Pen_Ninja

The problem with corner black hole post-patch is that the black hole will now be active off screen and wont hit if you do it in the corner. Pre-patch the range adjusts so that it hits in the corner. Post-patch it'll just whiff off screen. That makes it hard to blockstring into black hole because you'd need something really long range to do so.

I had this issue too. It turns out there's no dash :3 Edit: as per below, I'm probably wrong. I know I've been doing it without dash from fairly close range... Maybe a little further back means the dash is necessary and possible

Does this mean I might be back on the Carl train? :O Probably as a sub... I can't figure out the first point... She doesn't lose HP during her activation animation any more? The wiki states she doesn't lose HP until 18 frames after initially pressing D in the first place anyway? What's the actual change here? I'm really happy with the faster Ada recovery, I feel like I use her too much and waiting long enough for her to start getting any HP back can be borderline dangerous. It just depends on how much faster it actually is. Cantibale change is meh... can't say I remember ever hitting a CH cantibale Volante gauge use I can get over I feel like they're making the cog work more like it did in CSE... I support this.

Thanks a bunch! I'll try this is training mode tonight. I was trying something along the lines of a 214B option select but I had issues with when my opponent neutral teched. I'm assuming the 5B whiffs on neutral tech otherwise 4B would come out anyway?

I'm having trouble with specific corner oki after ... 6D(1) > Tsubame > 6C > 4Kote > 5D oki. So far I'm doing 5D and hollowing up with 5B to give me time to confirm how my opponent woke up. - If the emergency tech I can 5B > 2B or 5B > 6A for mixup If they roll backwards or delay tech I believe I get the following combo: 5B > 4B(e) > 4B(m) > Itsuu~A > 6Kote > Haku > Hatsu > RiichiA~D > 6C > 4Kote which keeps them in the corner and gets 6C knockdown If they roll forward off the 6C knockdown above, I get the same combo but if they roll forwards after the 6D(1) > Tsubame > 6C ender they end up behind me and this is where I'm having trouble. I feel like I can do 5B > Hatsu > Chun(whiff) > Staff 2 > 5B(m) > 4B(m) > Tsubame > 6C > 4Kote but that's really odd and it can be tight to run forward far enough for the 5B. Is there any better way to get the side swap or should I just not be doing this oki after this ender?

Did you even test this? "The first hit of the fireball will reset the combo, forcing the opponent in a standing position. You will be grabbing them between the first and second hits." First up, this is always going to be a purple throw. From the wiki "Throwing an opponent in blockstun or hitstun (or 6 frames immediately after either) will result in a purple throw which are usually very easy to escape." Even if they're not in a combo, you still need 6 frames before throwing before it's green, there's no way there's 6 frames between 2 hits of fireball. "If they reject your throw, the fireball will still be there and will allow you to get a 50/50 mixup anyways." A throw reject counts as both characters getting hit for 0 damage. Fireball goes away on hit or block so the fireball will NOT still be there, neither will graviton. "Otherwise, you can get a 5K grab combo into the same situation." Because the fireball screws with your proration, you get around 3k into a similar situation. "Also kokonoe is so bullshit, you can combo after tager laser." This is one of the few BS thinks she has that I can safely say is actually not viable in match. Good luck hitting raw Tager into some graviton set above the screen.

I find that 2A > 6B(1) > 4D > 720D can open people up. As unsafe as 6B(1) > 4D is, if this is the only time you do that, it's easy to take someone by surprise. Astral setups are real, it's a 0 frame after flash command grab, a valid mixup... the problem is that I tend to get black hole by accident too.

I think these are all jokes from people believing that Koko is only just as bad as Valk

Perth, Western Australia are keen to ban her. Where the world has seen my video for a day and a half, Perth has had to put up with it for weeks and it's really making the game look bad. We're holding off for the moment though because people may need the experience if she's not banned at EVO for example but we will ban her if we can see that a majority of other places have. Also if we banned her now, nobody would care what Australia did and it would change nothing T___T

Hey guys, Video that pretty much covers taking your opponent to the corner and killing them. Includes: - Corner carry off combos in many situations - Explanation of a couple of 'universal' black hole setups - Setups for black hole against the following Tager Rachel Carl Azrael Jin - An infinite blockstring used to gain meter. Tight if timed correctly. Comes off standard oki, also sets up into black hole. - Match start -> death example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KrSJJHwFATA

How do I favourite posts? I share information with my local scene so we can all get better as a group. If that information helps them beat my character then so be it, I just need to outplay them. They do the same for me. If I go elsewhere for a tournament then I'll play the tournament and once competitive stuff is over, I'll tell people what they were doing wrong, whether it be against my character or not. Some people just want to see others get better. ---- On the subject of banning Kokonoe. I currently main her and I'm on the side of getting her banned. Once people start using all of her tools properly then she's going to be much worse than she is now. I have round start confirms into black hole the characters without a meterless DP don't really have an escape from. Once the black hole combo is done, they're dead. Once players better than me in neutral start using the same set play that I use and/or better, the road is only going to get tougher from there. ---

What exactly do you plan to lab that requires someone else to control the Kokonoe for you? Most stuff you need to practice against can be set up to record and play the training dummy. The only thing I can think of that's an issue is wake-up super ball which can be hard to make a training dummy do at the right time. It's still doable though, just with some trial and error.

You can use it to close out a round either by making your combo unburstable because you're in overdrive or by comboing into giant Tager in OD so it does more damage. Just be careful because the stronger graviton in OD makes some combos not work.

There's also a general guide about notation here http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=Notation That should help if you're having any trouble with the whole number system and even goes further into more advanced notation like holding down buttons or follow-up attacks. There's also a general terms glossary below it. It's actually a really good page.

