Mo the Hawk

Where did you get those pools, Grover? The PDF link on UFGT's website is still showing Monday's assignments.

There's no magic solution to this. If you blocked his 5D in the corner, you either need to spend 50 SP on a guard cancel (which can be baited), 100 SP on a guard cancel cancelled into OMC to stay safe, or take your best guess on his mixup. If he's trying to make you block 5D after a sweep though, 50 SP allows you to pull off wake-up R-action cancelled into Power Charge, which leaves you safe and in some cases will allow you to punish him with an AUB 2B if you see he's jumping in on you during the super flash. Either way, you need to spend some resources to get out without having to guess high/low. Instead of focusing on how to get out of the corner, I'd put my efforts towards making sure he never puts you in the corner in the first place.

You have a duplicate of Dsmoove vs. BrkrDave on there.

Looking forward to these matches. I might throw my own hat in after UFGT.

I had a lot of time this past week, so I've been spending it cleaning up my 5D oki game after a mid-screen sweep. Namely ensuring that I never get hit by a wake-up Furious Action/R-Action/DP or wake-up super ever again. I highly recommend practicing your technique for holding back (either 7, 4, or 1) while dash jumping forward after a Sweep > 5D. This will keep you safe from most DPs. However, this can also make going for the "Chie/Tomoe sandiwch" easy to screw up. You may find it difficult to air-dash properly after jumping over your opponent. It's very easy to accidentally slide a 7 or a 1 to a 4 before you intend to return to 5 and hit 66, thus causing you to air-dash backwards when you hit your first 6. (which in this case is still a 4 because you haven't completely jumped over to the other side yet) In other words, make sure you don't accidentally buffer a 4 in advance of the actual air-dash input you want to do. If you want to block by holding 7 or 4 while jumping over someone, make certain that you're cleanly returning the stick to neutral before inputting your air-dash. Personally I recommend practicing getting a feel for a half-circle motion ending in 4. So the input for a mid-screen sweep 5D oki setup would be: Sweep > 5DD > 66987[4]. Then let go of 4 to give yourself enough of a gap to allow for a clean 66 input. And MAKE SURE YOU HIT THAT 9, otherwise you'll neutral jump or jump backwards. Get a feel for sliding 6 to 9, then to 7, and finally to 4. The last 2 paragraphs are a reflection of my findings playing on an arcade stick with a square gate. Obviously your preferred controller may differ, but the principles are the same, so practice with whatever you feel most comfortable with. I've also taken a lot of notes about how to approach each character to make sure that if they try to DP or super out of your 5D setup, they're going to regret it (or spend a lot of resources to find a safe way out). The fact is, there are some players out there that simply refuse to block. And to a lesser extent, there are also players who will occasionally block, but also occasionally gamble with a wake-up DP or super just to keep you guessing. I want to shut down both of these kinds of players. ZomB already covered most of the points about how to adjust your setup if the opponents starts using "free escape options" so I won't go over those again. Just remember to adjust the timing of 5D after sweep if they start 5-frame jabbing / backdashing / etc. Characters with legit escape options are highlighted in red, with their options in parentheses. Adjust accordingly. FOR LATE TECHERS: Sweep > Immediate 5DD > Dash up 2A > AOA > reset Narukami (5F 5A) Never dash jump forward. You’ll get hit by the AUB portion of his DP. Always be normal jumping. Punish a blocked DP mid-screen by walking underneath him to the other side (to screw up his inputs for a mid-air Ziodyne cancel, and also to remove the risk of a Cross Slash cancel when he touches the ground) and doing the 5B > 5C air combo punish. You’ll be safe from both of his wake-up supers. If it’s wake-up Cross Slash, air dash over his head to punish him without having to block it. (He won't be in counter-hit state, though. Don't get hit out of a 5B > 2D that doesn't link together!) Mitsuru (2B) Because her’s is so fast, you only need to hold back to block for a split second. As an added bonus it will be an Instant Block for free extra meter. After blocking her DP in the air, buffer your 5B input so you perform 5B the moment you touch the ground. If done properly you’ll catch her with 5B > 5C before she touches the ground for a safe punish. If mistimed at all though, you run the risk of eating The Scumbag Super. If you want to tell whether or not your punish will be safe, pay attention to Chie's height relative to Mitsuru when the block happens. If Chie is lower to the ground than Mitsuru, Chie will hit the ground first and you're clear for the punish. If they're at even level or Mitsuru is lower, check Mitsuru's SP before deciding whether or not to punish. PAY ATTENTION TO HER SP AT ALL TIMES. If she has 50 she can wake-up Bufudyne to catch you jumping forward in any way. Once she gets 50, you need to stop jumping forward. Either simply wait, or neutral jump. Neutral jumping will let you air backdash away from the Bufudyne, then run up and punish. Things get tricky if she starts utilizing the 2B escape option. Sweep > Delay > 5D will shut this down, but if you jump forward for a high-low mixup afterwards, and she decides to DP instead, you'll get hit because the engine disables your ability to block in the first 7 frames of your jump. If you want to stay safe here, you're going to have to sacrifice your high-low mixup and do: Sweep > Delay > 5D > Wait and Block > Dash 5A to keep up pressure. If she's still wake-up DP'ing, you get a punish which should hopefully discourage her from trying it again. Yukiko You’re safe from everything as long as you hold back to block while dash jumping forward. As an added bonus, the game engine will even auto-correct your blocking direction if you've already jumped to the other side when you block