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[Seiki]

lol @ Star for taking the tier list seriously.

the true tier list:

SSSSSSSSSSSSS+++++++++++ : Naimat, Barack Obama, Jesus, Bob Ross, Dude from Reading Rainbow, weed

A tier: Giraffes, chicken pot pie, my dick

B tier: Your mom

C tier: Your mom's mom

D tier: turnips, fat girls (besides your mom), college tuition

FFFFFFFFFFFFFF--------------------- : Hitler, Mussolini, Stalin, Dick Cheney, Saddam Hussein, Osama Bin Laden, Kim Chong Il, Star

[LuminAbyss]

Actually, I'm back on XBL, and horribly out of practice with BB. BUT AHEM.

Why Ragna Is A Good Character

By Lumin

In olden days of fighting game glory

We all know this as

The Fundamentals story

Block well, mix-up, eat right

We all know this as

The way to win the fight

But this got boring to many fans

We all know this as

The rise in demand

New fighters put out more and more gimmicks

We all know this as

The Age of Airdasher Tricks

And every top tier had some form of bullshit

We all know this as

Gimmicks with no limit

No answer, no fair, we just sucked it up

We all know this as

Salt in a cup

But now the top tier brings us back

We all know this as

Ragna's S tier status [HACK?!]

But it was no hack, no flaw at all

Ragna has every tool to win them all

Good normals, good reversals

Good damage, good mix-up

Ragna has every tool to win them all

And all these tools, once lost over age

We're now all back to

The fundamentals age

TL;DR: Ragna was always a solid character, and as a result, could always win. But now that he hits hard in addition to keeping all his tools from previous games, he makes for a solid top tier character. Not stupid like the ones before. Just a solid, deserving to be top, S tier character.

[LastStarSaviour]

I didn't take the tier list thing all that seriously, I was just wondering if you guys had a basis for how it was being built. Pure curiosity. Also, I fought Lumin already Jackie, typical Ragna stuff.

Edit: @Lumin: No, he's pretty damned stupid, this will never change. I find this funny because almost every Ragna player swears he is a good character with no bull-shit and deserves to be top tier. Again, I laugh at this...

Also Naimat: I can't tell if that was supposed to be a joke or not but next time I see you i'm punching you in the face.

Edited February 2, 2012 by LastStarSaviour

[Jackie Chandler]

Holy shit Lumin. Forget Ragna, your poetry is the real S-tier.

[LuminAbyss]

Ragna has ONE bullshit thing. A frame 1-18 invul DP. Everything else he has is solid, not dumb. If you got hit by Ragna, you deserved it, just about everything he can do is reactable, and if it's not (like a cross-up DP or something of the sort), then the set-up into it is often noticable.

[Jackie Chandler]

Also Naimat: I can't tell if that was supposed to be a joke or not

... are you fucking serious.

Ragna has ONE bullshit thing. A frame 1-18 invul DP. Everything else he has is solid, not dumb. If you got hit by Ragna, you deserved it, just about everything he can do is reactable, and if it's not (like a cross-up DP or something of the sort), then the set-up into it is often noticable.

Agreed. The fact Rapid Cancels exist in the game and can make it safe make it even more B.S. But it's something you just have to accept and move on if you're serious about BB. Learn to deal with it and it shouldn't be a problem.

[Seiki]

Ok so to add to my list of people in the community who have said at one point or another something along the lines of me getting punched in the face:

Astaroth

Star

[Milln]

When did Astaroth say that? I don't remember.

[Jackie Chandler]

Ok so to add to my list of people in the community who have said at one point or another something along the lines of me getting punched in the face:

Astaroth

Star

When did Astaroth say that? I don't remember.

It was when they were playing Marvel a while back and Naimat told him to shut the fuck up or something.

[Papstr]

Earlier in this thread. I'm too lazy to dig, but I remember. Also, this thread seems to have taken a weird (and funny?) turn.

edit: WHAT THE HELL JACKIE THATS MY JOB

[Seiki]

LOLZ I like how my head is almost positioned just right with the troll face.

[LastStarSaviour]

@Lumin: I really have to disagree, Ragna has some of the most ignorant hit-box shenanigans in the game. TBH, that's the only reason I think people consider him even a slightly good character. Everything else about him seems mediocre.

[Seiki]

I'm going to say it again. Satoshi plays Ragna. what other proof do you need that Ragna isn't top tier?

[Vocal Sabre]

Who the fuck is Ragna?

[Vocal Sabre]

You mean Godna the bullshit right?

[Volpe-de-Glacio]

Lumin out of fucking nowhere. Also. . . Am I the only one that noticed Jackie just happened to have a picture of Naimat's face at hand? >_>

[Papstr]

I don't get what Star is getting at. Ragna is considered good because his stuff is good, but Star thinks thats not the case because the stuff is just...stupid? ...But its like still good, so it doesn't matter if its stupid or smart.. it exists.. ...Uh.

[LastStarSaviour]

That's not what i'm saying Papstr, i'm saying the only aspect of Ragna's character that I consider good about him is his range. I don't see why he'd be considered good for any other reason than this.

[Milln]

Oh that. I remember that, yeah.

Naimat's tier list is hilarious

[Seiki]

I don't get what Star is getting at. Ragna is considered good because his stuff is good, but Star thinks thats not the case because the stuff is just...stupid? ...But its like still good, so it doesn't matter if its stupid or smart.. it exists.. ...Uh.

