delay roll are just handing you free meter and extra damage (if you know how to handle the situation). For example, way too many people I've played against tech late against Hazama midscreen, and just hand me a free 5C > 2C > Jakou >etc that I wouldn't have gotten if they emergency teched. I'm fine with it, but it hurts the midlevel a little bit, in my opinion. I think people should be rewarded for hitting the other person. Wanting oki is justified. It's not our job to think like game designers, As far as "strong players in America", there are plenty of them, by our standards. As far as "strong players in America", compared to average Japanese players. . . I wouldn't know! I don't live in Japan. But I can say that average is average anywhere. As far as "strong players in America" by my standards, there are very few players who are strong. Compared to Japan's top, only our very best stand a chance, and we would still lose. There aren't many characters who specialize in oki. If anything, it's just Litchi and Rachel. New players probably wouldn't even see what they could do unless they go to tournies or have someone close who's good. . . they are too busy doing UNDER HEAVEN DESTRUCTION (nothing wrong with this). Arakune curse oki is indeed very strong. . . however in CS1 it wasn't even necessary, considering all he needed to do was invisible mixup off blocked bugs to win. In CS2 he does less damage, a couple of less ways of doing 1 combo > curse, and you'll still mostly see invisible mixup off blocked bugs. Arakune doesn't often have time to go into setups like that, while Litchi can/will go into Daisharin as often as possible. I'm biased, I like Tager being bad because I don't like grapplers. His bad matchups are Haz, Carl, and Arakune. Haz and Arakune are probably the worst, Carl is bad but not as bad as before. Makoto can be annoying for him if they know what they are doing, but she doesn't really have safe okizeme against him like Litchi does, so it's all right. Mu seems bad but Axis seems to think otherwise. If Gadget Finger was better or if he had some better midscreen follow up, he'd be better. Tager is big and slow, and this is an anime game where everyone has a cool special power. He's going to have bad matchups no matter what. That girl Lambda that qualified for SBO, probably. Platinum's 5A is+1, and her 2A's are limited to only 3 hits (2AAA). 6B (the overhead) is safest at max range. . . it's best to watch how they pressure and adapt accordingly. If they just try to frame trap you all day, a good combination of barrier/dp or barrier/jump or backdash will be fine. Just make sure you're prepared for 6B.

youre probably thinking of some derivative of 6b[m] ch midscreen > 5b > 2c >delay 6d(1) > haku > chun > dash 5b it works on everyone. on tager, you can just do it, no matter what. on plat you can do point blank 2a or 5b > 2c > delay 5c(1) > 6d(1) > haku > chun etc kokushi oki is all right but there are answers to it. .. if you do want to do it after a combo, its best if you end your combo far away from them like blah blah > 6c(1) > 4kote > dash jBCB > j7BC > land kokushi

actually off high mixup kokushi does rather low damage off 3c or haku (preferably 3c) you get around 5000 you can always choose to use kokushi to blow up mashing or counter assault with max range 2b > kokushi or 5c > kokushi (doesnt have to be max range) off raw kokushi you can probably do kokushi > 5b > 6b > itsuuA > haku > hatsu > riichiA > ippatsu > drop airdash back jB > land > hatsu > riichiA > j2B > hatsu > haku > chun > 5b > 6c(1) > 4kote > blah blah blah

6C[m] > iad gold burst > 6B[m] > gold burst > 4D > hatsu > riichiA > ippatsu > tanki hatsu > haku > hatsu > riichiA > j2B > air hatsu > land > haku > chun > 5b > jBCB > 6c(1) > 4kote > jBCB > dj jBCD > falling jC > 6C > Daisharin (whatever you want) > jHatsu > last hit of daisharin > kokushi

doritos is mame

5C and 6C are completely different moves (compared to 5B, 2B, 2C, 6B simply having more range/a bit more start up). Staffless Litchi carries to the corner easier, but does less total damage. Her damage off random hits is higher than when she's holding the stick. She lacks a real reversal (has a ghetto one in Hatsu). Her pressure is much stronger and more varied. She essentially has a fullscreen projectile (launch) to compensate for her shorter range. When she has the staff, she can zone with normals, or put down the stick at will, making her able to control the pace of a lot of matches. Her random damage is overall low unless you're near the corner or confirm certain hits. She also has amazing corner carry ability, as long as you can confirm well. Her damage output can be somewhat high. She has Tsubame to keep people from getting wild on her. Generally, both modes can run rushdown or zoning/spacing type games. The "differences" between them don't matter - she is one character, and flowing in between the two modes easily is what matters the most. You should try playing the game.

both those videos are ct. . . .

