Zenmetsu

Litchi isn't as high as the lot of you are making her out to be. You are arbitrarily assigning your opinions to Litchi's attributes so your perspective is skewed. What are "great", "amazing", "good", and "fine" supposed to mean? You can't use arbitrary adjectives like these as a measure for a character's worth. When you scrutinize Litchi's playstyle at high-level play you will realize that the majority of what you said is wrong. - A DP that's difficult to punish: Sorry, but this an argument related to execution so it's already moot right off the bat. It might be difficult for scrubs to punish but at high-level play every character has a way to set up oki so that they can consistently punish her DP. And since we only look at high-level play when determining tiers (at least I hope that's what we're doing) this argument involving punishment, which is clearly just a topic about execution, is out the window. - Amazing corner game and traps: Her entire corner game revolves around knowing exactly how the opponent is going to tech. She doesn't have a "universal" option that account for all types of ways the opponent can wake up. If she did then MAYBE she would be high tier (with a brain-dead playstyle), but the truth is this isn't the case. Her corner pressure is better than most of the cast but even the Japanese agree that Rachel has the strongest okizeme in the game. Litchi okizeme isn't fluid. It requires more technicalities than the majority of the cast; otherwise, she won't be able to get an optimal follow-up combo afterward. This technical aspect in itself is an inherent weakness to Litchi's pressure game because it restricts her abare. - Good anti-air: I don't know where to start about how wrong this is, but when her "best" anti-air in certain match-ups with stick is going for a counter-hit 5A into unhitconfirmable risky 41236A then something should tip you off that her anti-air is lacking. By the way, her 5A[m] is not JCable so you are forced to follow-up with risky special moves that put you at huge disadvantage when you can't even hit-confirm if you got the CH or not. In fact, I would say the anti-air department is one of Litchi's WEAKNESSES. - Fine damage output: Fine damage output in comparison to who? Bang without meter? Have you seen Litchi B&B damage output? I'd argue that Litchi has one of the lowest average damage outputs in the game when she has trouble breaking 3k damage with the majority of her commonly used B&B combos. I think the only thing you said that is true is the fact that she's strong in the air. This I won't dispute because there's enough evidence out there that justifies your statement. But Litchi is NOTHING like Jin. Let's look at something you've forgotten to mention which is the ability for characters to punish Bursts. Jin excels in this aspect probably more than anybody since the majority of his move are jump-cancellable. Litchi has lots of points in her combo string that requires her to commit so she is very easy to Burst. Just taking this into consideration Litchi is already a lot LESS like Jin.

The only thing I read about Daisharin have all been troll-related wishlists on the Japanese BBS, with one of them being, "I would be happy if Daisharin started up faster." so I didn't bother posting about it. Litchi forum is pretty much overrun with trolls right now and nobody has been posting any relevant info.

You have two options against Hakumen's slash super: 1) You can rush him if you are ballsy. The mind game here is that if you rush in and force him to attack before the super is fully charged then you can dash brake + block the attack and punish. If Hakumen is content with charging his super then you can attack him before he even unleashes his super. The risk is that if you screw up then you lose half life, but I feel that you have more control during this mind-game situation than Hakumen who is already committed to the super he just activated. 2) The safer option is to get as far away as possible. The sword (unblockable on full-charge) part of the super cannot hit you from full screen and the wave that travels on the ground can be normal blocked, or you can simply jump over it. The wave isn't unblockable. You won't be able to punish in this situation since you are on the opposite side of the screen. It is also up to you to figure out how to get to the opposite side of the screen without getting clipped. Regarding other things about this match-up... I have to say this is definitely in Hakumen's favor. I highly recommend learning 5A(CH)>IttsuA as Anti-air in this match. I also highly recommend BIZZARE okizeme tactics on Hakumen because his guard counters eat all staff-related options. Staff-related oki, which is usually safe against most of the cast, is high-risk against Hakumen. Also, risky 6B[hold] twirly thingy goes a long way. This match will blow your concept of what's risky and what's not.

