Learning the Game

[brainof7]

What is the best way to go about learning the game. I have been going through the story on beginner mode to unlock stuff, but I want to actually get in to the meat of the game. I have tried challenge mode on a few different characters who I though I might like to play, but they are all really difficult at some early point. I also tried the tutorial mode, where I got stuck when the game was trying to get me to fatal counter 3C, 5d >> 5d >> 5d string, which I cannot do. I just feel very frustrated because the game expects me to make huge leaps in what I am able to do. I spent 3 Hours(!) on the bang challenge where it requires you to do some normal combo (believe it was 5C, 2C, 2B, 623B, Super) into his 2363214C Super, and I couldn't do it at all. The game is really cool, but I can't understand how to get to a point where I can actually control a character and understand how they work and be able to do stuff with them. I never played CT, and I got this game when it first came out and have played about an hour a day, many times with friends and the game just degenerates into mash fests. Any help anyone?

Thanks,

brainof7

[mAc Chaos]

Well, it actually doesn't come quickly. It takes a lot of work; it's like learning an instrument. But after a while you break through a point where it all becomes natural and you can do things without thinking about them.

I'd say first and foremost, pick one character. The characters are all so different you can't really learn them all at once. You have to focus on one. Then learn their moves, and actually remember them so you know when to use what. Also go into training mode and practice doing their special moves until you can do them consistently. When I tried to learn new moves or combos I'd try to do them like 10 times in a row. If I couldn't do it almost 10 times then that means I didn't have it down yet.

Also you have to be deliberate in your actions. Don't panic and just mash buttons. Think through what you want to do clearly and take your time. It's OK if you mess up the first few times because of it as eventually you'll be able to nail the moves you need to when you're thinking clearly.

The #1 thing you need is perseverance.

Since you're a beginner, I suggest picking up Ragna. He's the most "normal" character. When you feel comfortable doing his moves, move onto some basic combos. Oh, and to do that you have to learn the combo notation people use online.

[Skye]

1. Lurk the forums, preferably the character you want to play.

2. Get a run down on combos and match ups.

3. Go into training mode to hone your execution.

4. Start playing human opponents.

5. Continue lurking for new info.

6. Repeat steps 3-5 when necessary.

[brainof7]

That is what I have been doing mostly, it just doesn't seem to be clicking at all. I played Hakumen for about 2 and a half weeks and gave up on him when I couldn't figure out any combos at all (besides very very basic ones). I don't want to spend 3+ hours a day in training mode to try and learn combos on a character, esp. when it takes me that 3 hours just to learn 1 link or something. I am going to go back to Ragna I guess, but what I am asking is if there is a better way to ease yourself into the game. I come from SFII, where combos aren't a big deal and it is more about understanding your character. Just learning my character's moves (easy, takes about an hour to get everything down to a pretty decent level) doesn't help me with combos at all.

[Skye]

1. Lurk the forums, preferably the character you want to play.

2. Get a run down on combos and match ups.

3. Go into training mode to hone your execution.

4. Start playing human opponents.

5. Continue lurking for new info.

6. Repeat steps 3-5 when necessary.

You don't have to go through the trouble of figuring out your own combos. Some exist already.

[brainof7]

well, not that I am trying to discover a combo, but I will go on the forums and look one up that says "easy bnb". I will look at videos of it, and try to do it piece by piece and take 3 hours to only get part of the combo down.

[farranpoison]

It's called practice.

Do it.

[Skye]

Well, if a character's too hard to learn, there's always Bang.

[brainof7]

I feel like I am having more of a hard time understanding how the game works, because it takes me so long to figure out 1 tiny thing on the few characters that I have tried. All my "practice" doesn't really go anywhere, because I spend more time getting frustrated that I can't do a single that I am trying to do because my timing isn't right or w/e. Even when I am watching a video I don't get it. That is why I am trying to find out if there is a good way to ease myself into the game rather than sit around failing the same combo link for the 100th time in 1 sitting. There has to be some way to start small and work up but everything I have seen is just "this does this and this does this, and when you put it all together you have this gigantic 15 hit combo that is going to take the newer players 20+ hours to even pull off in training mode (much less a match) and BTW this is the easy BnB one"

[farranpoison]

Pick Ragna.