6d > 5a works on crouching hakumen/tager

Thread reopened. Stuff will be added throughout the weekend.

I'm not casting judgement on characters based on lack of knowledge. Hakumen's damage is incosistent, to say the least. Hotaru is too weak and he doesn't get huge damage off counters. The risk/reward for it is just fucked now most of the time. And for future reference, execution doesn't matter unless it's Bulleta sako infinite level or something.

Netplay is great for a ton of reasons. 1) You can play people outside of your scene. People tend to have similar playstyles/habits within their respective scenes. Even if they use a character that you play against all the time, you can work on adapting to how other players use the same options. 2) No planning is needed to play. Just get on and hit network and you're good. Gatherings can need anywhere from 0 to a ton of planning depending on how far people have to travel, people's schedules, etc, 3) You can play against characters that people in your scene don't play against. It's an undeniable fact that there are popular and unpopular characters. You can eventually find someone decent who plays an unpopular character to practice against. Some practice >>>>>>>>>> none at all. 4) If you don't have a scene, you can actually play the game. Some scenes are healthy and play against each other [multiple times] weekly. Others don't get to play each other irl a lot (myself included) - netplay is invaluable if you're in that situation. 5) You can play against a large variety of styles. There are people who just hold up back, people who just mash dp, people who play really safe. . . playing online gives you access to a big pool of a variety of players and teaches you how to adapt quickly. 6) It's a good testing ground for new stuff, especially if there is no one around when you want to try stuff. Problems 1) Connection issues, but these can be mitigated by playing people in your region. 2) If you're playing with the intent of improving, netplay can be a difficult. Because it's a low risk environment (outside of ranked, where losing means losing PSR), people may have a lax playstyle, which is counterproductive for improvement. 3) Netplayrs tend to play with their online friends, so similar problems to irl scenes can arise. This can be avoided by just playing anyone (with a good connection, of course). When used right, netplay is definitely worth it. If you're trying to become really skilled, a good balance of offline play, netplay and tourney play should get the job done. As far as your last question, there are a couple of ways (I've done all of these, on netplay). First, push yourself to do the best things you know your character can do (this is limited by how much potential your character has). You can always start finding ways to deal with tactics you might not have been exposed to as well. Watch videos and practicing combos. Even though you can't play someone offline, that doesn't stop you from playing online, and as long as you try to play well and the connection is good, it isn't too far away from getting matches irl

