[CS1] Mu-12 vs Noel

[Aginor]

Discuss the Noel match up here.

Edited May 10, 2011 by Aginor

[Ryujinflame]

Does this matchup turn into a knockdown + steins setup type match? I was playing a really solid Noel yesterday, and the only thing I could do to keep him out was j.2c and 623C. I imagine it gets a lot better if Noel can be kept at long range, but stein setup without knockdown seems risky because of her sheer speed and fishing to land a 6C sounds potentially bad too.

Also, anything to watch out for by trying to 5C her ground dashing? Thanks for any help in this matchup.

[Big Red Tie]

zone with C

don't get tripped

[Aginor]

No you don't zone. If Noel has 50 meter, if she catches you summoning multiple Steins, or if you do 236d out of nowhere, you eat a free air super from noel. Zoning only works if Noel doesn't have 50 meter. Considering how she gets 50 meter in pretty much one combo and does a lot of damage in that process, you'll want to be careful.

But yea, once noel has 50 meter, you should look for an opening and start rushing down against noel.

[Silfer]

No you don't zone. If Noel has 50 meter, if she catches you summoning multiple Steins, or if you do 236d out of nowhere, you eat a free air super from noel. Zoning only works if Noel doesn't have 50 meter. Considering how she gets 50 meter in pretty much one combo and does a lot of damage in that process, you'll want to be careful.

But yea, once noel has 50 meter, you should look for an opening and start rushing down against noel.

Isnt the air super unsafe on whiff? cant you bait it?

[Aginor]

My friend tried a random 236d on me when I was playing noel. I reaction air supered any 236d. It's not really super unsafe and it's hard to bait when a person can just punish you on reaction with it.

[KojinSagara]

shes too damn fast. the noel i was playing was able to use the slide under move when I tried to place stiens on wakeup or long range to avoid most of the lasers and knock me down many times preventing follow ups. you got to zone with C as well as you can and dont get put in a corner so she doesnt get that gay loop from there. I actually did better with her than with lambda which saddens me a bit but whatever. i probably need to readjust my stein placements and confine them to one on oki. I think it may end up being in mu's favor eventually...

[Big Red Tie]

No you don't zone. If Noel has 50 meter, if she catches you summoning multiple Steins, or if you do 236d out of nowhere, you eat a free air super from noel. Zoning only works if Noel doesn't have 50 meter. Considering how she gets 50 meter in pretty much one combo and does a lot of damage in that process, you'll want to be careful.

But yea, once noel has 50 meter, you should look for an opening and start rushing down against noel.

No you don't zone. If Noel has 50 meter, if she catches you summoning multiple Steins, if you do 236d

zone. Steins, d

zone with C

!!

[Aginor]

Stop twisting my words and read closer. Zone when Noel doesn't have 50 meter. And I never said "Steins, d" But ok, if you zone all day have fun eating air supers from noel and taking massive damage. It's like getting shot by Lambda's swords on reaction, except this is an air super. which only goes in one trajectory.

[Silfer]

My friend tried a random 236d on me when I was playing noel. I reaction air supered any 236d. It's not really super unsafe and it's hard to bait when a person can just punish you on reaction with it.

point taken

[Synthesis]

Can't you bait her air super by just zoning all day and canceling stein placement on reaction by jumping if she does an air super to punish? The same reason you wouldn't spam 236D in this matchup if she has meter is the same reason you wouldn't spam it if Tager had a sparkbolt stocked up. If you spam stein placement intelligently, she'll have to run in to hit you, in which case you'll have to play defensive or poke her out to keep her from hitting you. There is a problem with this, though.

IAD air super is really good. If she IAD's at you, just block or backdash away. Don't try to anti-air because any good Noel worth their salt is going to have already buffered in the super so they can hit it if they see you try and anti-air them. This leads to stupid damage, you being knocked down, and then getting rushed down for a bit.

EDIT: By spamming 236D in this matchup, I mean don't use it if she has meter. Just use the regular steins to inflict damage and take away primers.

This match just revolves around being patient when Noel has meter. If they're a bad Noel, feel free to rock their face without any effort.

[Ryujinflame]

Thanks for all the advice so far. The air super and the ability to do it off IAD is good to bring up - I started practicing combos from Air Throw -> RC because I thought her short air range might come into play, but now I'm not so sure about it. Guess I'll just aim for intelligent zoning when Noel's meterless and rushdown once she has access to her Drive.

Could the Air Throw combos still be effective if you're close enough to her so she can't launch her super fast enough?

[FlyingVe]

If you've already fired the 236D, and noel does her super, the laser will knock her out of it before much damage is dealt. Unfortunately, you get stuck in this weird falling animation as the game waits for the missile strike that isn't coming. The noel I did it too was to stupefied to counter attack, but noel probably can, so, I'm not sure how useful this is.

[TD]

l actually find Noel easy. This matchup is all about Mu's specialty: mindgames. Don't do anything like stein stein stein stein without checking your surroundings. Condition her to stay precautious of approaching you, then summon until she tries to run you up.

And that's how l approach this matchup. l like 3c in this match, it catches an approaching Noel. Not to be abused though due to 2d, if at all but it works for me.

Mu is turning more and more into CT Rachel.

[Big Red Tie]

Stop twisting my words and read closer. Zone when Noel doesn't have 50 meter. And I never said "Steins, d" But ok, if you zone all day have fun eating air supers from noel and taking massive damage. It's like getting shot by Lambda's swords on reaction, except this is an air super. which only goes in one trajectory.

how am i twisting your words when i took all those from the quote of what you said?

i do not think you consider zoning the same thing that i do.

[KojinSagara]

l actually find Noel easy. This matchup is all about Mu's specialty: mindgames. Don't do anything like stein stein stein stein without checking your surroundings. Condition her to stay precautious of approaching you, then summon until she tries to run you up.

And that's how l approach this matchup. l like 3c in this match, it catches an approaching Noel. Not to be abused though due to 2d, if at all but it works for me.

Mu is turning more and more into CT Rachel.

at first people i know didn't think she was that good but man learn a few setups and the story changes badly. shes probably A tier imo

[Remius]

l actually find Noel easy. This matchup is all about Mu's specialty: mindgames. Don't do anything like stein stein stein stein without checking your surroundings. Condition her to stay precautious of approaching you, then summon until she tries to run you up.

And that's how l approach this matchup. l like 3c in this match, it catches an approaching Noel. Not to be abused though due to 2d, if at all but it works for me.

Mu is turning more and more into CT Rachel.

Absolutely. My thoughts exactly. She has some of the same approach strageties, and can put out retarded amounts of damage on counter hit.

Yeah alot of mu matchups that go in my favor seem to go that way when you find ways to actually make them scared of you. You have to find ways to let out Steins -- dont be obvious with them, it's only going to get you killed. But the moment they hesitate, Stein them to hell. It isn't long before they're eating damage and have no primers left. If getting in is becoming difficult, i always throw in a 263D for insurance.