Middle Tennessee Needs Gaming! Monthly Versus Tourneys - Antioch, TN

[LastStarSaviour]

Honestly, i'd just give up on trying to convince people that they should play Under-Night. I stopped caring about who plays it here or not long time ago, it's probably about time you did the same. Hell, i'm not playing Gear because I don't like the game so I can't really chastise anyone for not playing a game for the same reason (even though none of the people who actually comment on the game actually HAVE played it yet, but whatever).

In the end, my interest in Gear strived from a desire to see all of the anime fighting games being played (because...you know...we're an anime fighting game community).

[Volpe-de-Glacio]

As I heard it criticized, linear gameplay in a fighter is like focusing on the same footsies to fish for the same hit-confirms for the same combo for the same oki repeatedly, which is all I've ever seen in SF (granted I don't really watch SF, but the SF players themselves said it was like that while we were discussing this.)

KoF is definitely linear by that definition. It's all footsies > close-gap > same simplistic pressure patterns > combo > one hit kill with anchor. Not saying that's bad; just making a comparison, because at their core essence this is how all fighting games are. But for some reason it's considered a bad quality in UNI.

I'll grant that Seth seems somewhat repetitive on the surface, but not everyone will play a cut and paste Seth. People keep saying his combo into knockdown into oki is bad, but it's nowhere near the level that Litchi and Chie were at. Their oki obfuscated their mix-up, giving their pressure a major fear factor. All his orbs do is make you block - it's up to the player to actually score a hit-confirm, and there's still shields to send him back to neutral. He's going to require a lot more tricky playing as the meta is fleshed out. I, for one, plan on abusing the fuck out of his ridiculous movement options as opposed to his time consuming projectiles, which is the only tool he really has fitting of a flowchart. (and, to be honest, knockdown > orb > pressure isn't really flowchart worthy either.)

As for the long meterless combos, this is typically because of people getting counter hits off of heavies as opposed to jabs. Typical meterless hit-confirms lead to like 30-40% combos into knockdown, which is pretty par for the course in fighting games.

For example, from the UNI footage I'm watching right now. Hyde just landed a combo with what looks like a CH JC. It did 5k (or about 40-45% on Hyde), and that was because he sacrificed oki for extra damage. The combo itself lasted 14 seconds.

Seth just landed a regular meterless combo. It did 3k damage (20% on Linne) and netted him an orb (without actually knocking her down. This means she has the chance to dodge it and avoid his pressure or even punish his attempt to get in.) The combo lasted 6 seconds.

Compare to GG. I just watched Ky perform an frc throw combo that took about 25-30% of Slayer's health in 7 seconds. Not that drastic a difference, really.

Edited December 1, 2012 by Volpe-de-Glacio

[Klein]

I see what you mean, but you're missing a little of what I mean. I don't think of UNiB as linear for it's neutral game though, rather it's lack thereof. For instance, I wasn't complaining about Seth's KD>oki thing, I'm fine with that. What I really hate is how he (and it seems like a lot of the game's cast) completely invalidates neutral game skill because of his trademark throw projectile>sit back and wait for it to get blocked>go in. There's no spacing or footsies skill there, he just gets in for free unless he's fighting a zoner. Which is my biggest problem with the game: where's the neutral? It seems from the videos I've watched that neutral game for UNiB is the inconvenient two seconds before someone presses into a half screen pressure string or gets in for free.'

I say this without any hint of sarcasm, I would love if someone could show me where the skill is.

Also, the average meterless combo for SF or Gear in my experience is something like 2K-2S-2D, or cr.LP-cr.LP-cr.LK-Special. It's all relative and subjective, but I personally prefer a game where you have to get a situational hit confirm, or blow meter to get anything more than very small damage into knockdown and oki.

[Volpe-de-Glacio]

I see what you mean, but you're missing a little of what I mean. I don't think of UNiB as linear for it's neutral game though, rather it's lack thereof. For instance, I wasn't complaining about Seth's KD>oki thing, I'm fine with that. What I really hate is how he (and it seems like a lot of the game's cast) completely invalidates neutral game skill because of his trademark throw projectile>sit back and wait for it to get blocked>go in. There's no spacing or footsies skill there, he just gets in for free unless he's fighting a zoner. Which is my biggest problem with the game: where's the neutral? It seems from the videos I've watched that neutral game for UNiB is the inconvenient two seconds before someone presses into a half screen pressure string or gets in for free.'

I wasn't saying you said that, it's just one of the typical complaints I hear about (UNI critique is almost inevitably either about long range "normals" or Seth's oki.)

In any case, there actually is a neutral game with footsies in UNI. If a Seth were to try and sit back from a neutral stand-point, his projectiles wouldn't get him in for free, they'd get him counter hit. They're only good for oki; they have too much start up to be really useful at neutral.

