Tari

It reminds me of Rachel's off-screen grab gimmicks. Generally, it's more effective to cause someone to tech unexpectedly in the sky and then green throw them if you can. Not sure if that's feasible off of Izayoi's off-screen air combos, though. Never tested it.

Can't remember seeing it before, but I was gone for a while, so I can't really say. It's using music from fairly recent anime, as well. edit: for anyone curious about why this thread got bumped slightly, it's because I had to move a bunch of my own posts around to fix errors caused by the forum migration. One of the swaps I had to make was the original post here from 2012 and the OP post for the CP critique thread, which somehow became a post halfway down the thread rather than the OP.

Updated the wiki with a few more move descriptions, since we were lacking on them. Probably need to go through and clean it up a bit more later, since the game's actually out now. Forgot about updating everything what with all the excitement of release. Whoops.

BHS shouldn't be fast enough to punish 3C unless he IB'd it (assuming our wiki frame datas are all correct). That said, 3C should probably be staggered if you use it on block, anyway, since it's tends to end your pressure. If he does IB it, you can actually just cancel into a 236A~A and fatal him out of it. Pretty yolo, but eh. I suspect you're more likely to have Azrael's opt to just begin their pressure if you do 3C, rather than attempt to punish it with a super.

It's mostly just a matter of Platinum's typical lackluster defense options. A lot of Kokonoe's oki involves projectiles and cross-ups and unblockables, so it's pretty difficult to get out. On top of that, she has nearly guaranteed resets when she has some meter, with ice into blackhole supers. Again, Platinum has no answer to this. It can be fairly difficult to deal with the size of Kokonoe's normals and her ground dash speed, but that's more of a secondary concern to the difficulty Platinum has in getting out of Koko pressure. You might be able to Happy Magicka some of her stuff, but I'm not sure of the effectiveness of that. Only reason I didn't elaborate was because I haven't had enough opportunity to play this matchup to develop a method of dealing with it yet (and I'm not sure there's a method to dealing with the unblockables at all, other than saving your burst). j.C is fairly decent, I think, because it can out-range Kokonoe's amazing 6A, but I'm not so sure about 5B, 2C, or 3C in this matchup.

It works midscreen? I haven't had any luck midscreen, I'll have to test it again. It does work in the corner, though. Edit: I'll edit the previous post in the meantime, though. I was pretty unsure about the Noel thing, so I asked about it earlier but got no responses. ...aaaaand, tested. Got it to work. Noel just catches really low to the ground. Looks pretty weird. It may only work on her off of a 2B > 5C launcher, didn't test 2A > 5C, but that launches a little lower.

I'm pretty sure Rachel is outta luck when it comes to escaping from Kokonoe's ice into blackhole reset. Don't think we have any way out of that, do we?

Just summarizing some notes on relaunch information: Launchers: 2B > 5C - Works on almost the entire cast at most ranges. Requires close range against Taokaka and Rachel. Does not work on Makoto. 2A > 5C - Works on all characters at most ranges. Requires close range against Taokaka and Makoto. Air Route: (these are generally done from super jumping after a launcher) j.BAC - Universally applicable. Works midscreen on everyone. Hardest timing. Works at further range than any other route. Only path that has been tested to work on Noel, and is obnoxiously hard on her. j.BAAC - Slightly easier than j.BAC. Does not work on Makoto, Taokaka. Is prohibitively hard against Rachel (see j.ABAC for her). Hakumen, Valk, Bang, and a few others require no timing. j.ABAC - Variation of j.BAAC for certain characters. Suggested against Carl and Rachel. Requires minimal timing effort. Also arguably useful for Litchi or other characters if BAAC is dropping, I guess. Not sure why I have Litchi listed as a "maybe" here, but whatever. j.BABC - Easiest combo path. Only works on Relius, Bullet, Jin, Tsubaki, Platinum, Nu*, and Kokonoe. Requires literally no timing, just do all the hits as fast as possible. *(Nu requires a 2A > 5C starter to use the j.BABC path) Enders are straightforward and I don't feel like copy pasting and formatting them right now. Pretty much 5A into blah into 623C > sj.C > j.D oki. :/ I haven't tested all the air paths on Kagura, because I'm too cheap and lazy to unlock him.

Just to make sure, you're doing all three hits of A Persia, right?

Normal George oki is terrible in this matchup. However, George + Cat Chair oki is hilarious. It's an oki combo that's normally been reserved for calling out gold bursts (and occasionally DPs) in older games, but it happens to also just counterhit Azrael out of his Growler and give you a free corner combo. I think her crouching block hitbox is indeed slightly larger. Can't say 100% since it didn't make a difference to Izayoi's moves, but I was checking stuff against her neutral crouch and blocking crouch, and her blocking crouch definitely felt taller. Could've been my imagination, though, who knows. I did notice her aerial hitbox is fairly tiny compared to the rest of the cast, so air combos need to be more precise against her. Again, tested with Izayoi, but it matches your descriptions. Good to know most of the stuff works on her without adjusting too much, though. She's scary enough at the moment without being uncombo-able, haha.

Threw up a match-up thread for future discussion, anyway. Does our instant overhead work on her? I haven't played against Kokonoe as Rachel yet, so I can't comment on that matchup in particular, but it's definitely a pretty irritating matchup for other characters. Got to play against some of the folks who obtained her early, and geez, her blockstrings are pretty nasty, her normals have long range, and her unblockable reset setups are really quite, well, unavoidable.

Discuss this matchup here. Seems like an interesting one.

Should also try the good ol' acting polite until you're about to do mixup and then suddenly screaming at the top of your lungs strategy. Honestly, though, I'm not sure there's literally anything Platinum can do in this matchup once she gets touched.