5B > 5C > 214A > 214D.

Should take you about five seconds to learn. If you still can't do that, then you're playing the wrong game.

[Skye]

There's a tutorial mode in the game if you can't understand how it works.

Other than that, your execution needs refining. There's no "get decent quick" trick. Pick a character, practice them.

[smooshman]

go to character select>pick Ragna>push buttons>win

seriously, since you said you were going to play bang, figure out his stuff, learn his combos, his footsies, etc.

it just takes time, also challenge mode combos are generall harder than your characters BnB's (basic combos), and learning from challenge mode is imo actually harder than just reading them.

[brainof7]

Pick Ragna.

5B > 5C > 214A > 214D.

Should take you about five seconds to learn. If you still can't do that, then you're playing the wrong game.

At what point do I take really basic combos like this and try to play people to learn the game though? Anything harder than this and I just can't do it, but I can do stuff like this no problem. I was trying out Bang just because he seemed like fun, but when most of his combos revolve around his 623B move and I was having issues getting it out and I was having a hard time learning his general playstyle in general I decided I didn't want to play him. Ragna is ok, I think I might try him out for a while. looking at the BnBs though, the quoted combo is literally the only one I can do. Granted I haven't really tried to learn Ragna that much, but the problem is the huge jump from "easy you can do it on the first try" to "lol have fun while you hate yourself for the next 20 hours of practice!!!!"

Also, I assume arcade mode is the opposite of helpful for learning the game?

[farranpoison]

1. Go to training mode.

2. Practice one combo over and over again.

3. ????

4. PROFIT

5. Move on to the next combo.

Repeat steps 1-5.

Also, Arcade mode is horrid for learning higher levels of gameplay, but for a beginner it isn't too bad to go there and mess with combos.

But seriously, practice, practice, practice. This is a fighting game. Practice comes with the territory. You can't get magically better at the game overnight. This is precisely the reason why people would rather play FPS games then fighting games, because you have to practice a lot, and people are lazy.

[mAc Chaos]

Yeah, you say you don't want to do training mode, but you need to. Also 2 weeks is barely any time at all to get good at a character. Give it 3 months.

Also it's perfectly normal to struggle with combos, etc. Just takes practice. For Haku's falling C combo I wasn't able to do it until six or seven months after I got the game. Everyone starts where you are, so don't think you're bad or that everyone else just magically picks up the game and does everything easily.

I come from SF2 as well; there's actually quite a few similarities, you just have to see them since they are presented differently. The separate moves of the characters still matter and you still need to understand them. It's just that in this game after you land that one move you can get more damage out of it since it goes into a combo once you hit.

Playing with others is a good way to get better and get experience while having fun.

[brainof7]

I wasn't saying 2 weeks was enough to get good. But two weeks should be enough to get down a couple combos with a couple of hours of practice a day. I am saying I don't want to spend 3 hours a day in practice mode just to get past the barrier to actually playing the game! If I spent three months in practice mode at 3 hours a day, I would probably be able to do some combos but then I would be terrible at actually playing the game. I have no problems with practice mode, but I want to make sure I am

1. Learning the game as efficiently as I can

2. Not screwing my game over in some other way by not doing certain things

3. Not getting into a game that is going to have some really unrealistic time commitment just to be able to play higher than button mashing

[Osuna]

This isn't for everyone, but my solution was to learn the grapplers when I ran into this same trouble almost 10 years ago. I really couldn't grasp how to make use of all my options and every tiny thing I did learn wasn't easy for me to make use of and only very slightly increased my returns.