I tried your combo on Tager tonight and it seems really unstable. I tried lots of variations by dashing/not dashing between the 6C's and from different locations on the screen. When I can hit the full combo it does more damage than all the other alternative combos, but I don't think I'd go for this combo every single time because it's unstable. If you have ways to make it stable every time then I take back what I said and would recommend going for it as much as possible (I was actually assuming you were talking about the 2C>6Cxn loop in your earlier post.) Also, through experimentation I found that doing Tsubame>6C>dash>2C>6C>5D>6C>return>6C>Tsubame>6C>3C is far more stable than repping 2C>6C twice before 5D.

Kennyon and I pretty much agreed that midscreen 6C>2C isn't an optimal combo because it leaves the staff half a screen away is a pretty much useless state.

There's really not much to critique in these particular matches since nothing interesting really happens. It really just looks like the opponents don't have a solid grasp on the Litchi match-up so they just get steamrolled and never get a chance to put YOU in an interesting situation that we can critique about. All I can really say is: - You always 6A after Shishin. It's really repetitive and telegraphed. Yet, the opponent always gets hit by this setup which backs up the point I made above. - You pick up Tager with 2B when you could be 5Cing. You do this multiple times. - Against Bang that likes to jump forward after his autoguard 5D is blocked you can also use j.A to counter as an alternative to airthrowing. Just pointing it out options you might already know as opposed to suggesting that one counter is better than the other.

Been busy all last week but word on the BBS is that Litchi is going to revolve heavily on IppatsuA combos. They are stupidly easy to do now.

Pretty entertaining ad-lib Litchi @ 9:40. Disregard all the other matches beforehand because they are a joke. Unless you like jokes. http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm8456206

The easiest? Probably... 6[m]>j.B>j.BC>Hatsu>Chun

There is no information pertaining to 6C[m]. The only posts regarding it are speculative so I obviously don't bother reporting about those, despite the fact that some of the theory-fighting discussions the Japanese have are very interesting.

Sorry I should have been more clear. I said nothing about 6C being special cancellable on block so right now we can only assume that it's only special cancellable on hit.

This update is from the same person who reported the changes to Litchi which I posted earlier today as well as yesterday. He also warns that some of these points are things he heard from other players after the loketest so he did not confirm all of these himself. Combos -- 2A>5B>5C>6D(1 hit)>IttsuB>2C>6C(1 hit)>Kote>dash 6C(1 hit)>Kote>dash 6C>3C. Starting with 2A results in about 1600 damage. Starting with 5B results in 2300. This combo is weak both in terms of damage as well as carrying the opponent to the corner. However, the staff placement allows for Shishin oki. In the corner, you can replace the last 6C>3C with j.C>Kote. This will allow for the similar kind of falling Kote okizeme that you can currently do with Tsubame>j.C>Kote~ -- 2B>6D(1 hit)>IttsuB>2C>6C(1 hit)>Kote>dash 6C(1 hit)>Kote>dash 6C>3C. Combo starting in low. This will not link if there is any delay between 2B>6D. Thus, this is not a hit confirmable link -- you just have to go for it. For the record, 6B>6D does not work. Furthermore, 6D does not combo if you hit with 2B from too far away. At this range you are best off doing 2B>6B. -- (Close Range)4D>Kote>j.B>(land)>2B>2C>6C(1 hit)>Kote>dash 6C(1 hit)>Kote>dash 6C>3C. Overhead combo. This combos even if the opponent got hit while standing but the links at the beginning of the combo will get tighter. This obviously has to do with the fact that crouching opponents are in stun for a couple frames longer than standing opponent. -- 4D>Kote>j.B>land>2B>2C>3C>Kote>2B>2C>j.B>JC>j.B>j.C>Hatsu>Chun Alternative 4D combo for when you hit the opponent from a far distance. -- (Corner) ...small combo>Tsubame>6C>Kote>(6C>3C)OR(j.C>Kote~) A realistic situation for when this combo will come in handy is when you have broken the opponent's guard after a Shishin mix-up in the corner (using either 6A>5C or 2B>2C) and then quickly go into Tsubame so that the combo is small enough that the scaling from Tsubame won't force an early tech. -- (6B or j.C Counter Hit)>2C>IttsuA>(dash 6C(1 hit)>Kote x2)>dash 6C>3C -- Back Throw>IttsuA>(dash 6C(1 hit)>Kote x2)>dash 6C>3C -- Air Throw>j.B>(land)>5B>IttsuA>(dash 6C(1 hit)>Kote x2)>dash 6C>3C Like mentioned above, you can switch the final part of all these combos with j.C>Kote if you are in the corner. Others: - 6D>5B connects and it might seem idealistic to use for its ease of hit confirming, but 6D results in 5D staff set. In addition to making it difficult to do combos with this staff placement, it is unattractive for okizeme purposes. It is recommended to try and combo into IttsuB as often as possible unless there is further development with the 5D staff placement. - 6D and 4D gatlings into all normals except for 6A, 6C, 3C. - IppatsuA has been confirmed to combo for at least 3 hits. - Midscreen Tsubame results in huge knockback of the opponent to the point that comboing afterward becomes hard if not impossible. The knockback is to the point that 2C can't reach. The reporter mentioned that he feels he can reach if he does dash>2C but is unsure. Tsubame still not RCable. - 6C[m] lost manten return state. - The second hit of 6C can be canceled similar to the first hit. - There have been no obvious uses for IppatsuB~C as of yet. So far the only thing found for combos are: IppatsuB(Hatsu)>(land)>j.B~ and IppatsuC(Chun)>(land)>2C>jc~ It is possible to rekka Hatsu>Chun as well as Chun>Hatsu off the staff. For frame advantage, Hatsu is about equal. Chun is slightly disadvantageous.

