BB:CS Match-Up Chart

[Black Onslaught]

Hazama can just 236D after a blocked 3C to make it +1, -4 if they IB which is safe if I remember right in BB

Ressenga is +2 on block, +8 if charged but you can punish it on reaction ( 5D with Haku, maybe 5A with other niggas )

[ZhePrime]

Haz's 3C is "unsafe" if it whiffs, like if it's slightly out of range, they jump, or do a low invincible move you'll probably eat it.

Also, 214D~A is not difficult to A spam out of, it doesn't require any specific timing really. All of Haz's overheads are pretty cruddy.

Jayjoku isn't a dragonpunch, you can't afford to use it as such either. It should only be used against moves with super long recovery or after you IB. It's no Inferno Divider, it doesn't clash with tons of stuff and cancel into itself (or something else), you usually don't have 50% additional Heat to RC it to make it safe, you can't avoid stuff like 720's with it, etc. Jayoku loses to more stuff than a normal DP would, heck it loses to other DP's (like say Litchi's).

It's good for what it does, but isn't some get-out-of-jail-for-free-card.

Hazama is at his weakest at midrange, he has no strong options there, only stuff that kinda works for lack of something better.

[Zidane]

Also, 214D~A is not difficult to A spam out of, it doesn't require any specific timing really. All of Haz's overheads are pretty cruddy.

A spam against 214DA only works if you predict the overhead. You can't see Hazama in the air doing his flip kick and think "Gee, I can punish this with 5A now!" If that were the case, everyone would mash out of Ragna's overhead(s) for free too.

Jayjoku isn't a dragonpunch, you can't afford to use it as such either.

No, that's exactly what it is. It's a DP with all the rewards and risks to it.

It should only be used against moves with super long recovery or after you IB.

I'm sorry but if I IB something and I have a DP... i'm gonna DP. Much like I would Hotenjin

It's no Inferno Divider, it doesn't clash with tons of stuff, you can't avoid stuff like 720's with it, etc. Jayoku loses to more stuff than a normal DP would, heck it loses to other DP's (like say Litchi's).

It's good for what it does, but isn't some get-out-of-jail-for-free-card.

Hotenjin either trades or wins against practically every move but a DP. And when it trades it's always in Hazama's favor since he still gets a combo. You CAN avoid stuff like 720s as long as you do it first ( just like everyone else because no one can punish 720 if Tager 720s first ). Invincible move loses to more invincible move, don't see why that's such a huge disadvantage against Hotenjin.

Hazama is at his weakest at midrange, he has no strong options there, only stuff that kinda works for lack of something better.

5B, 214DA/C, 5C, 2A, 5A, 236D. All strong options midrange. The only problem he has is against the few chars ( Ragna, Bang, Litchi, Haku ) who just happen to have better midrange pokes. In which case he uses D to get the position he wants. Hazama has no weakness; He just doesn't do AS good at midrange when up against the likes or a Ragna or Litchi.

[ZhePrime]

A spam against 214DA only works if you predict the overhead. You can't see Hazama in the air doing his flip kick and think "Gee, I can punish this with 5A now!" If that were the case, everyone would mash out of Ragna's overhead(s) for free too.

You can react to it, both I and people I face do it all the time. It's also far from being as good as a Gauntlet Hades.

It's slower (especially if you charge it for 25 frames), has worse hitbox and can only be done from a groundbased stance. You can ONLY combo after it if you net a CH or after 50 frames (if you time it perfectly). Only thing it has over GH really is the frame advantage.

No, that's exactly what it is. It's a DP with all the rewards and risks to it.

No, it's not. What especially hurts it are the active frames. Jayoku doesn't get you out of the same sitations as most other DP's get you out of and in fact loses to a lot of stuff, even other DP's.

It has a very specific purpose.

I'm sorry but if I IB something and I have a DP... i'm gonna DP. Much like I would Hotenjin

So people only DP after IB's? Wow, are we playing the same game?

Hotenjin either trades or wins against practically every move but a DP. And when it trades it's always in Hazama's favor since he still gets a combo

No actually, it does not. A lot, but far from everything.

Here's just a few examples of stuff it doesn't trade or beat in this vid (and they only show Distortions):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4HGRBeFWxxk

Bunch of that stuff say Inferno Divider can beat or clash with and simply do another Inferno Divider until you hit them.

And compared to another character that gets Heat easily as well (like Ragna) he can very often RC his DP's to make them safe, how often do you have 100% Heat as Hazama AND intend to use it like a normal DP? Not often.

Trying to take a chance and throw out a Jayoku at a prediction and have 50% additional Heat? Yeah, doesn't happen often.

5B, 214DA/C, 5C, 2A, 5A, 236D. All strong options midrange.