My solution was to play characters who do a lot of damage off individual hits and often had higher hp. It was satisfying to learn something new because it translated to really easy to see improvement in my gameplay, which I think is the most satisfying and addictive part of fighting games, for me at least.

I'm pretty set in grapplers because of my history with them. It's not like I regret it, but if you learned Ragna or bang you'd gain more transferable skills and fundamentals. Your hands will gain more precision if you keep trying. An hour a day like that adds up over time. I have mild cerebral palsy and it took me a long time, but my speed and precision of input has leveled up a lot. I just loved the games and enjoyed every step I made. I still remember how excited I was when I was first able to do my first special move motion.

[mAc Chaos]

Oh, in that case. First, get your execution down. You still need training mode to do your basic moves. Learn those basic combos and use them in your matches with your friends. You don't NEED to learn the super complicated combos yet. You learn them as you go. Eventually the basic combos will be second nature, and all you'll have to do is add a few moves here or there to them to learn the more advanced combos, so it'll be easier, and by then you should be more comfortable with the ins and outs of the game.

Having someone else to play with is good since you can both get better together.

[brainof7]

I think I can do special inputs just fine, the only things I sometimes have trouble with are the supers which are like 632146 because I skip the control stick over one of the inputs. I also understand that the basic idea is A>B>C>D to do basic stuff, and I am trying to play more.

As far as basic > advanced combos go, it seems that there is 1 or 2 basic combos on every character, and then everything gets much much harder. There doesn't seem to be anywhere to branch off from like you are saying. Like if one combo has Stuff > Combo Piece > More Stuff there isn't anywhere that says "learn these easier combo pieces and get good at them, the learn this also easyish combo piece and get good at it, and then you just have to add a few more moves in and you can do more stuff". It is all here is combo A (4 moves). Here is combo B (17 moves) with nothing to help anyone who is stuck trying to bridge that gap. If I could learn combo bits and practice them in play and then slowly add stuff in, that is what I have been looking for!!! I don't mind practicing an hour a day in practice mode to get the combo bits down till I can do them without thinking, it is just that when I am told "this is an easy combo, learn it" and it takes forever to get down the first hard link that it gets too hard to do in 1 day and I can't do it. Is there anywhere that breaks down the more complicated combos into their shorter versions for practice? (I have scoured the combo threads, and would honestly main whichever character the community had done that for) and is there a place to go to find practice partners for online play or something? (bit later down the road but it would be good I think).

[lxMetalSonicxl]

Lrn2dp

Pick Ragna-kun.

[mAc Chaos]

Well, take Ragna for instance.

You have 5B > 5C > 214A > 214D as a basic one.

But you could get more damage out of that by doing 5B > 2B > 5C > 2C > 214A > 214D, instead.

You're right, a lot of the more advanced combos have parts that you can't break apart, but focus on the basics first. Just take it one step at a time. You don't need more advanced combos until you fight better opponents anyway.

As for players... well, there's IRL friends, there's people on PSN and XBL, and folks on Dustloop. There's places where people gather offline to play too, but those are few and far between, so you'd have to be lucky to live near such a place. Go to the matchfinder forum here to see if there's anything nearby. Playing with your personal friends is fine too. Right now you just need people to play against so you can get comfortable implementing what you're learning.

[Osuna]

I think I can do special inputs just fine, the only things I sometimes have trouble with are the supers which are like 632146 because I skip the control stick over one of the inputs. I also understand that the basic idea is A>B>C>D to do basic stuff, and I am trying to play more.