He's not the same level as Tager but he is weaker than CS1 because: 1) Lower overall damage 2) Doesn't carry to the corner well 3) Easily zoned 4) Less damage off D 5) j.D is dead I don't think there's anything wrong with that as long as it is full with useful information. She needs it. lol. S: Makoto Hazama Noel Jin Litchi - Litchi A: Valk Rachel Carl Tao Mu Tsubaki A-: Arakune Lambda Plat Ragna Hakumen Bang B+ - Tager Short explanation Makoto is too good. More or less an easy CS1 Litchi. Neutral game is lacking in some matchups but she makes up for it with runback power and pure damage. Mixup is simple and effective. Hazama - Damage is way too high. Zoning is good, mobility is good, pressure is legit. Runback factor is even higher than Makoto. Only lacking in consistent damage with less than 50 meter. Noel - Random factor is high, damage is high everywhere and is rewarded for taking silly risks. Neutral game is better now that some normals are fixed. Thanks to D, she's never down until her health is 0. Jin - Solid all around. Gains meter quickly and is able to use it. Higher damage, easy confirms, good pressure thanks to new gatlings. -- Litchi - Still dominates neutral, still has high damage. Daisharin mixup is practically unseeable now and mostly does more damage than CS1. She doesn't get crazy off all hits like the top guys, but can get it in off mixup stuff/counter hits, keeping her from being tops. Meter gain is still high. 4D is ridiculous. There can always be more stuff discovered with her, so you never know what will happen with her strength. --- Valk - Good damage, great mobility. Strong pressure. Does better against zoners this time. His damage off his mixup is still high (not stupid though) and he is still hard to approach, so he's here. Rachel - J.A instant overhead, damage off baden baden lily. . .damage off everything. Fixed. Carl - Training mode. Tao - Same as CS1 but less damage off random hits (like 500-1000 less on average). J.D is weaker too so she can't 1 hit > time out certain characters anymore. Still really strong. Mu - Annoying strong neutral, buff overhead. 236A/j236A are really good. Outright wins or loses matchups. Tsubaki - Annoying. Fast charge, good corner carry. Safer pressure and easier access to unblockable is good. Really good at controlling ground and the area right above her, so anyone that can move in and out or put something there easily won't have too much problems. --- Arakune - mixup is still good but can't be as abare as CS1. Sometimes needs 2 curses to win. Slower jump is more of a weakness than faster dashes being a strength. Overall still strong, still S once he curses you. Zoners body him. Lambda - strong mixup, more consistent damage. Max damage potential is high but you need to confirm well and the situation won't arise often if they play safe. Plat - Actually a really strong character, but not always having the tool you want all the time keeps her from being higher. Ragna - Strong, but not having the consistent high meter gain of CS1 Ragna hurts a lot. Meter has to be used much wiser than before, making being wild more risky, which is bad for him. Solid Ragna still works. Hakumen - jD is dead. Bang - Really high potential in the corner, but you have to be all the way in the corner. Corner carry is poor unless they are standing. Of course it's still Bang, so his runback factor is still crazy high. Pressure is better than before. FRKZ is needed much more now. --- Tager - Big slow grappler, still gets zoned, still gets hit by instant overheads and Tager only combos. ---- I feel like anyone can consistently win in this version except for Tager. Look at the past 2 NSB's, they've been won by a Ragna/Hakumen/Bang team, with the Bang making miracles in grand finals. Despite it not being in a best of three format, all the characters can work now. Most of my Daisharin setups are character specific. 138xxx is still the one I use the most and still the most variable. OS hatsu stuff is dead but it's still good vs new players. 133xxx is technically a better setup because you get more mixup opportunities, but it is harder to confirm against a variety of situations (when compared with 138 setup). Also timing for unseeables is a little bit easier with 138. 138339 - Revised Daisharin 138333. Used because Chun now has 74 p2 so it kills your combo really quickly. Damage off mixup ranges from 4.5k - 5000. Still the most variable Daisharin setup. Still useful against Jin/Hakumen to make them whiff Yukikaze. 133xxx - Still exists, used for fuzzy. 613xxx - Tager Daisharin. Jump straight falling jC to beat sledge. Cancel jC into barrier in case he does MTW. After a blocked jC, go into rising jC or 3c > haku > hatsu > last hit Daisharin > combo. 139339 - Ragna Daisharin setup when he has 50 meter. Easier to combo him if he goes for C ID > RC. Litchi 5D launch is 9f startup and cancellable from the 12th frame. 2D launch is 10f but cancellable from the 14th frame. Both launch 2f after the button is released. So, you can think of it being her fastest move once the stick is shaking. Also, Litchi's staffless normals are all cancellable into 2D, but only standingn normals (5A, 5B, 6B, 5C) are cancellable into 5D. Needless to say, staffless pressure that uses 5D are both faster and safer than pressure that uses 2D. Last one should be obvious. . . but getting hit by Litchi 6B[m] in the corner, either raw air hit (wallbounds) or counter hit (wallbounces) is huge damage. Essentially, when making a decision to burst against Litchi, it's best if you know what combo will follow (ie looking at her meter, position on the screen, etc). Of course, this applies to all characters in the game. I'm going to assume that pretty much no one wants to get taken into the corner, so I'll make a list of everything she can do that can carry to the corner from midscreen. --- Point blank 2A[m] Point blank 5B[m] Point blank 5C[m] Point blank 3C[m] Jump in jB[m] Most staffless hits 4D Back throw Forward throw (from round start position, gains 50 meter) 2C[m] counter hit Staff launch anti air counter hit ItsuuA ItsuuB Airthrow 3C[m] counterhit Most [m] normals with 50 meter Crossup j2D Counterhit j2D Counter hit 6B[m] Raw 6c Still useful against people who don't option select throw tech. Also you can get a spacing where you can get both hits to hit even though you crossup, which helps against people who just jump. The first hit of j2D is indeed a mid. Evaluate the situation properly. Do you have meter to RC your reversal? How does/how has your opponent been baiting your reversal. Do you know of any option selects that they might have been using on you? Are they making your reversal whiff so you can't RC it? Do they crossup your inputs? Have they been confidently doing meaties to you? How much life do they/you have left? How much damage would you take for punishing it? How much damage would they take if you hit them? All these factors and more are important when judging whether to reversal or not. Generally, when looking at a glance and seeing that most of these aren't in your favour, you should avoid doing a reversal, but it's ok to be a little random once in a while. This includes both sides of the coin - not doing Ragna's ID when you have 50 meter (if they start baiting a lot) will give you a free escape and then you'll still have your meter. At the same time, randomly doing Ragna's ID when you don't have 50 meter keeps them from getting too aggressive on you and establishes you are willing to counterattack when needed. In the end, all I can say is that it's a judgement call. I play Litchi so Rachel has never been too much of a problem for me (once I learned how to play against her). She's a little bit irritating to fight because most of the Rachel's I've played against are wild. Litchi is shorter on crouch than most characters so I have to do a little less guesswork than most people, but her mixup is still intimidating. Pressure/mixup are Rachel's best hope against Litchi, because Litchi can play so well against her in neutral. US Rachels on average - Mash 2C too much Weak neutral Mediocre/poor wind management Poor defense Mediocre/poor use of pumpkin Rachel's mixup is hella solid again, for sure. Most characters have to just deal with it too rather than try to diceroll their way out. No idea.. It might just be that you're too close for it to connect.