Nobody has a half screen blockstring. Yuzu has iai strikes that are more like frame traps; they try to catch you pressing buttons so they can combo off of a CH. Orie has a feintable coup droit and a puppet, and Carmine has rather lengthy normals, but when you play at the maximum extent of your hitboxes, you can't pressure your opponents effectively. Merkava's long range stuff come mostly in the form of command grabs.

I've watched a fair bit of gameplay and it's a lot more reliant on footsies than the deceptive hitboxes make people think. The only one who has anything close to half screen pressure is Gordeau, and he's already been established as a likely candidate for S-Tier. But even he has to play neutral to get to that point, and when he does pressure from his furthest range he loses the majority of his mix-up potential.

The neutral is essentially a mash-up of age old footsies with a smattering of long range pokes for catching your opponent with their pants down.

Edited December 1, 2012 by Volpe-de-Glacio

[LastStarSaviour]

I swear these posts make me lol. I can see why no one learns anything anymore.

[Astaroth136]

And Star comes out of left field with the condescending remarks. Nice job, dude.

[LastStarSaviour]

And Star comes out of left field with the condescending remarks. Nice job, dude.

Always glad to help ;D

[Seiki]

I swear these posts make me lol. I can see why no one learns anything anymore.

I swear THIS post is:

a) not going to help persuade anyone to listen to your opinions

and

b) does not contribute anything substantial to the discussion.

all you are doing is being an asshole.

With regard to UNiB, all I can judge from spectating is that everyone has meterless huge ass midscreen combos that happen way too often. In GG, most characters have to either be in the corner, have meter, or get a counter hit with a slow ass move with good p1 proration to get big damage. Point is GG makes them more situational and A LOT less frequent than in UNiB. And the characters you see that commonly do big damage like Johnny, Slayer, Potemkin do because it's part of their design but even then they have to use resources and their damage output is compensated by their lack of mobility options, slow normals, etc.

[Volpe-de-Glacio]

With regard to UNiB, all I can judge from spectating is that everyone has meterless huge ass midscreen combos that happen way too often. In GG, most characters have to either be in the corner, have meter, or get a counter hit with a slow ass move with good p1 proration to get big damage. Point is GG makes them more situational and A LOT less frequent than in UNiB. And the characters you see that commonly do big damage like Johnny, Slayer, Potemkin do because it's part of their design but even then they have to use resources and their damage output is compensated by their lack of mobility options, slow normals, etc.

That's what I'm saying though, they're situational just like GG. These big ass combos everyone is talking about are coming from counter hit JCs and specials. Typically, if you get a regular hit confirm with no meter, your combos are going to be in the range of 2.8k-3.2k damage. Even then, when people milk these combos for damage like this, they're sacrificing their oki for a bit of extra damage. Typically I see these optimal combos ending with the opponent teching at a frame advantage compared to those hit by combos that end in a hard knock down, sometimes even returning entirely back to neutral.

When you see someone get big meterless damage in UNiB, one of two things just happened: The person doing the combo either counter hit his opponent, or he had the most momentum throughout the match so the grind vorpal buff activated mid-combo. I don't know if that just beefed up his damage or made his combo longer, but I just saw grind vorpal activate a few hits into a Hyde combo and the damage spiked to 3.7k. Another instance of this occurred right as his combo started, netting him 4.4k. That's not too drastic, imo. Especially considering you pretty much have to sacrifice oki for this kinda damage.

Remember that the scale for damage in UNiB is different, too. 3k is like 20% of Linne's health. Oh, and the real big damage? That takes a counter hit + ALL of your meter. I just saw Seth get a CH JC that did about 4.7k on its own, plus his super which turned it into 7.2k after consuming 100% meter.

Just remember this game is still being balanced. They probably have a few more patches to trim the damage in certain scenarios down. All I'm sayin' is to wait until the final product and try it out before deciding whether you think it's worth playing or not.

Edited December 1, 2012 by Volpe-de-Glacio

[Astaroth136]

Are we even getting a UNiB release? I haven't followed the game at all.

[Volpe-de-Glacio]

Are we even getting a UNiB release? I haven't followed the game at all.

Signs are pointing to us getting it on Steam at the most. Either way, I know Star'll probably get it, and whenever I actually have the cash for a gaming tower I'll be able to get it too. We'll have setups for MTN. If your computers can handle the game, I'll probably gift a few copies just to spread the hype.

Edited December 1, 2012 by Volpe-de-Glacio

[Tophatmoffet]

Are we even getting a UNiB release? I haven't followed the game at all.

Never because french bread hates helping their own games.

[Klein]

They're only good for oki; they have too much start up to be really useful at neutral.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMy-pdSkFo4

You misunderstand what I mean by big combos. I just don't like sitting through a six second combo every time I get hit by a jab, lol.

And as I said, I'll TRY it. But unless I see something mindblowing (send me videos any time, I'll watch them) I'm not gonna get hyped for it by any means, or spend money on it.