it. Landing after blocking it leaves you in perfect position and timing to CH punish this DP that is otherwise pretty difficult to punish. Because of her DP's relatively long start-up, Yukiko is one of the characters that will force you to perfect your timing for holding a blocking direction for the right amount of time, so practice to make sure that you'll both block DPs and your mix-ups will still be clean if she does nothing and blocks the 5DD. Don’t air-turn when you’re right on top of Yukiko’s head; you run the risk of getting counter-hit by her DP. Naoto (SB Aim) You’re safe from everything as long as you hold back to block while jumping forward. Similar situation as Yukiko. If Naoto decides to delay the the shot/explosion, you'll either auto-correct block it or already be behind her. If she abuses SB Aim, start delaying your Sweep > 5D. Her DP is slow enough that you can still dash before jumping forward while using the Sweep > Delay > 5D setup and still be safe. Aigis (5F 5A, Backdash, Orgia Back Boost) If she has 50 SP, she can super-cancel DP into Goddess Shield. No matter how much meter she has, though, don't push any buttons until she touches the ground. By running forward, you could potentially bait out the Goddess Shield. And if she doesn't cancel, well, she's still in CH state on the ground, so go for max damage. If she’s mashing Orgia Back Boost on wakeup, dash up and CH 5B her instead of jumping forward for a mixup, then air combo > j.8D > AOA. Sweep > Delay > 5D will also work, but she'll just get hit by 5D, and you won't be able to confirm that hit into another hard knockdown and another setup. Labrys Her DP is slow as molasses, so you don’t need to hold back to block while dash jumping! Just pay attention to her SP. DP can be super cancelled, and if you have to block Breaking Wheel you are at disadvantage. Luckily you can Quick Escape through it on reaction. Shadow Labrys You don’t need to hold back to block while dash jumping! Instead focus on dash jumping ASAP. If done properly you’ll jump over her and her DP for a CH punish. PAY ATTENTION TO HER SP. DP is cancellable into Brutal Impact. … Never get hit by Brutal Impact. Kanji [*]If you let go of your block at all before going for your mix-up, you’re getting shocked. This requires some adjustment in the timing of your jump. Take a split second after doing 5DD before running and jumping. Kanji’s DP has a long enough startup to allow this. You’ll still have time to block from your starting side, and it will make your air-dash input after jumping over him easier. You could also choose to input your dash ASAP like usual, and then put a delay between the dash and the jump. So take your pick between 5DD > Delay > 66987[4], or 5DD > 6[6] > 987[4]. Whichever is easier for you. [*]You COULD hold back to block for the entire duration between your jump-in and your mix up, but you’re going to have to be extremely precise in the transition between letting go of your blocking direction, and then air-dashing as part of your mixup. It’s very easy to screw up your mix-up this way, and you want to make your opponent respect your mixup. [*]PAY ATTENTION TO HIS SP. He can cancel his DP into either of his supers. If you’re standing in place or running towards him when he decides to cancel into his Awakening super, you’re toast, so if you want to be safe, go for a j.C > j.B punish. Akihiko (5F 5A, 5F 2A) [*]You don’t need to hold back to block while dash jumping! Instead focus on dash jumping ASAP. If done properly, you’ll jump over him and his DP for a CH punish. If you’re too late with your jump, though, you’ll get hit by the AUB portion of his DP. [*]If you want to play it completely safe, just normal jump forward while holding back to block. The AUB portion of his DP won’t reach you, and you’ll block the 2nd hit. You may have to start doing this anyway if the Akihiko knows to 5A or 2A out of 5D for free, and you’ll need to start delaying. [*]PAY ATTENTION TO HIS SP. He can cancel DP into any of his supers. DP into Thunder Fists is completely safe, and DP into Cyclone Upper can catch you trying to run up and punish with 5B. Yosuke (5F 5A) [*]You don’t need to hold back to block while dash jumping! Instead focus on dash jumping ASAP. If done properly, his DP will trigger, but you’ll jump over his head, your persona doesn't break, and you still get your sandwich combo. If you’re too late with your jump, though, you’ll get tripped. [*]Unfortunately he's not in CH state after his DP is triggered, and even if he was, he's going to get hit by 5DD before anything else, so unless you're in the corner or have lots of SP stocked, you won't get much damage. But you do need to keep this in mind for mash-happy Youskes that will screw you up for trying to punish with 5B > 2D. Chie (5F 5A) [*]You don’t need to hold back to block while dash jumping! Her DP is easy to jump over completely if you’re dash jumping. [*]Punishing her DP is hard. If you absolutely want a CH punish, you can’t be jumping at all for your mix-up, and you’ll have to wait and bait it out. Walk backwards then punish with 5B > 5C before she touches the ground. Or if you want to get fancy and have the timing nailed down, 214C > OMC > 5C or 214C > 236236A > 66 > 5C for big punishes. She can cancel the early mid-air frames of her DP into Agneyastra though, so keep that in mind. [*]She is not in CH state when she hits the ground, and she recovers really fast, so practice dashing and 5A'ing her ASAP. On the plus side, she will be crouching, so you can get a 5AAA crouch-only combo. [*]DP > Power Charge is a free ticket out of the setup, but you shouldn't be pushing any buttons so that's all it gets her. If she does this, air backdash away to avoid getting air-grabbed, 2B'd, or anything else that would give her the advantage. Elizabeth (Backdash) [*]lol [*]To beat mashing backdash, just delay 5DD. Don’t even stop at 5D; the hitstun from 5DD will lock her in place if she tries to backdash. Teddie (DP) [*] [*]You know the score here. Sweep > j.C > j.2D instead of ground oki to take away his DP option, then continue to apply pressure with caution.