63214A = Stand on stick 63214B = Hatsu 63214C = Chun

It does in the corner similar to how 2C>IttsuB combos in the corner in the current game.

- 2B>6D>IttsuB>~ confirmed combo. - IttsuC either activates slower, has more delay after recovery, or both. The players aren't sure which but they all know for sure that there has been some kind of nerf.

- 5B>5C>6D(1 hit)>IttsuB connects. However, on block there is a big enough gap between 5C>6D that it is possible to retaliate and interrupt Litchi's string with the right moves. - There is also a gap between the first and second hit of Litchi's 6D that allows for retaliation. This is similar to how Ragna can IB+ID the current Litchi's 5C[m]. - IttsuC's recovery has changed. It wasn't possible to connect tk.Chun or IAD>j.C after hit. - 4D>Kote>j.B>5Bor2B~ connects - 4D gatlings into 5B, 5C. Gatlings, not combos. - In the corner, 3C[m]>IttsuB allows for both hits of IttsuB to connect. From here, you can combo into 5C, 2C. - RiichiA is the same as in CT. RiichiB is falling Hatsu. RiichiC is falling Chun. - Regarding ending combos with Tsubame: We already know that Tsubame>6C becomes techable after the first hit of 6C. Trying to end with j.C instead of 6C didn't produce any results leading to knockdown either. Therefore, the only way to "finish" the combo is with the techable 6C until further development. - On guard 6D does not give frame advantage. It is estimated to be +0 at best, probably -1 or -2. It leaves you at a range where the tip of 5B barely connects with the opponent. - 6D, Ryuuisou, Daisharin (drop), Kokushi Musou, remove guard primer. Basically all her supers have some way to remove guard primer now. In Kokushi Musou's case, it happens on the first contact with the opponent. It doesn't matter which hit.

Daisharin's drop only removes 1 primer. Lost guard primer recovers over time. When it is close to recovering the primer will start flashing. If you lose another primer before it fully recovers then you lose both the one you were trying to gain back as well as the new one you just lost.

Small update: - The pushback off of 6D on block is about the same as on hit. It's at a range that staffless 5B will reach. - No confirmable changes to staffless Litchi. The guy said although he hasn't tested every little detail, there appeared to be no changes at first glance. Primer break moves that he confirmed: - IttsuB - 6C[m] - 6D 2nd hit He wasn't able to test (get someone to block) Ryuuiisou himself so it's not on this guy's confirmed list but he makes a note of this.

Also, ryoko, if you can send me a link to the site you go to that has the changes made in CT I can translate it. I'm currently getting all my info from the JP BlazBlue BBS but if there are other sites I'd like to help.