[Volpe-de-Glacio]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMy-pdSkFo4

This was two weeks after the game came out, yo. But yeah, it's not that they're impossible to pull off, it's just that it becomes another factor of his neutral mind games. Is this Seth back dashing as a feint to lure me into a combo, or is he about to throw down a projectile to close the gap between us and start pressuring me? There are different responses depending on what scenario you think your opponent will choose. The conservative one will lead to Seth getting in on you if he's going for an orb, but may allow you to punish him if he's trying to double back. If you're already sitting across the screen from a Seth, if he goes to throw out an orb -you- can close the gap on -him-. Remember that his orbs are vulnerable to your attacks as well. They're also pretty easy to dodge at range as well.

You misunderstand what I mean by big combos. I just don't like sitting through a six second combo every time I get hit by a jab, lol.

I don't know how to respond to this, as that's pretty much par for the course in the realm of fighters. I'll admit Gear has a much faster combo pace, but if UNiB's combos were any faster I think they'd be impossible to perform, and the game makes up for it in overall game speed. Sure you might be sitting in a combo for awhile longer, but the pace of exchanging footsies and gaining momentum against your opponent seems to be better in UNiB.

Also, from what I can tell the UNiB players pretty much wing it for most every single combo they land, because the spacing, starter they use, time left til grind vorpal, angle of projectiles, etc. lends each hit-confirm its own unique situation, which calls for its own unique combo. They also seem to be really execution heavy since they're making them up as they go, because I'm seeing random damage spikes for higher end players, as well as skilled players dropping combos because they haven't fully realized the flow of their characters combos in a specific situation.

I've just seen Seth get a meterless 4k because the player knew he was in the correct situation for that combo and had the skill necessary to execute it properly. The point being that UNiB's combos are far more situational than they first appear.

Edited December 2, 2012 by Volpe-de-Glacio

[Top_Cat]

Nu got Act Parsar back huheuahuhehuheuhauehuehuaha

[Tophatmoffet]

UNiB, to me, is just a different take on the anime fighting genre.

Its porn for people who like flashy graphics and huge combos. It takes those things to the extreme and leaves most everything else behind.

Not by definition bad; just different.

However, I still think that is a horrible way to make a fighting game. To me its boring to play, or at least boring to watch.

This does not change the fact that if this game does actually make it to america, I'm buying it for the soundtrack.

[Milln]

REMINDER TO EVERYONE.

Game Galaxy Sat Dec 8

5346 Hickory Hollow Parkway

Antioch, TN 37013

Looks to be the following only:

1pm-Super Street Fighter IV AE v 2012 (XBOX 360)

4pm-Guilty Gear (XBOX 360)

If Guilty Gear has less than 8 entrants we won't be doing another.

$7 cover for 1st game, $5 entry fee for each tournament

cover includes all day play on the pinballs and arcade machines

Go play! I'm too busy to go, so you all need to show up and play graemz in my stead! Go go go go go go!

Effing support some Gear, some Game Galaxy, and I know a few of you dabble in Street Fighter,

Edit: I found this of Dora cosplaying as Bang at NEC, right after he stopped sandbagging.

Edited December 2, 2012 by Milln

[Astaroth136]

This. Game.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lskMvMkMpHw&feature=youtu.be&t=1m54s

[Jackie Chandler]

This. Game.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lskMvMkMpHw&feature=youtu.be&t=1m54s

I can taste all the delicious noobs' tears now. That's hilarious. I hope you're taking notes, Astaroth. :P

[Top_Cat]

If the tao had just used D after the tech, wouldn't she have avoided it?

[Jackie Chandler]

If the tao had just used D after the tech, wouldn't she have avoided it?

I'm pretty sure she could have just used jA/jB/jC and she would have hit him out of it. The invincibility on Tager's air 360 can't be that good. I think she only got caught by it because she wasn't expecting it/mashing.

[Tophatmoffet]

air 360 has no invuln, I think. j.a wouldve done it. Its still gonna trap the shit out of online scrubs

[Top_Cat]

I'm pretty sure she could have just used jA/jB/jC and she would have hit him out of it. The invincibility on Tager's air 360 can't be that good. I think she only got caught by it because she wasn't expecting it/mashing.

Yeah, I figured. There's no way something like that actually works.

[Astaroth136]

I'd say the A one has a few frames of invincibility, otherwise, the air-360 is useless.

And yes Midnight, something like that does work. It's just a tech trap. A tk'ed air-360 may actually catch lower than Collider, and if that's the case, it may have some good uses. Neutral-tech tech traps would be godlike.

[Urichinan]

I'd say the A one has a few frames of invincibility, otherwise, the air-360 is useless.

And yes Midnight, something like that does work. It's just a tech trap. A tk'ed air-360 may actually catch lower than Collider, and if that's the case, it may have some good uses. Neutral-tech tech traps would be godlike.

Air 360 doesn't have an A version, it's just 360C IIRC. So I don't think it actually has any invincibility at all. =/