5B is not midrange, nor is 5C, 5A or 214D~C.

D, 236D and 3C are your options at midrange. None are great and only one, 3C, might lead into a combo at that range.

For you to grasp what mid-range is it's basically at the distance Hakumen can poke you with his 4C. Beyond that range is long range.

The only problem he has is against the few chars ( Ragna, Bang, Litchi, Haku ) who just happen to have better midrange pokes. In which case he uses D to get the position he wants.

Half the cast is better than Hazama at mid-range. Heck I'd almost say that Tager is better at mid-range than Hazama.

And do you honestly use D attacks so close to the enemy? Really?

Hazama has no weakness; He just doesn't do AS good at midrange when up against the likes or a Ragna or Litchi.

LOL, well you heard it here first folks.

[mundus]

^ Cba quoting the previous post, his a overhead is always comboable except if your opponent doesn't duck, who gets hit by an overhead while standing? Houtenjin loses only to moves which gives your opponent invulnerability, but nobody throws them during block strings since they are usually unsafe, its not a real DP but a very good reversal cause of IB, it can be used as a "DP" to, but it trades with a lot of things, however unless Hazama dies its always worth the trade. Hazama is a zoner so his midrange game can always be managed cause its so easy for him to reposition, his normals are quite good up close though, not Ragna and Bang good, but still awfully good for a zoner. Also his damage is sick, its meter dependent, but when he has meter its godlike, like 5k out of anything.

[ZhePrime]

^ Cba quoting the previous post, his a overhead is always comboable except if your opponent doesn't duck, who gets hit by an overhead while standing?

Try doing 214D~A at mid-range, you will be out of range if you don't charge it.

Houtenjin loses only to moves which gives your opponent invulnerability, but nobody throws them during block strings since they are usually unsafe

Baiting Jayoku is possible, you know.

And my point was that you cannot afford to throw around Jayoku willy-nilly, you use if after a move with a lot of recovery or after IB.

I mean really, if you have 50% heat are you willing to gamble (like on wake-up) with a Jayoku? You really shouldn't.

its not a real DP but a very good reversal cause of IB

As I said, it's not a DP. But it is a great reversal and good to use mid-combo to extend the combo.

it can be used as a "DP" to, but it trades with a lot of things, however unless Hazama dies its always worth the trade.

A DP has more uses than using it during a blockstring.

Hazama is a zoner so his midrange game can always be managed cause its so easy for him to reposition,

My point is that Hazama isn't good at mid-range, thus you shouldn't be at mid-range, he's at his best at long and mid-range.

It's usually best to jump/dash back or forward and attack from there.

his normals are quite good up close though, not Ragna and Bang good, but still awfully good for a zoner. Also his damage is sick, its meter dependent, but when he has meter its godlike, like 5k out of anything.

Eh, his normals aren't that great. His pressure is bad and his mixup is meh (2 passable overheads and 2 lows + a short ranged command grab mostly used to get heat).

His offense isn't mindblowing, but it works.

[Lord Knight]

wtf is your concept of ranges

play a real hazama

[Guardian]

If you can't IB~hotenjin, then Hazama becomes high-mid/A tier. If you can, then he becomes S.

236D and 5D~A solves his problems of mid range poking. 236D is probably the most slept on move in his entire arsenal. It's safe, knocks them away on CH or if they're launched, and CH in the corner gives him 5k+ if you have a super.

His pressure isn't great, but if you're creative and have them guessing, he has some pretty good shenanigans that can really confuse people.

He can get damage from anywhere on the screen and can be incredibly safe. You can't really jump at him, nor can anyone keep him from running like a madman. I'm not sure if I agree with him being the strongest fundamental character right now, but I'm sure I could be persuaded.

[ZhePrime]

wtf is your concept of ranges

Should be fairly obvious, but generally it's like this:

Short - Usually where punches fly and for most the ideal range for starting a combo.

Mid - This is where people usually throw out their pokes.

Long - This is where most zoning and projectile spam happens and where pokes cease to reach your opponent.

For Hazama, short range is where his 5B/5C/etc. attacks will reach and long range is where his chains produce enough hitstun to follow up with a combo. Mid is the space inbetween.

Here's an image as well that shows generally what ranges I consider what

play a real hazama

No idea what you mean by that.

[FlyingVe]

This argument is really going around in circles. The fact is, in the areas where Hazama "isn't great," he is still quite good. His only true weakness, is the lack of a good, meterless, defensive option. He is easily among the best characters in the game. Personally, I agree with the S- placement as he doesn't have as much OP BS as Bang or Litchi, and can't "oops I win" like Arakune.