If you aren't doing Strike Fall while the opponent is still at the apex of the hit from Noir, you probably won't be able to combo your 5A (unless you're either really high up or you're in overdrive). If you're doing it while they're up there and you can't get the 5A, then it's just timing. Try buffering it, like not_lunaris said. Just went through and tested a bunch of relaunch stuff on the entire cast. I can't seem to make it work on Noel, but variations of the relaunch work on the entire cast (and the basic j.B > delay j.A > j.C works on everyone but Noel). Has anyone had luck on Noel? I want some confirmation on that before I consider those notes correct.

Out of curiosity, was the way you did it similar to the way I did it? Because I felt really silly finishing that challenge the way I did. 214A, 236B > (frog hit) > 236B, 5B > j.C > j.236A 2D > 5B > j.C > j.236A 2D > 5B > 6A > 236A > 5B > j.B > j.C > jc j.B > j.C > j.214C > land BBL > 236A 8D > 236A 8D > BBL > 236A > 236A 8D > 236A I feel like there are an infinite number of ways to potentially finish that challenge, and that most (if not all) of those ways are probably completely useless.

My Izayoi text file keeps growing and growing. Wheeeeee. I find myself always wanting to just teleport around the screen for fun.

If you block enough and the Terumi resorts to using the ground wheel thing to pull you closer to him, I believe Rachel can just jump and wind towards him for a punish. Not sure about this, though, as I'm merely making an assumption based on how it works with Izayoi when she's in mode. >_> You can definitely just jump out of that move, though.

Keep in mind that you can 6A her dashing overheads if you think she's going to do it raw. It's a dangerous option, but it exists. Her reversal super is 7 frames, so be careful what you do on oki. Izayoi has crap for defensive options without burning meter, so as long as you don't leave huge gaps in your blockstring or keep throwing in lows, she has literally no way out of pressure. Break her swords or dodge them. Don't block them. She gains stock from any blocked specials, and once she has a few stock in the bag, she can go on the offense immediately. In that same vein, since this match is so momentum based, it's not uncommon for Izayoi to start the round with overdrive, just to gain a couple stock to get going. Watch out where you summon things, because Izayoi can DP you out of the sky at various ranges, or teleport and throw you. Pumpkin approaches make this matchup far better for you, as she has no real answers to it aside from just getting out of the way.

It's pretty much a matter of delaying it a little, yeah. The timing window of the second 623B depends completely on the height of the opponent when you hit them with the first 623B. The lower they are, the more time you have to combo the second one. If they're too high when you catch them, then they'll tech before you can hit them with the second one. You can see this by changing the combo from 2A > 5B to 2A > 5C and checking how high they tech (it won't combo).

It's on the wiki, under the frame data section. Could be a bit hard to find if you're not sure what you're looking for. http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=Platinum_Frame_Data_(BBCP) The column you're looking for is aptly titled 'Starter'.

Doing a straight 2A > 623B makes the timing window for the second 623B absolutely enormous, as well, if you're looking for more lenient netplay variants of combos.

I like this double relaunch combo, but the execution on it is pretty strict. Not sure I'll really be using it in a match for a while.... (B Starter) > 5C > 236B > 214A > 2B > 5C > sj.B > delay j.A > j.C > land 5A > 5C > sj.B > delay j.A > j.C > land 5A > 623C > sj.B > jc j.C > j.D - 2991 damage, +4 stock

I don't think the 236C > 6D combos require any move changes against any of the characters. The timing on 6D varies a little, but if you just assume everyone is Azrael or someone else who requires precise timing, I think the combos work on everyone the same way. I was mostly wondering about how the different aerial hitboxes affected relaunch combos. Have you tried buffering the 2B input? Chances are that you're inputting 214A just fine, and inputting the 2B itself a little too late. Try holding down 2B during the end of the 214A teleport and see if you can get it. Don't wait for the teleport to completely finish before you start inputting the 2B.

Have you guys tested your combos on all of the cast? I know Rachel has a bit of a weird hitbox for Izayoi's relaunch combos, and can't always be picked up with 2B > 5C, depending on range. ~5.4k with +6 stock. Nice combo. I'd add it to my normal list of combos, but I can't seem to make it work consistently everywhere against everyone. Could just be execution error on my part. Does it work if you're carrying out of the corner? The landing 5A consistently goes off facing the wrong direction when I try this with my back to the corner against Jin. I've gotten it to work when I start from the midscreen and carry to the corner, but not outside of that yet. The slightly easier alternative I've been doing is this one. It doesn't run the risk of the reversed 5A midscreen, at least, lol: 6C (FC) > CT > dash 2C > 5C > 6C > 236B > 214A > 2B > 5C > sj.B > delay j.A > j.C > land 5A > 5C > 623C > sj.B > jc j.C > j.D > falling oki - 5273 dmg, +4 stock

I haven't played against Hakumen in this game as Rachel yet, but if it's similar to the older games, you don't really want to be in that range. Your options are a bit lacking at times if you find yourself stuck there, though. - You can try moving back, but if you don't have rods or the likes on the screen, then you're running the risk of him chasing you into the corner and keeping you locked down. - You can opt to move forward and aggress, which is a risky option, and you have to watch out for getting counterhit by him. - You can wait and let him come to you to block his pressure string. This is arguably the most passive and 'safe' option, but also gets you the least reward and could still net Hakumen a decent amount of damage if he breaks through your guard. - If you think he's going to have to move closer to try swording you again after he pressures a bit, you can try using 6B for a CH. Risky move with decent reward. It's pretty typical for people to opt to just block. The thing about it is, if you're stuck in a position where the opponent has a clear control over the situation, you're probably already caught in his pressure and have no choice but to wait it out. It's worth noting that you can barrier instant block to shove him further back so you can get a bit more space. I tend to forget this option myself.