I noticed from recent tournament footage that Chie players like Burger McNasty have opted to go for air resets instead of grounded 5D oki. So instead of Sweep > 5DD, it's Sweep > j.C > airdash. The mixup from here is either j.B or airthrow. j.B will counterhit players attempting to tech, and throwing will beat blocking. That's how the commentators explain it anyway. Is there something about this that makes it superior to the usual ground oki? Maybe it's character-specific?

For what it's worth, my success rate with that Skullcracker trick is about 90% if I input another 236, and about 10% if I don't. Do whatever feels most comfortable to you.

I'm terrible at judging my position after a OMB, so it was really difficult to properly time a Sweep for when they fall back down. Hence why I came up with replacing Sweep with j.236D. I drop backdash 5C combos a lot too. The engine doesn't seem very lenient about buffering your 5C input earlier than you're supposed to be able to actually perform 5C. So I've generally adopted "later is better."

I'm in there.

Right, it's not too useful if you aren't already sitting on a lot of meter beforehand. But if you are, you can guarantee safety and a high damage punish.

Yep that turns out to be the case unless you're in the corner. However I found something kind of funny; those Narukami DP punish combos also work MID-SCREEN when you use OMC instead of Power Charge. Just 214C at the height of his DP, OMC and be holding forward when you do so you go into full sprint, and catch him with 5C before he hits the ground. It's not all that difficult, and once again it removes the risk of a late Narukami super cancel.