[smooshman]

Houtenjin loses only to moves which gives your opponent invulnerability, but nobody throws them during block strings since they are usually unsafe

super flash buffer.

[BladeOfJustice7]

Hazama has shit medium range, his only medium range attack in jakou, which you can barely combo with and does messily 450 damage. Hazama excels at close and long range, more so close range.

His lack of medium range is why he can't punish tech rolls. Put him at real mid range against hakumen and tell me who will win.

[FlyingVe]

His lack of medium range is why he can't punish tech rolls.

What? Hazama has some of the best Tech-roll punishing in the game. Even is he is a bit weak at midrange, his chain pretty much let him be at whatever range he wants.

[smooshman]

his chain pretty much let him be at whatever range he wants.

except chains can't go backwards, so he has to get close, so characters like hakumen face rape him at that range since he can readily stuff his chains and void them, so Hazama has to spiderman his way up and away.

[mundus]

Hazama has shit medium range, his only medium range attack in jakou, which you can barely combo with and does messily 450 damage. Hazama excels at close and long range, more so close range.

His lack of medium range is why he can't punish tech rolls. Put him at real mid range against hakumen and tell me who will win.

Err, he probably has the best anti tech roll in the game, save for Tager with a buffered 720.

[Skye]

I always saw Hazama as A or A+ tier.

But that's still going by his match up info, he don't seem to have any match ups substantially in his favor, besides Tager and maybe Lambda, of course they all look slight advantage if not even save for an obvious few.

There's also no real counter for Hazama.

Sounds a lot like CT Jin.

*Good at everything, only downer is that a few characters are just better*

[g.Bauer]

I always saw Hazama as A or A+ tier.

But that's still going by his match up info, he don't seem to have any match ups substantially in his favor, besides Tager and maybe Lambda, of course they all look slight advantage if not even save for an obvious few.

There's also no real counter for Hazama.

Sounds a lot like CT Jin.

*Good at everything, only downer is that a few characters are just better*

Couldn't agree more.

[BladeOfJustice7]

What? Hazama has some of the best Tech-roll punishing in the game. Even is he is a bit weak at midrange, his chain pretty much let him be at whatever range he wants.

Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the ouroboros hitstun stop at mid range?

And tech roll in mid screen punishment is just as good in the corner? Correct me where I'm wrong, maybe i missed something watching matches.

EDIT:

I always saw Hazama as A or A+ tier.

But that's still going by his match up info, he don't seem to have any match ups substantially in his favor, besides Tager and maybe Lambda, of course they all look slight advantage if not even save for an obvious few.

There's also no real counter for Hazama.

Sounds a lot like CT Jin.

*Good at everything, only downer is that a few characters are just better*

Isn't hakumen a bad match up for him?

[FlyingVe]

Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the ouroboros hitstun stop at mid range?

And tech roll in mid screen punishment is just as good in the corner? Correct me where I'm wrong, maybe i missed something watching matches.

His midscreen oki isn't as bullet proof as his corner game, but you can't tech roll towards him for fear of 2A (duh), for back tech he has chains, chain follow-ups, and 3C. Not perfect, but better than what most characters have.

Yes the hitstop stops midrange, though he can still be a jerk with the snakes. At midrange he can do a dash2A which is very fast, or poke with 3C and jakou, or even IAD 2C/jB, but most likely he will just fire a chain and spiderman away. It's just that his weakness at midrange is negated by how hard it is to keep him at mid-range.

[Skye]

Isn't hakumen a bad match up for him?

I doubt it's a bad match up, it's probably even with a change of strategy.

I mean, sure Hakumen can cut snakes, but Hazama has full control over them, they don't have to go full screen, or take him anywhere, he can cancel them and determine where he wants them to stop to pull him wherever.

And the barrier isn't that big a deal.

[Alzarath]

eh, it's 5.5 haku favor at worst

[huey253]

eh, i always saw Hazama as B+ tier.

he's well rounded and all, but its pretty hard to question that

he is not as good as Hakumen.

what i'm thinking right now is...

S tier:Litchi, Bang

S-tier: Ragna, Arakune

A tier: Hakumen, Carl, Makato

and from then on not soo important.

Hazama gets messed up by top and A tier with the exception of arakune i believe.

[HiagoX]

what i'm thinking right now is...

S tier:Litchi, Bang

S-tier: Ragna, Arakune

A tier: Hakumen, Carl, Makato

and from then on not soo important.

Yeah no.

[FlyingVe]

eh, it's 5.5 haku favor at worst

Sounds about right, but probably closer to even. Alot of this "Haku is a bad matchup" talk comes from back when Hazama was still being figured out as a character. He was still B tier then (lol), he's gotten alot better with time.

[Alzarath]

that's why I said "at worst" =p