Moblin

This matchup is giving me a lot of trouble. What tools does hakumen have to deal with platinum neutral? What's the general gameplan?

There were some ideas that I've never seen in another combo video before, awesome stuff Schneider. Do we still have matchup threads?

@kaharadad is also posting hakumen info on twitter if anyone wants to.

Is that information the entirety of what we know? It seemed like @paakumen on twitter was tweeting a ton of information on Hakumen. Either way, this is very interesting news.

Apparently during the stream last night the hakumens were showing off some new combos? I wasn't able to watch, so does anyone know if it got recorded?

That shippu/mugen nerf hits hard, damn. Yanagi is cool though.

I have legit never seen this combo before. Posting it here to remind everyone to learn it if they didn't know about it already.

There's a ton of new haku in the new tournament vids, does anyone have time to find them and post them? Jourdal also said Chin played Hakumen but I can't find the video for it.

I actually really like it - I don't often have time to watch vids that don't have film or Poro in them so it's awesome if I know beforehand if there's something interesting to watch for in another Haku's play.

Watching this video, I can of immediately sense the fact that I really don't understand Poro's train of thought that well at all. He seems psychic in what he does sometimes, but the parts I can I'll definitely comment on when I get the chance.

I've found it's extremely good for getting them into the corner where you can setup high damage confirms with hotaru or OD. It carries your opponent all the way to the corner from the round start position. But I haven't implemented it into my game yet, so I'm not sure how good it actually is in practice

Hi MangoBlackTea, Here are a few things I use to stop my opponents from up-backing. Try these things: 5C > Zantetsu, if timed correctly, is a frame trap for upback and will eat them out of their jump startup. Put a training dummy to upback and practice the timing. 5C on their block > ODC, Renka is a devastating frame trap. I think they might need to barrier it for it to be perfect. However, if this setup works you get an unburstable OD combo off Renka(1), which then leads to a 7k+ OD combo. I've had opponents hold upback while I ODC'd before, and a buffered Renka right after the superflash hits them low out of blockstun reliably. This is probably the biggest punish and callout for an opponent who loves to upback, but it requires OD. 5C is your anti-jump out move, and it hurts a lot. But it depends on when your opponent likes to upback. What moves are they upbacking after you use it? If it's 2b, cancel the 2b with Gurren to catch them out of jump. The timing requires practice. If you can hit their block with 5C, you can also cancel into Gurren, or even 5C > Kishuu, 5C and it will have a good chance of either hitting them or them barrier blocking it in the air, which sinks them to the ground again. I've also seen JP hakumens do this a lot, but it's more a hard read instead of an option coverage like the others: Use a move like 2b or 5c that is blocked > kishuu, and then literally just hesitate for a second. Then, (or even hop forward), 5C. This will snag them out of the air if they upback, if they grab it will counterhit them, and if they mash after they see you're doing nothing, it also has a good chance of counterhitting them. This is risky but in this version, Hakumen has to make hard reads to win.

Has anyone experimented with corner carry AD combos from Renka (2)? I found a route that works on everyone. It costs 3 stars, but is pretty meter efficient and has a ton of corner carry. It might be worth looking into. It's very reminiscent of CS extend where for 3 stars you get a lot of corner carry and about 1.8k. (starter, usually 2b) > Renka(2), hop 5a (x3) > Gurren, IAD j.B, j.2A, land 5C, 3c. 3 star cost, 1 star gained. From the middle of the screen it carries them all the way to the corner and lets you 6a > 6b for an ender. This seems extremely efficient for the corner carry. This combo works on EVERYONE, but there are some things to keep in mind in certain matchups. Character specific stuff: Tighter on Azrael and Valk to connect the 5c than other characters, but still reasonable. On Rachel the hop timing is very tight, but doable. Kagura you need to 2a, 5a 5a after Renka (2) instead of three 5a because his hitbox is so low. Hazama the starter has to be close, if you hit with the tip of 2b >renka(2) it will whiff. Is there any reason why this combo isn't used more? It's kind of tight, but it's well worth the reward since you get CSEX-esque corner carry and good knockdown.

Enma being 1 star and Renka(2) getting a new animation and jump cancellability is really exciting. We're definitely going to have to learn new combos and strategies. I don't even care if he's low tier. I just want something interesting to learn and work on. OD seems to be very good considering we have multiple abilities that guardcrush now besides actually using Crush trigger. I can imagine the shenanigans with OD > Mugen into tsubaki and zantetsu having a good chance at simply guard crushing the opponent as they run out of barrier rather than mixing them up with high/low special spam.