Sometimes we need a person with a simple mind to explain something soo simple minded. Thanks PAPSTR for breaking down Star's logic.

EDIT!: @Volpe: Im facebook friends with Chandler. But even if we weren't, we both have a heart shaped locket with each other's pictures in it. <3 Chandler. (no homo)

[LuminAbyss]

Oh ho ho.

Hold on, I have a Ph.D in Bullshitology.

We will begin with The 5B. Starts up in 8 frames and covers half the screen right?

That is it's actual hitbox. Now if you round house kick, wouldn't you expect the hitbox to be the leg you're kicking with? Note how it actually ends before his leg does. By no means a bad hitbox, but not that dumb. Oh yeah, it's fast with silly good active frames, but bullshit? It's -8 on block and can be hit out of by many projectiles, spacing tools, and even 5As. It can even be low profiled under. There are answers to it, and everyone has them.

Next, The Inferno Divider. Now THIS is genuine bullshit. 1-18 fully invul, and it starts up in 7 frames? With 6 active frames? Coupled with rapid cancels? I'll give you this one.

Next, The 5D.

Look at all that retardedness.

However, notice we only use this in combos. Why? It's not garbage as a pressure tool, gatlings off most anything, and is -2 if dash cancelled on the second hit (and like, negative bajillion if the first hit is dash cancelled). However, Ragna has no REAL safe way of continuing pressure or applying mix-up off of it. If he does this, he just reset himself back to neutral. He has other, BETTER tools to do that. Strictly combo move. Shits on Noel's drives because of it's active frames.

Next, The 6A and 6B. My God. The first is an okay anti-air, but got nerfed HARD from CT and CS1.

fig.1&2: IMMA HIT J0O WIHT MAH SHOULDAH BLADEZKDJLSDKJFLDS:FKDSFDK

I don't wanna hear any complaints, from either side. It does it's job, and it's not too hard to deal with. Gatlings into NOTHING, can only special cancel (meaning mix-up is gone), and is -5 on block. Bait it, then hit him.

And 6B? 24 frames. Please just react to it. It'll solve all your problems. Gauntlet Hades is the same speed as well (hits crouchers on the 24th frame, unless it's TK'd, then it doesn't hit regardless until the 23rd frame). That is all.

And lastly, The 6D Ragna's main pressure reset tool. Is reactable and easy to hit him out of no matter what the fuck he cancels into it off of unless he rapid cancels 2D into it. 26 start-up frames, with 3 active frames. -14 unless we cancel into j.D for safety. Can lead to mix-up, but if you hit him out of it, why would you worry about that?

Call me Professor Lumin.

Edited February 2, 2012 by LuminAbyss

[Vocal Sabre]

Oh ho ho.

Hold on, I have a Ph.D in Bullshitology.

We will begin with The 5B. Starts up in 8 frames and covers half the screen right?

That is it's actual hitbox. Now if you round house kick, wouldn't you expect the hitbox to be the leg you're kicking with? Note how it actually ends before his leg does. By no means a bad hitbox, but not that dumb. Oh yeah, it's fast with silly good active frames, but bullshit? It's -8 on block and can be hit out of by many projectiles, spacing tools, and even 5As. It can even be low profiled under. There are answers to it, and everyone has them.

Next, The Inferno Divider. Now THIS is genuine bullshit. 1-18 fully invul, and it starts up in 7 frames? With 6 active frames? Coupled with rapid cancels? I'll give you this one.

Next, The 5D.

Look at all that retardedness.

However, notice we only use this in combos. Why? It's not garbage as a pressure tool, gatlings off most anything, and is -2 if dash cancelled on the second hit (and like, negative bajillion if the first hit is dash cancelled). However, Ragna has no REAL safe way of continuing pressure or applying mix-up off of it. If he does this, he just reset himself back to neutral. He has other, BETTER tools to do that. Strictly combo move. Shits on Noel's drives because of it's active frames.

Next, The 6A and 6B. My God. The first is an okay anti-air, but got nerfed HARD from CT and CS1. I don't wanna hear any complaints, from either side. It does it's job, and it's not too hard to deal with. Gatlings into NOTHING, can only special cancel (meaning mix-up is gone), and is -5 on block. Bait it, then hit him.

And 6B? 24 frames. Please just react to it. It'll solve all your problems. Gauntlet Hades is the same speed as well (hits crouchers on the 24th frame, unless it's TK'd, then it doesn't hit regardless until the 23rd frame). That is all.

And lastly, The 6D Ragna's main pressure reset tool. Is reactable and easy to hit him out of no matter what the fuck he cancels into it off of unless he rapid cancels 2D into it. 26 start-up frames, with 3 active frames. -14 unless we cancel into j.D for safety. Can lead to mix-up, but if you hit him out of it, why would you worry about that?

Call me Professor Lumin.

Hard to argue with that logic.

[Papstr]

I really do question hitbox designs sometimes. Why does 5b need 2 awkwardly placed boxes? why not just have one covering his leg? But hey. whatever.

I like where this thread is going.

[Volpe-de-Glacio]

This is what I want to see, Lumin. I get that people are annoyed by Star, but some of that shit is uncalled for. I'm looking at you, Milln. Why can't we all just get along?

[Seiki]

Lumin, What is Ragna's j.C hitbox in extend?