Nothing. . . . is what I want to say, lol. Litchi's 4D is safer the farther away its used. I believe it's -4 at the closest possible range. From max range, probably around +5 or so.

Just do whatever against Litchi. Just like in CS1, Litchi has to play the matchup properly in order to beat Hazama. Stick to your gameplan and just play safe. Usually I just get annoyed against Hazama's because they just try to [7] me all day, but outside of that I don't get annoyed. As usual, just use chains/5A/2C/Gasshokyaku for anti airs. Litchi's guard point got buffed so you'll see more of it. Don't chain in too liberally. Like sG said, Litchi is very freeform, and it takes a lot of understanding in order to pressure with her effectively. However I can give you a couple of tips. 2a > 2c is anti mash and anti jump. On counter hit, confirm into itsuu. On raw hit, confirm into 6d. On block, 6d is still fine but 5c or 5d are fine too. 2a > 2b also can't be mashed. You can delay 6d to again stop mashing, or you can go into 4D for a high hit or put the stick down. Those are some of the most important things with the stick. When you're staffless you need to be a bit more freeform. Just remember that she can move very freely through her gatlings now (5c > 2c and 2c > 5c, 5b > 2b and 2b > 5b, 5b >2a > 5b etc).

The fact that it might take 2 times, combined with shorter cloud times, weaker jump, arguably weaker dash (depends on what you feel is more important, the speed or the distance traveled), you can say he's weaker. Also most of that stuff doesn't happen all the time. . . he still has stuff like random airthrow/gold burst/etc into curse and all, and the new gatlings are very helpful, but I think the inconsistent damage really hurts him. In the case of whoever wrote up that tier list, they think it hurts him THAT much, which I somewhat disagree with.

The Jin players are probably scared of getting hit by a 360 or 720. Plat isn't "bad". The problem with her is that sometimes she needs a specific item for a matchup or a situation. As items are random, you won't always have what you need at the right moment. Not having access to tools whenever you want = not good. However, Plat's mixup is great, and her damage output is high. I feel like she's very versatile.

She's easy and annoying, and you don't have to put much effort. For the most part, people will have to adjust to your playstyle rather than the other way around. I don't really understand what you mean. How does the defense system relate to "being defensive"? I feel like the defensive mechanics in CS2 are fine as they are. Push yourself. You definitely have the knowledge, you just need to try the stuff that you've learned. Of course you'll run into people who are just weak and the advanced tactics won't be necessary. That's why I also think it's best to play anyone, no matter what their skill level is. Strive to always improve, learn more and update your character's playstyle. To be honest, I don't consider the stuff I do to be "mindgames". Makes me feel like Arakune is an even shittier character than I thought. Basically, whoever wrote that tier list must think that an Arakune that can't win off one curse is not good. I agree with this, since his damage output outside of curse is more or less non-existant. Also, I feel like Arakune's matchups are very win/lose, and he doesn't have many even matches. Despite his "weakness", there are still very strong Arakune players out there, and he still operates under the "I just have to make you block D" mantra (hitting them with D is a bonus). The bad part is that he might have to repeat the process 2 times in one round, which is too much against 1 hit > death Hazama or Makoto. The weaker zoners are also much stronger this game, giving him way more problems.

playing console? or you have the arcade version?

