Tari

It tracks depending on how far off the ground they are, I believe. It could be more complicated than that, but generally speaking, if they aren't very high, you shouldn't expect to teleport into the sky.

Pretty sure you can still OTG with 6A, so I'd assume its hitbox hasn't changed.

I assume he's talking about this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mh31uqIdGQI Took me a couple tries to get a timing where the purple exclamation marks start showing up before they get obscured, and that's about as good as it gets. Slowed down the frames around the grab, but you can slow it down further using Youtube's speed options. Saw it happen in an online match yesterday and was pretty curious about it myself.

Just make sure that you're using 5D and not a directional wind input and it'll work fine. Of course, the wind has to come out before the 6A actually hits the opponent, but those are the only two requirements that I can think of.

I don't know if it's been explained explicitly, but there's definitely been talk of it around here before. It's information that's probably worth mentioning somewhere visible, I suppose. It should be noted that if you're doing it at a distance where you won't hit the opponent, it's better to just whiff j.B or j.C (though why you would be doing it out there I don't know).

Just takes some practice. You can omit the micro dash 5A against some characters, like Jin, so if you want to just practice timing, you can do it on them first. Don't try it on Tager, either. It just won't work.

Added the lotuses to the OP, changed the input on the Astral, and removed mentions of guard primer breaking. Not sure where to add Crush Trigger (specials?) or what to write for either lotus. Pretty much just wrote a very basic intro to the lotus moves for now.

I think he was talking about my teleporting out of Litchi's super. It makes sense, since Litchi probably got hit by the reversal super. Didn't pay enough attention to know for sure the circumstances.

@Sakaku: I think it's pretty much what TD said. There are a lot of newer players to the game right now, who are back-rolling and up-backing quite often. It doesn't help that players haven't really gotten the hang of their blockstrings yet, so the up-back is actually pretty effective in a lot of situations. It's free combos for Rachel, but they really shouldn't be disrespecting her oki so much.

We have a cast of 26 characters. That's 8 characters. Litchi doesn't actually count, either, since she only gets out if the Kokonoe messes up. Carl, who's not on your list, gets out for free. I don't believe Bullet or Tao's dashing supers actually push the opponent, either, so they end up recovering on the black hole. In any case, yes, Izayoi gets bopped by the black hole setup. It sucks, but there's nothing we can do about it. If you find a solution, let us know, otherwise the rest of the black hole discussion is more fit for the Kokonoe forums at this point. On an unrelated note, I somehow reversal super + teleported out of Litchi's Thirteen Orphans on wakeup yesterday. I feel like that shouldn't be possible, but I haven't really bothered testing it more.

The only characters who can super out are those who have a super that moves them forward really far. Things like Bang's Daifunka, or Valkenhayn's dashing super, I believe. Any character without a dashing super or command dash with invuln (Carl/Kokonoe) are pretty much screwed. I believe that in the corner, even Tager can get screwed up with the right spacing. His sledge doesn't get passed Kokonoe, so he just gets sucked into the blackhole. Apparently he can OD + MTW to get through it, but... that's not a very elegant answer. Hakumen is also pretty much dead in all of those setups, since they can do setups where he can't Yukikaze. If they do a bad setup, you can burst her out of her super startup or roll out of the setup, but that only applies when they use bad setups in the first place. :/ Izayoi really isn't much worse off in this than other characters, I don't think. If the opponent tries to call out a double jump (or a low air tech or something) with a blackhole, Izayoi can just teleport behind her anyway. Though, in that situation, most characters can probably do something to deal with it.

Most characters are free to it, haha. If you have 100 meter and can astral, you can use that to get out... but that's about it. If they set it up badly, you can roll and run out, too, but that's a pretty moot point if they're doing real setups.

Ah, the 2C(1) whiffing is probably because you're hitting the 5C too early. Wait till the opponent falls down a bit before you do 5C. They pretty much won't tech unless they touch the ground, so you have a lot of time to work with. And I know exactly what you mean by 'all those dps', haha. I grinded her basic combo so many times a week or so ago and ended up cramping my hand and being completely unable to do dps for like a day. Was pretty amazing.

If you don't get the height necessary for the 2C pickup after the 236B > 214A, this is an alternative route: (Corner) 5B > 5C > 236C > 6D > 2C > 5C > 2C(1) > 236B > 214A > 5C > 2C(1) > (delay/charge) 623C > sj.C > jc j.B > j.C > j.236C > j.D - 4530 damage, 5152 with super I tend to just use this one, since I find it easier to confirm. edit: As far as 2C(1) > 236B whiffing, I can't think of a reason that might be happening. Are you delaying the 236B, perhaps? It should just be an immediate cancel.

It's almost always supposed to be a super jump into the air portion of relaunch combos, regardless of which air path you use. It's not mentioned explicitly in the first post, but it probably should be. There are only a few cases in which you won't super jump, and I'm not sure if those cases are even universally applicable to all characters.

Yeah, it's probably most useful with Rachel's lobelias in this game. I think in GG all projectiles aren't affected by super freeze, but in BB it's just a couple that are special. I have no idea about whether it's universal in P4 or not, since my character in that game never has the opportunity to do projectiles and super freezes (more like, can anyone other than Yukiko do both at the same time?). >_> You can sorta mess with characters like Hakumen who would normally try to cut lobelias by just doing BBL before the lobelia actually hits. If you time it right, the opponent will be frozen in move startup, the lobelia will counterhit during the super freeze, and then you'll get the BBL on the lobelia anyway. :v

If you hold the final position of an input (6 for 236 or 3 for 623) before you hit the button, you'll get the input you want. If you don't hold that direction, the game will choose a special based on what I'm assuming is move priority. DPs appear to have priority over 236 motions, so I assume the people who are getting 236 when they want DPs are holding that final 6 input. Not sure how you're getting plain normals in this game, though, unless you're missing the corner input? If you whiff the 3 directional input, the moves just won't happen, and you'll get a move that correlates to one of the other possible inputs (2/5/6). Might want to just check your inputs in training mode if you're running into that problem to see if you're whiffing anything.

