farranpoison Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 i didnt doubt that, but shes not as exposed to tager like tsubaki and noel are. Uh, yes she is. Her normals are all basically the same range as Noel's and Tsubaki's are. The difference is that Noel's normals are all beaten by Tager's sledges and Tsubaki's normals are piss poor damage.
seyu Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 thats what i was trying to sayXD they both got serious disadvantages compared to makoto
farranpoison Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 Right. But that's the reason why Makoto is a 45-55 to Tager. See? Range screws her, though not as badly as Noel and Tsubaki.
Heroic_Legacy Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 (edited) What is a 'Safe approach' for Makoto vs Tager? Farran, you're arguing with a man who doesn't have the game. Seriously, this needs to stop. Edited November 2, 2010 by Heroic_Legacy
farranpoison Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 What is a 'Safe approach' for Makoto vs Tager? Farran, you're arguing with a man who doesn't have the game. Seriously, this needs to stop. Wat. I didn't even know. Also Heroic with the assist.
seyu Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 tsubaki has about the same and no mixup(literaly nothing thats worth it. u dont even get 2k for her overhead>_>) shes 45 too if tager is in his range to do damage makotos too. while makoto is even faster. both dont have decent blockstrings. which puts them in the same place up close. while makotos got more damage safe approach: asteroid vision C>barrier, asteroid vision C>j2C. the rest is yomi sadly>_> who dusnt have the game?
Zidane Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 (edited) Sorry you don't deserve any of my awards because you don't meet any of the criteria for them. Dodgejake dodging once again. K I just fucking read what those awards are for and you don't deserve any of them. Goddamn WC abusing power again. Edited November 2, 2010 by Zidane
farranpoison Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 SJ so handsome, you don't even know. tsubaki has about the same and no mixup(literaly nothing thats worth it. u dont even get 2k for her overhead>_>) shes 45 too if tager is in his range to do damage makotos too. while makoto is even faster. both dont have decent blockstrings. which puts them in the same place up close. while makotos got more damage safe approach: asteroid vision C>barrier, asteroid vision C>j2C. the rest is yomi sadly>_> who dusnt have the game? You seem to misunderstand. Tsubaki vs Tager is 35-65. Why? Because Tager can walk all over Tsubaki in terms of damage. Makoto has the same problems. No mixup, unsafe, short range. She's 45 though because if you do get a hit in, say hello to big damage. Also, stop saying 214C. It's terrible. Really, really terrible. Not even 214C Barrier is great, you're still at a disadvantage.
A.X.I.S. Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 tager vs jin is even? whoa! my mind is blown. it feels like its in jin's favor, I mean he can space tager and run away, he has 4 DP's, and he doesn't have to do anything really risky to do damage. am I underestimating my main!? someone explain!? my opinion of tsubaki vs tager. tsubaki goes blind and tager mash 720's.
OmniSScythe Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 What is a 'Safe approach' for Makoto vs Tager? Dash 2A, 6C or walking.
seyu Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 (edited) SJ so handsome, you don't even know. You seem to misunderstand. Tsubaki vs Tager is 35-65. Why? Because Tager can walk all over Tsubaki in terms of damage. Makoto has the same problems. No mixup, unsafe, short range. She's 45 though because if you do get a hit in, say hello to big damage. Also, stop saying 214C. It's terrible. Really, really terrible. Not even 214C Barrier is great, you're still at a disadvantage. i did indeed misreadXD stupid of me to build my argument on thatXD also: 214C :P i stated my points i guess. so we can stop this here before it escalatesXD oh i just saw omni posting and would have to wholeheartedly agree on dash 2A Edited November 2, 2010 by seyu
Spirit Juice Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 K I just fucking read what those awards are for and you don't deserve any of them. Goddamn WC abusing power again. Okay let's go down the list: Not staying free - well you probably deserve this one as much as I do Putting people on blast - see above Blowing it up - see above again; not very hard to get any of those if you live on EC Being a nice guy - I'm the nicest guy on DL. You're not very nice though. Being handsome - You definitely don't deserve this one. Being awesome - I'm pretty awesome. Not gonna lie. U mad? Yeh u mad.
Heroic_Legacy Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 I read 'Germany' so I forgot you could've imported the game. My bad. Regardless 214C is terribad. If I see a Makoto do 214Button my normal answer is now 360A. If they get caught, the second time they'll try 214B/C. Which is FATAL COUNTERED BY 2C. And if they barrier and do it, then I just 2C AC and 90% of the time it'll be an unblockable because you're so damn high in the air. Good shit to Omni posting something useful for the matchup.
ZONG_one Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 Being handsome - You definitely don't deserve this one. Hahaha. DAT WOLFMAN GERBER BABY.