Yeah I didn't even know you could use 2B. That's really cool and probably something I can use against up-back happy opponents. 2b is much easier to frame trap into than 5c.

Schneider, I noticed you used 2b > OD a lot when a 5C > OD would have worked. Does 2b > OD recover fast enough to block if they burst the 2b? I always get bursted away when they burst the 5C ODC.

I wonder if they just added it as an optional follow up after successful drive, like hold A to do Enma in pre-extend CP. Time will tell. For now, get used to those new CPE changes. I like this game a lot

Yeah I can't wait for command grab. It honestly doesn't strike me as that strange, a lot of characters with weaker mixup are given a command grab in FGs I feel. I still really like this version's hakumen though. He feels less linear to me in a weird way.

The loketest will prove this new move is a low/body/head invuln unblockable command grab that refunds 5 stars on hit and 6 stars on whiff. Arksys also saw how hype OD/Mugen comebacks were, so if Hakumen ever takes fatal damage, he is instead revived at 50 hp, the opponent is blown back and Hakumen enters OD/Mugen state automatically

If he has a command grab off kishuu his pressure just got infinitely better. Wow. In the current version, Here are some examples of haku tech that helps against DPs 6a > 6b ender safejump https://youtu.be/bjDLQD5awF8?t=26m53s 3c doesn't give you enough frame advantage as an ender to give safejump. Hakumens, when worried about a DP jump forward with barrier block on their wakeup a lot. Ex Camelia here: https://youtu.be/ONCYs6UnPo4?t=38m9s He jumps backward and barrier blocks to bait the DP, but the opponent respects him so he gets to airdash back in. He could have alternatively just done falling j.B after he saw the opponent was blocking. The biggest thing here is if they DP, you block and punish. If they don't DP, it means they're probably respecting you enough to continue pressure even though you didn't meaty them. Or they can hard read what you're doing and just jump and airgrab you. It's a good tool, but it's not unbeatable. Another ex by PoroPiccho where he successfully punishes a blocked DP: https://youtu.be/Kqh6kzo6ty0?t=4m46s I'm positive one of the biggest things that sets Poropiccho apart is his raw option coverage during certain situations. Look at this burst bait string: https://youtu.be/jV-5bctVDeA?t=1h8m16s Cancels the combo into Hotaru ASAP so that Hotaru will go through a burst, and then immediately after the hotaru he blocks until the last second, and finishes with j.C. Kind of godlike.

Yeah or 6a > 6B sneider. But you did a safejump when you had the opportunity mostly. It was that he got away with so many DPs because you never blocked it unless you hard baited it. Instead you should "half-bait" it by jumping and barrier blocking at his wakeup with a slight delay. If you don't see or get hit with a DP immediately then that's your cue to use j.B. He can't AA fast enough to stuff a j.B if you time it correctly.

Nice job on the Hotaru confirms. Very optimal in this version of BB. I think the biggest thing you need to start doing in the Jin MU is safejumping on his wakeup. Start setting those safejumps up on every knockdown, provided he's not techrolling all over the place which is much different. He got you with a lot of reversals that are simply covered by safejumping or hitting him with a delayed meaty. Or, you respected him too much and he got to reset to neutral or even worse, start hitting your block for free. This is something you might try to fix that: If you don't have time to safejump on his wakeup or haven't set it up, empty hop Barrier above him on his wakeup instead. Watch to see if he DP's. If he does you will continue to block, if not a j.B will stuff or keep him locked down as you fall back into him to start pressure. This is something I see Poropiccho do a lot against characters and players that like to DP a lot on wakeup. It's good coverage of the DP option that won't totally give up your momentum on their wake-up. Other than that, I see that Jin pressure sucks just as much with other hakumens as it does with me. I usually can't seem to find an opening to get out, but I recall IB 5a showing some success which it seems like you're trying to get a handle on.

I would just save some work and add the document. While a ton are really useful, a lot of them are bound to be redundant and it's a lot to ask to pick those out

5C reads are probably the most satisfying thing about this character. Nothing is better than reading someone like a book once and taking the round. If you watch players like Poropiccho and Film, they hit so many yomi 5Cs it's ridiculous. Yomi 5C on a valkenhayn in neutral is ridiculous.

4c is still good for the footsies game like 4c CH or even just normal hit 4C > Super for a quick hard read. But don't get predictable about it because they're always just an airdash away from punishing it.