No idea. You just need to force yourself. Actively think about what you're doing. If you really care about winning/doing better/improving, you'll stop doing stuff that gets you hit. Try using OS throw tech (1A+B+C). If they actively try to throw reject by using 2A > purple throw or something, don't hit it and tech the purple throw. Make sure to only tap OS tech only once. It sounds like you don't want to put much effort, so just play Noel. I think by design, Rachel will always struggle with Litchi. Actually, I found the CS1 matchup the hardest out of the three versions, despite CS1 Litchi being the strongest, because Litchi only had itsuucan after 3C, which let Rachel do mostly whatever she want from fullscreen. CS2 Litchi does really well with 3C > 5D but lacking itsuucan hurts a bit. It's been a couple of months since we played so I can't really reply accurately lol.

will there be a tournament? ill play a lot

www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmY1h2ByUJw#t=1m30s www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ggja0jCQ-o#t=18m40s come on you know you tried it at least once fiiiiiiiiiiine since apparently people dont just infinite people to death with bulleta ill post real stuff/comment on the above stuff, ill clean it up and make it nice looking later as far as combos are concerned, she has normal chains like everyone else so i wont cover that --- cr.lk cr.lk > medium/heavy/EX misslle - auto confirm after high/low mixup jMP > jHP > whatever - auto confirm jump in cr.lp > cr. lp > cr.mp > basket - solid knockdown, pursuit is possible. the timing for 2 cr.lk linked into cr.mp is SLIGHTLY different so it's better to learn this so that you can do dash mp > cr.lp > cr.lp > cr.mp with less problems dash mp > cr.lp - mandatory dash mp > cr.lp > blah > cr.hk - easy follow up dash mp > cr.lp > cr.lp > cr.mp > basket - harder follow up, more damage. cr.lk > cr.lp - hitconfirm link. rather useful ===hard stuff=== mostly dash links. worth practicing because A) Victor and Bishamon can both be hit crouching with standing jab B) It'll help you keep up with the opponent in damage in some matchups and helps set up mixup (especially Demitri, Sas, characters like that) combo parts: cr.lp > st.lp > dash lp - "basic" one dash lp > dash lp - hardest one, impractical but give it a shot. if you go into the dash combos off a low like cr.lk, youll need to do this if you want to dash more than one time st.lp > dash mp - also very hard cr.lp > st.lp - more or less filler the basic theory behind the combo is that you need to be relatively close to do it, once you get too far you need to do dash lp > dash lp to be close enough to continue the combo. off jump ins you can do 1-2 dashes without having to use dash lp > dash lp. whenever you want to end, do dash lp > cr.mp > basket examples: jMP > jHP > cr.lp > st.lp > dash lp > cr.mp > basket cr.lp > st.lp > dash lp > cr.lp > st. lp > dash lp > cr.mp basket cr.lk > cr.lp > st.lp > dash lp > dash lp > cr.lp > st.lp > dash lp > cr.lp > st.lp > dash lp > dash lp > cr.mp > basket on demitri and bishamon you can do cr.lp > st.lp > rising jlk > jmp > jmk > jhp > cr.lp > st.lp > repeat you have to slightly delay the st.lp to make sure youre far enough for the jMK to connect (it'll whiff if you do it wrong). this combo is somewhat practical, but rather than loop it like an infinite, use it as an opportunity to set up high/low again

Personal.

Adding on to what Lumin said, some characters lack a good reversal, and gold burst is a good substitute. Regardless, I'm not a fan of "saving" bursts outright, I just use them as needed. Some setups I use gold burst to escape (a good example is Tsubaki 22[D]). If I think I can take a round and it's close, I might use my burst. I get sort of upset when I see people just hold their bursts until they have 30 percent health in the last round. S: NOL A+: Annoying characters Litchi A-: Good Chars B: Hakumen, Tager What do you mean "take her seriously"? I mean, she's on the character select screen. . .