OmniSScythe Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 Makoto has the same problems. No mixup, unsafe, short range. She's 45 though because if you do get a hit in, say hello to big damage. Also, stop saying 214C. It's terrible. Really, really terrible. Not even 214C Barrier is great, you're still at a disadvantage. Just to clear up a few things, her mixup is fine it's just usually missed used (use better blockstrings). 214B/C Barrier is a decent "in" against actual zoners like Lamb/Mu/Hazama/Haku, against anyone else is just giving anyway your freedom till you hit ground. 214C Barrier as an "exit" after using something unsafe(5CC) avoids everything (against every character) except reverse input atomic collider. Personally I'm not sure how MK vs TG is in Tager's favor "but the numbers are 100% correct", to clear one misunderstanding it's definitely not because of 360/720.
mAc Chaos Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 ^They're still open to people's opinions if they're not dumb. :P
Zidane Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 Being handsome - You definitely don't deserve this one. U mad? Yeh u mad. Sounds like u jealous. Wolfman Gerber baby has no problem finding victi---women.
zeth07 Posted November 2, 2010 Posted November 2, 2010 ^They're still open to people's opinions if they're not dumb. :P Except they said .5 differences were basically negligible. But a few .5 differences here and there could actually change tier placement. They are 100% correct though, so no discussion needed. You may only ask why it is what it is, but they won't change anything. That's just how they roll.
huey253 Posted November 3, 2010 Posted November 3, 2010 if i fixed it bang wouldn't be the best character but eh
SansProtocol Posted November 3, 2010 Posted November 3, 2010 (edited) Except they said .5 differences were basically negligible. But a few .5 differences here and there could actually change tier placement. They are 100% correct though, so no discussion needed. You may only ask why it is what it is, but they won't change anything. That's just how they roll. According to the chart updated today on the first page, characters would need at least 4 or 5 match-ups under question of a .5 difference in order to switch tiers. I wouldn't expect there to be that much of an error in the charts. Also, I would also say that character placement within a tier isn't that big of a deal. I put faith in the fact that the top players that put effort in these charts would know their characters and their match-ups better than most. Scrutinizing such details is pointless as these will never be absolutely perfect (humanly impossible) and most of these minute differences will be addressed later as the game develops. Edited November 3, 2010 by SansProtocol
currentlemon Posted November 3, 2010 Posted November 3, 2010 I still don't think that Rachel vs Tager is THAT bad of a match-up for her. But then again, I can't say anything.
Jason D. Posted November 3, 2010 Posted November 3, 2010 (edited) I'm a little concerned about the Rachel Haku matchup. I guess that slipped by me. 7-3 seems fishy. I know it's bad. But that bad? I'd give it 6.5. But what do I know about Rachel. Edit: I still don't think that Rachel vs Tager is THAT bad of a match-up for her. But then again, I can't say anything. I can! 5.5, tops. Tager is still a walking target. Edited November 3, 2010 by Jason D.
smooshman Posted November 3, 2010 Posted November 3, 2010 tager vs jin is even? whoa! my mind is blown. it feels like its in jin's favor, I mean he can space tager and run away, he has 4 DP's, and he doesn't have to do anything really risky to do damage. am I underestimating my main!? someone explain!? sledge goes through Jin's "zoning", 2D is made useless in neutral game and ice swords are the same deal, so Jin has to play close to Tager, as he has no real long range non projectile poke (his 5D, and 2D have projectile property), and has no good mid range pokes, besides JC. Even if 2D makes contact the 70p1 makes any combo after it pretty weak, but it can catch his backdash pretty well. 6B is nice throw bait. Jin also still has his old 5C>JB combo, with the edition of his JC. The biggest problem Jin really faces is that his abare off on CH is pretty bad at ranges he can comfortably attack tager (JC, 5C). It seems pretty even as a Jin player.
huey253 Posted November 3, 2010 Posted November 3, 2010 bang has more than 4 matchups that i feel have a difference of .5
A.X.I.S. Posted November 3, 2010 Posted November 3, 2010 sledge goes through Jin's "zoning", 2D is made useless in neutral game and ice swords are the same deal, so Jin has to play close to Tager, as he has no real long range non projectile poke (his 5D, and 2D have projectile property), and has no good mid range pokes, besides JC. Even if 2D makes contact the 70p1 makes any combo after it pretty weak, but it can catch his backdash pretty well. 6B is nice throw bait. Jin also still has his old 5C>JB combo, with the edition of his JC. The biggest problem Jin really faces is that his abare off on CH is pretty bad at ranges he can comfortably attack tager (JC, 5C). It seems pretty even as a Jin player. no tager is going to just react to jin's 2D if he is sledging it then its yomi, 5D on the other hand is a joke...lets not even talk about how many jin's I killed who used 5D and got hit. yes jin's damage is pretty weak but so is lambda, still doesn't keep jin from spacing tager and making him respect his 5C...5C is a silly CH fish on tager. I suppose its even because its closer to even more than it being a 6-4. thats the reason behind it I guess. but so is haku vs tager but that is a different subject. tao vs tager being 5.5 is wrong IMO...its closer to a 6 to me. also 5.5 on a chart that is trying to remove .5's...wtf is this?
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