If you start from 2A/5A, you'll be doing combos that don't do 2C loops in the corner and don't do relaunch loops midscreen, pretty much.

Well, off of a midscreen fatal 3C, you only need to be able to carry about a midscreen distance, anyway. If you're any further from the corner, you can just sideswap in the combo. This is my normal midscreen fatal combo. It's pretty much good enough for carry: 3C (FC) > 2C > 5C > 2C(1) > 236B > 214A > 2C > 236C > 6D > 214B > 5B > 5C > sj.B > j.C > jc j.B > j.C > j.236C > j.D - 4870 dmg ...and if you need to go the other way, you just trade a little damage and turn the combo around... 3C (FC) > 2C > 5C > 2C(1) > 236B > 214B > 2B > 236C > 6D > 214B > 5B > 5C > sj.B > j.C > jc j.B > j.C > j.236C > j.D - 4508 dmg ...and if your back is to the corner when you start, you can just reverse it into a corner combo... 3C (FC) > 2C > 5C > 2C(1) > 236B > 214B > 2B > 236C > 6D > 214B > 5C > 2C(1) > 623C > sj.C > jc j.B > j.C > j.236C > j.D - 4654 dmg Probably not optimal combos, but eh. They're fairly easy. Edit: I think this variation on your combo is the best so far: 3C (FC) > 2C > 5C > 2C(1) > 236C(w)~6D > 2C > 5C > 2C(1) > 236B > 214A > 5C > 2C(1) > j.B > j.C > jc j.B > j.C > j.236C > j.D - 5105 damage, 5765 with super Can also change the end from '5C > 2C(1) > etc.' to '2C > 5C > j.B > j.C > jc j.C > j.236C > j.D', but you can't super. That path does 5198 damage, though. Strike Fall tends to RC into 2C into a normal ground combo, assuming your starting hit was 623B/C. Not sure about 6A combos, but I imagine you'd do something like 6A RC > 623B > 214D > j.B > jc j.B > j.C > j.236C > j.D > relaunch, etc.

It's not very strict. There's a minimum height that you have to do Strike Fall from, but it's pretty much just a standard j.B > j.C > jc j.B > j.C > j.236C > j.D height. You have to wait a while after they fall before you do the Phorizer, though. If you try inputting it too early, you won't get it.

Might wanna mention somewhere in that post that the relaunch info follows (N Starter) > C move > 236B > 214A > launcher > air route > ender. Also, just want to point out that the double relaunch is possible from (N Starter) > 5C > 236B or just (C Move) > 236B as well, it's just harder to do and you have to end with sj.C instead of sj.B > jc j.C etc. Here's some random other character-specific excerpts from my notes: (GA Mode) ...236C > 6D > 214B > 5C > 236B > 214A > 2C > 6C > sj.B > j.C > jc j.B > j.C > j.236C > j.D - character specific combo route that adds midscreen damage, but loses a little corner carry. Only works on Platinum, Relius, and Nu. Untested on Kagura and Kokonoe, because I don't have them. (GA Mode, Overdrive) 236236C > 214D > 236B > 214A > 2C > (delay) 236C > etc. - 2C pickup works on all but 7 characters. It doesn't work on Azrael, Izayoi, Amane, Arakune, Carl, Valkenhayn, and Bang. Unsure about Kagura and Kokonoe, again. Does anyone have a high damage fatal combo for GA mode 3C? Wondering if my combos are close to optimal damage or not. :/ I'm getting a little over 5k in the corner and nearly 4.9k midscreen without supers.

Cancel a 236x move into 6D without letting the 236x move actually come out. It sorta explains it in the parentheses in Japanese, but most of us can't actually read that. edit: I am really slow today. I got ninja'd by 6 whole minutes. D:

Yeah, after putting George down, it's pretty common to use lobelias to pressure from a little distance if you aren't trying to immediately go into another round of mixup. Rachel's corner oki is pretty insane, so have fun learning it.

Almost all of Rachel's good oki setups involve ending combos in 3C or BBL and putting down a frog, summoning a pumpkin, or doing both. For example, looking at a generic corner combo, you can see how it ends with 3C: '...5CC > dash 5B > 6A > 236A > 6A > 4B > 3C(1) > 214A' Similarly, the majority of her corner combos end with 3C > 214A/B for a knockdown into either frog or pumpkin oki. A few will end with 5CC into frog or pumpkin, but that typically happens mid-combo, rather than as an ender (ie: ...5CC > 214B > 5B > 6A...). BBL is a somewhat more common ender than 5CC, due to its hard knockdown and the amount of time it gives you to summon whatever you want, but it only occurs when a player has 50 meter and uses it towards the end of a combo. If BBL occurs early in a combo, it's often followed up with a short combo that ends in 3C knockdown instead. It's actually quite hard for Tager to backdash Rachel's oki. George will just activate, and she can simply jump backwards to wait out any wakeup 720/Atomic Collider efforts the Tager might try. If he somehow does backdash (if George isn't around or something), the pumpkin can catch the tail end of his backdash and punish it, or Rachel can just jump in and start pressuring herself.

Edited the combo route post to mention super jumping, sorry about that. There are occasions where you won't have to super jump, but off of the 236B > 214A > 2B/2A > 5C route, it's always a super jump.