+1, I'd like to hear some more discussion on this. Right now my general strategy is to not approach Mitsu while she's airborne. If you read a jump back j.A, you can run in and 2B that shit. But that's a read, and like all intentions to anti-air with 2B, executing on that read isn't always 100% reliable.

Hold dat. But yeah, I tried to be as forthcoming as possible about how 5B CH combos are still preferable in a lot of ways. But if the stars align and you have the right situation, 214C combos are worth knowing. Colpevole: I'll have to try that. Actually now I'm curious if that allows you to exclude 5C from the first 10 pre-SMP moves, allowing 5C > 236B > 236B to loop even more.

A collection of 214C FC combos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JtFxPWQUIEo

I got the timing nailed down on those Narukami/Yosuke j.B loops now. Thanks guys!

Personally I think matchup threads are the way to go since those are already organized and in places where people who don't visit this topic will go visit when seeking matchup information. But do whatever you feel is best.

It's in the vid at 3:28, but it starts with a FC (Rampage B while Power Charged), and even then just watching the timing doesn't make it apparent.

Wow I can't get that to work at all... it's super easy if j.B is the first hit because they're standing straight up, but hitting them with 2B first makes them reel back. How can you hit them with j.B while they're reeling back like that?

Cool, thanks. Also I found the combo vid on Nico: http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm18812853

Does anyone know if that "Blazing Wind" combo video got uploaded anywhere else? It's taken down on YT: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=3D3JdWypu6M I was looking for examples of those Narukami and Yosuke-specific combos where Chie can do some kind of j.BB loop starting from the ground. I saw Kirisame doing them at NEC too but of course those videos are gone.

Those meterless starters are pretty sick. I'll make sure they go in the video. @Primiera: Without Burst the 214C > 236236A combos generally aren't worth it. With only 50 meter it does less damage than the standard 5B CH punish combo, and with 100 meter it does 6.5k - about 400 damage better than what I can squeeze out of the 5B CH starter combo with 100 meter. It also doesn't build any meter, so generally the 5B CH starter is still the way to go. However, with Burst and 100 meter or more, these are touch of death combos on some characters at mid-screen. The video will show how to do these but here's the notation: (8011 damage, 100 meter, Burst): 214C > 236236A > 5C > IAD j.BB > 2B > sjc > j.A > j.C > j.236D > OMB > 5B > 236B > 236B > [5C > 236B > 236B] x2 > 214D > 236236D (9111 damage, 150 meter, Burst): 214C > 236236A > 5C > IAD j.BB > 2B > sjc > j.A > j.C > j.236D > OMB > 5B > 236B > 236B > 236236A > [5C > 236B > 236B] x2 > 214D > 236236D These can also be adjusted for about 200 less damage if the first Skullcracker B doesn't carry them to the corner. Replace the first [5C > 236B > 236B] with [5C > dash > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B], then remove Black Spot D from the combo entirely. (just cancel the last Skullcracker directly into God's Hand) Also yes, these combos will build the opponent's Burst meter quite a bit so it may not always be wise to try these if they have anything less than 1/3rd of a Burst gauge. This will also be explained in the video. EDIT: Whoops, 236D before the OMB, not 236B. That's kind of important.

I've been mega busy - please feel free to post whatever you've found. And yeah the combos I've been working on start with 214C > 236236A. Good call on the Narukami DP though; I'll be interested to see your combo for that.

Wait... aren't you at Winterbrawl? Like, right now?

Makes sense, thanks. Also shoutouts to this forum being dead. But I'm currently working on a video explaining how to use FC 214C as a max-damage punisher in certain situations including a mini SMP combo. Kind of busy with moving to a new place though, but I'll try to get it finished soon.

Stupid question! When someone says Chie's j.C is "body attribute" what does that mean? I see it on the wiki and how every other character's j.C is Head, but what does this mean and why is it important? I suspect it's something to do with j.C's (inconsistent, in my experience) ability to clash with, avoid, or even sometimes stuff anti-air 2Bs. Just looking for clarification on the meaning of that Attribute category.