Activate is a wonderful thing. You'll get used to it fairly quickly as long as you actively try to use it, you'll find the right situation. I've been using OD for start of round 5B confirms. If your opponent is standing then you don't really get much off a raw 5B mid-screen but with OD you can get almost 5K and carry to the corner. Use these: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X61V_Nb4q1E Sometimes it's easier to skip the 6B on the last one. In any case you need to make sure you're jump cancelling out of 2C as early as possible on the 2nd one, it gives you enough time to hit the floor and run in to 6B. Basic frame data has been up since very very early but there's still nothing on the "full frame data" page.

1. Fireball before 22B? are you sure? 22B then fireball is good though... This setup is good because it forces the opponent to block 22B which gives you time to throw the fireball. It looks slow but it's actually safe to most reversals input before 22B hits (everything I can think of except Houtenjin) and allows you to go into a blocksting after the 22B, then continue with another blockstring after 214A. eg. 22B, 214A, (22B activates), 5B>5C>2C, (214A hits), 5B>5C>2C. It essentially lets you get 2 blockstings in for free as opposed to 1. 2. j.C>236D,5B>2C>6C>jc>j.C>j.D>j.C>j.214D>j.C>j.2C(whiff)|>6[A]>22B>5B>5C>6[A]>6B>236B. See the first post of this thread for any help on notation. 3. I'm working on it 4. Different oki paths are somewhat situational. - 236B,5C>5D>5C>6B(1)>214A is pretty good because the fireball stays for a while but it wont work after a long combo and doesn't catch rolls too well - 236B,5C>22B,214A as I mentioned above is really good. It works after everything except for really really long combos where the opponent techs between the last 5C and the 236B explosion. Catches rolls and late techs, gives you 2 blockstrings. - 236B,5C>22B gives you time to run up and either 2B, IOH j.C or throw and allows a meterless combo off each of them. Doesnt give you the 2nd mixup opportunity that the previous setup does. You can also follow with 6D to threaten another IOH attempt. - 236B,5C>6[A]>214214A, 6D>236C(bullets whiff), 6D>214A is good if you do the 214214A super at the end of a combo. It gives you a nice ambiguous mixup straight away and then another free blockstring. Also leaves graviton on them. 5. You can try j.C>j.236D|>5B>2C>6C>jc,j.B>j.C>j.2C(whiff)|>land, j.B>j.C>j.2C(whiff)|>5C>236B for about 4.5k but that's probably even harder. Alternatively you can use the mid-screen combo you posted a little while back to do 4.4k. 6. 22B traps, gravitons and fireballs win neutral games. Once you've won neutral, continue to win by doing stupid amounts of damage. 7. 22B traps don't go away on block. Mu's often use 5C>6C>something as a blockstring, you can 22C between 5C and 6C which makes 6C whiff which is terrible for the Mu. Without this blockstring they're gonna have a harder time. 8. It's easier if you delay the j.B so you're closer to the ground. You also need to do 236A immediately... buffer it as much as possible. I recommend learning 6B>4D,IAD,j.B>j.C>j.2C(whiff)|>665C,IAD,j.B>j.C>j.2C(whiff)|>665C>236B instead. It corner carries about twice as far.

Looks like you worked it out yourself :P but for anyone else who possibly has the same question: the laser needs to be charged a bit or otherwise you only get about 9k. Since you can't charge the air version, you need to do the ground one.

10k off a FC 2C in the corner, no pre-placed 22B needed. Headbanging all day

9jc for this one. You can do 8jc but if you delay the first j.C they'll probably fly over your head when you do j.C >j.214D

If you do an easier and lower damage combo, you kind of have to just deal with the lower damage. At this point I think I'm better off giving you advice on the IOH j.C>236D,5B>2C>6C>jc>j.C>j.D>j.C>j.214D>j.C>j.2C(whiff)|>6[A]>22B>5B>5C>6[A]>6B>236B combo: - Delay the first j.C so you're higher in the air, this makes getting the last j.C out much easier - Remember to do the whiffed j.2C at the end of the air combo to give you more time to hit 6[A] This is why I generally do 236B,5C>22B,214A oki in the corner. Emergency tech: they block the lightning and you get oki Short delayed tech: they invincible through the lightning but are pretty much forced to block after that, then you can blockstring them into the 214A into oki Long delayed tech: lightning hits them and resets them, you can 2C>9D>236D,6D>236B back into oki Roll back or forwards: same as the above. The worst scenario here is that they delay tech through the lightning and you have to hit them after that because it means you have to play the DP game with some characters just like everyone else. To directly answer your question. Your best option is to do 22B and 214A oki so you can force them to block the fireball with a short blockstring.

5711 off 6B in corner 6B>9D,5B>5C>2C>6C>jc,j.C>j.2C>5D>236D|>22B,5B>5C>6[A]>6B>236B,5C>214214A,7D>236C,236C Builds 29 heat before super vs 25 and uses less graviton meter, it also lets graviton recharge between the first 236D and the super.

I had some time to test this out and it seems that it wont work if you get both hits on both j.Bs and do both reps of the 22A loops. You need to either cancel one of the j.Bs before the 2nd hit or only do a single 22A loop.

What combo are you doing? No matter what combo I do, I can't get it to NOT work... Definitely stolen. I used to do similar SMP stuff with Carl but I hadn't applied it to Kokonoe. Probably just because she has a million other options.

Loli bacon's breakdown is correct. If you're ever having trouble landing on time, a whiffed j.2C will pretty much always help, especially after j.C. A lot of combos use it really close to the ground after a j.C late in an air string but it generally comes out and makes you land so fast that you don't even see the animation

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sYHMZL4pbSM 3rd part of those casual sets. Really happy with the astral setup at 28:40