[CS1] Mu-12 vs Hakumen

[Sophisticat]

Well, for what it's worth, one of the reasons this is closer to 5-5 (if anything slight edge Haku), is that Haku can counter the laser (easy to do since laser timing is very predictable), and grab you. This really hurts her approach and limits many of her oki options. Basically Haku can get zoned well by the lasers, but it never truly amounts to a safe way to get in on him.

Can't you attack just before the laser hits? If I attempt D, I have to guess your approach since I can't counter both high and low. Also, if you anticipate him using D, can't you blow up the Steins -> combo?

Counters are very risky to use, a good Haku will only use them on reaction or good yomi sense. They work more as a deterrent for reckless approaches and dumb blockstrings; they do their job if they make the other guy scared of doing anything.

Once you understand that, D counters are hardly scary unless the Haku is exceptionally good with them.

I find this to be a bad match due to the amount of work Haku has to do while still being zoned. It might potentially be 5-5, but Mu isn't the one breaking a sweat.

[FlyingVe]

If you are anywhere near him, and he D's a laser, he will goink Mu. Since the laser hits mid, Haku doesn't have to guess, and since the laser timing is predetermined, he doesn't have to react either.

[pulsr]

I kinda do like it when he gets the orb, gives the Mu player time to start mashing 6Ds on him because they want to sit there and be like dur dur i'm building meter. And you go dur dur i'm going to take away 4 Primers. Mu has a lot of ways to make Haku move. Mu's mobility can take advantage of this quite well.

[C0R]

I just lost to the fabled downback xN himself for an hour straight. Totalled something like 6-31

Help.

No seriously, the critical component that kept blowing me up was that Spark is bloody impossible to break. Everything from Voiding bursts to enma'ing through lasers. Block. More Block. I know the guy is one of the best Hakumen in the field, but ouch. My matchup experience against Haku is just straight zoning, Magatama doesn't help if he can't close to use them.

Maybe I need to use more grabs, because it felt like my entire normal game was a collection of wet noodles against the great wall of china. My usual scheme is to force Hakumen to move through zoning, then capitalize on the fact that the only place to move is a deathtrap.

Yet every single application of pressure or guard primer destruction just got gobbled by 2d, void or enma. I'm rather lost. Kinda feel like I got mega trolled.

I wish I had videos to show you guys, but we didn't stream.

Edited November 28, 2010 by C0R

[Aginor]

Match up wise, mix up your blockstrings. You can try and wait for hakumen to do something and until then, just zone. Thing is, it's already hard to get in on hakumen since his normals pretty much outrange every single normal you have but 6c. I wouldn't recommend poking with 6c but it's ok once in a blue moon. If hakumen, is close up you can DP but if he tries a jump in, be careful as Mu's DP tends to clash with moves like hakumen's j.2c.

In terms of Spark, he techs throws on reaction. You should probably only do it once in a while just to throw him off. Since he pretty much IBs every single thing, all the more reason to do stagger blockstrings and mix it up between them. All he does is wait until he finds a hole to punish you and he'll do it because he IBs which makes it possible for him. You'll prolly need to upgrade fundamentals as well against him. Try to land a hit and do setups. I don't know if Spark knows them but it's worth a try.

I'm actually quite envious you get to play Spark. lol I'm pretty sure you'll learn a lot from him.

[C0R]

I'm really the only Mu player in the local Pacific Northwest Scene, from what I can tell, and I just started taking baby steps into top-end play. As a result I get quite a few people looking to play me for matchup experience in casuals.

I've definitely taken steps to become less predictable in general from playing him. I feel like there's gaps and easily punishable problems with my gameplay, yet that's not what I hear from feedback in casuals. The biggest issue I keep dying to is that I feel conditioned to attack in a certain way, one that gets me killed. I'm not sure how to avoid this, though I started breaking away from that in the later matches. I feel like I have "sticky fingers" most of the time, and working out the rough patches will definitely help.

The one bit I did learn from him, when we talked about the matches, was that while Hakumen can deal with Steins, he can't actually punish them. The matches I did win where very dependent on jumping out > j.5D > airdash away after a failed blocksting. The stein tracks Hakumen if he IAD's to follow, and you're out of range of Hotaru if you space it right.

Edit: Sorry, I edited this like nine times while you might've been posting, it just never came out right.

Edited November 28, 2010 by C0R

[Aginor]

Well if it tracks, he could just make more big orbs with j.2a I'd imagine. But yea he shouldn't be able to punish iad.b j.xD. But just cause he has an orb out doesn't mean you can't set up other steins, it just means that you have to wait longer for the orb to disappear. That's how I see it.

If you're conditioned to attack a certain way, only thing I can say is change up your playstyle or play exactly like Spark, defensive and reactionary.

[FlyingVe]

I tend to zone Haku more with 214D than the traditional laser zoning. Once Haku gets a feel for the lasers, they get cut with alarming frequency. On that note once you've knocked him away (I usually choose this against haku) 6D>4D>214D works quite well. The fat and/or dash-less characters have a hard time dealing with this from full screen.

Also, while getting in on Haku is super hard, he doesn't have a great way of getting in on you either. As long as you don't over do the steins you should be able to 2C/6A him mot times.

Regarding throws. Throws are super easy to tech (offline) but there are still some mixup tactics that you can use to try and land one. Here's a few off the top of my head:

1)Frame trap into throw. Mu's 2B is a fairly weak frame trap, but better players will respect it most times. If you can call when/if the will try to mash out, you get a counter throw.

2)2A>5A(wiff)>throw. This is a bit of a gimmick, but the idea is to get them to hit buttons by wiffing the 5A.

3)Abuse patterns. For example, do 2A>pause>2A a bunch, and then mix in throw. If they hit buttons they will get thrown. This also works in reverse, attempt the throw alot and then go for a normal (like 2B or 3C).

In short, lame it up against Haku.

Edited November 28, 2010 by FlyingVe

[TD]

still having trouble keeping him off of me.

honestly this is my worst up EVER right above ragna.

l just lose all hope when l fight this stupid tin can uuuuuuuuugh

[FlyingVe]

Well, if you IB you can backdash most of his stuff, that's my usual plan of escape (you can backdash alot on normal block as well). If that's not working out, just block him until he will be forced to take action to stay in range, and then attempt to get out.

I feel you though, one screw up and he does soooo much damage... It's just like Ragna, Carl, and Litchi.

[MainG_Jago]

not sure if i can put this here but oh well

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MuCRjst4STE

for the record i clearly have no idea how to use Mu