I realize some of this has been translated already but I did my own translation. 3C - 3C[m]>IttsuC has been confirmed to combo. - 3C[m] does not cancel into 4D or 6D. - 3C[m] is jump cancellable, but does not combo into tk.Chun due to Litchi being in staffed-state. Tsubame - Same recovery as before. - Has more knockback on hit making it difficult to connect 6C afterwards. - Techability time has been altered: Tsubame>2C>j.B>j.C>D>IAD>j.B>j.C>[Techable] Tsubame>6C>3C confirmed to work. - Still cannot RC. 6D - All 2 hits from 6D can connect even from the tip of 5C[m]. This is to demonstrate the distance of this move. - 6D frame advantage on block, on hit confirm you can link into 5B. - 6D on ground hit is forced standing. On air hit the opponent floats in place exactly where they got hit, as opposed to being blown away out of reach. - Gatling routes: 5B>5C>6D>5B or 5B>2C>6D>5B. - You can no longer special cancel this move like in the previous loketest (meaning you can't cancel into Ittsu or Shishin like stated earlier.) 4D - Litchi is in crouching state while using this move. - 4D>Hatsu>Chun is 1500 damage. - Kokushi Musou does 1100 damage by itself. This guy who reported all this said nobody was playing Litchi at the loketest except him.wwwwwwwwwwwwwwww

...>6C>Tsubame>6C, the second 6C becomes techable. So you're right, it's possible to truncate that ender and just stop after the first 6C.

The reason why 3C[m] combos no longer work is because hitting D or 2D after 3C becomes a staff set. In other words, 3C[m] lost its manten return state in this loketest. Doing 3C[m]>j.D didn't allow for the 3C combos either (which would make sense if there's no return state.) If 3C[m] really did lose return state, then tk.Chun followups will not be possible -- but as a disclaimer this is my speculation and has not been confirmed. Some have confirmed that IttsuB breaks 1 guard primer. People have stated that it feels like Litchi's crouching hit box has gotten bigger. Currently Noel's 6B>6C doesn't link on Litchi, but now it does. They aren't certain if it has to do with Litchi's hitbox getting bigger or Noel's 6C getting more range but this is worth reporting. So if this new change 3C becomes permanent, Litchi will just have to go straight into oki after knockdown with staff. People have asked if it's possible to cancel 3C[m] into the new 4D/6D moves but the guy reporting from the loketest said he didn't try. People have also asked if it's possible to do 3C[m]>IttsuC (basically asking if the new 3C[m] is special cancellable) since there's no manten state but the guy hasn't tried this either. OTL To be honest I don't care what they do to Litchi. I'll still play her even if she's unplayable. Furthermore, I can't imagine ArcSys screwing up SO bad that this becomes the case. And it's not like this is the final loketest before CT gets released so nothing is set in stone.

Hi. Also Litchi's Ryuuiisou breaks 1 guard primer. I think that's all the relevant new info I could find on that BBS. We probably won't get any new info until the weekend. If there are other websites that might have new Litchi info let me know.

RENDER I KNOW LITCHI

Yeah, I have no idea on how canceling the new D's to staffed moves would work STenSatsu. This is entirely speculation but maybe there are different return state windows for the move on block? But I don't want to talk too much about theoretical stuff until more info comes out so I'll leave it at that. Seems like some of the people on the BBS who haven't gone to the loketests are having trouble imagining what the new D moves look like due to the vague descriptions that were given. Apparently not many people were trying out Litchi and focusing more on other characters. Some things I left out previously: - Litchi's 6D was described to look similar to Shiki's tackle in Melty Blood (whatever that means). Another post described it to look like a move where Litchi moves forward with an animation similar to the second hit of her j.D (I wonder if he meant her j.2D since that one actually does have a second hit as opposed to regular j.D?) I dunno, I'm confused like some of the people on the BBS as well. - Litchi's 4D is possibly an overhead kick. It looks similar to the move she was using in the screenshot shown in the Famitsu scan. Activates fast -- about the same timing as her 6A overhead. - Timing on Tsubame>6C got harder. On Noel, the guy tried doing Tsubame>6C>2B>2C but she teched @ 2C. I guess by now it's needless to point out that Tsubame jacks up the techability time for combos.