As far as basic > advanced combos go, it seems that there is 1 or 2 basic combos on every character, and then everything gets much much harder. There doesn't seem to be anywhere to branch off from like you are saying. Like if one combo has Stuff > Combo Piece > More Stuff there isn't anywhere that says "learn these easier combo pieces and get good at them, the learn this also easyish combo piece and get good at it, and then you just have to add a few more moves in and you can do more stuff". It is all here is combo A (4 moves). Here is combo B (17 moves) with nothing to help anyone who is stuck trying to bridge that gap. If I could learn combo bits and practice them in play and then slowly add stuff in, that is what I have been looking for!!! I don't mind practicing an hour a day in practice mode to get the combo bits down till I can do them without thinking, it is just that when I am told "this is an easy combo, learn it" and it takes forever to get down the first hard link that it gets too hard to do in 1 day and I can't do it. Is there anywhere that breaks down the more complicated combos into their shorter versions for practice? (I have scoured the combo threads, and would honestly main whichever character the community had done that for) and is there a place to go to find practice partners for online play or something? (bit later down the road but it would be good I think).

Most characters, and my most I mean all I can think of off the top of my head, have recurring combo mechanics. For example pretty much anything ragna does can lead to double berial edge so you can transfer learning that in just one of his combos to pretty much all of the future combo you learn.

[brainof7]

Well, take Ragna for instance.

You have 5B > 5C > 214A > 214D as a basic one.

But you could get more damage out of that by doing 5B > 2B > 5C > 2C > 214A > 214D, instead.

You're right, a lot of the more advanced combos have parts that you can't break apart, but focus on the basics first. Just take it one step at a time. You don't need more advanced combos until you fight better opponents anyway.

As for players... well, there's IRL friends, there's people on PSN and XBL, and folks on Dustloop. There's places where people gather offline to play too, but those are few and far between, so you'd have to be lucky to live near such a place. Go to the matchfinder forum here to see if there's anything nearby. Playing with your personal friends is fine too. Right now you just need people to play against so you can get comfortable implementing what you're learning.

Thanks man. Where do you find stuff like that which shows the basic form of the combo and then the more advanced one? I can't find anything like it in the combo threads. I will try and play some games though, matchfinder threads are pretty cool. Thanks a bunch

I wish there was a place that said:

Learn these (maybe 3ish) combos, go practice and play

once you are comfortable learn these ones

and so on

[zreb]

You can also find pieces of information that might lead to understanding how a character should play by looking at character specific matchup threads. For instance, I started off playing Hakumen, and almost every matchup is like "Hey, 4C him!" At first I wasn't sure how exactly one was supposed to zone with this, but when the stressed importance of it in almost every matchup sank in, I stuck to it until it felt more natural. Generally a matchup thread will tell you some tools that are most effective against certain matchups. Explore them and see how it works out.

Also, once you start actively playing people (online at least,) save replays! Even bad ones! Not only can you analyze them at a later date if you want to figure out why you got stomped so bad, but they are an incredible morale booster down the road when you are watching old replays and saying "Wow, what was I doing?"

Do not give up! Some people might put you down, but as mAc said, persistence is your greatest ally in this genre. We were all new once. I have only been playing this genre for about two and a half months and I am generally immensely satisfied with where I stand now, in spite of being frankly not very good. The mechanics and what kind of tricks the roster has in their arsenal can only come from total experience. Don't be afraid to ask questions! When something goes wrong or you don't know how to counter something, ask people who have the answer.

[Sponson]

My friend introduced me to this game about a year ago and I got hooked instantly, even eventually going as far as to buy a 360 pretty much to play this game.

When I started playing, I mained Rachel, and her most basic bnb of 6a, 5b, j.b, j.c, j.b, j.c stumped me until someone broke it down on the forums here.

I feel that its way easier to learn if you can visualize exactly what your character is doing/going to do. But also if you understand why they do it.

I would never have figured out Rachel's bnb combo if someone didn't break everything down to its most basic notion of "6a is a launcher, 5b keeps them afloat, hit jump then hit b, then c, then jump again and repeat"

That combo took me about an hour to learn, and then 3 more to burn it in.

You have to think of a combo as a 3 course meal, daunting to cook at first, but when you break it down and figure out what you're doing, you stop being flustered at how complex it is.