[CSE] Ragna vs Platinum

[KayEff]

Discuss the Ragna vs. Plat matchup here.

[VR-Raiden]

Anyone have any insightful info on this match up? I'm still pretty inexperienced at it. How are we supposed to play it? Things to watch out for?

[Troll Badguy]

If you can get her in the corner, this matchup becomes a hell of a lot easier though you can say that about most matchups...

General:Platinum is a character that uses different items as her Drive and has some versatility because of it. She can use bomb and missile items to zone a bit. Bait the bat item(not safe on block) as it has DP like qualities and is her only meterless option as far as reversals go, her other option is Cure-Dot Typhoon for 50 meter/Counter Assault. Pay attention to her NEXT item as well, Miracle Jeanne (other distortion drive, 50 meter etc) causes the next item to come into play and become powered up. Platinum's powered up hammer causes an unblockable ground shockwave to come out if used. Platinum's regular hammer can be used to break primers as well. Don't roll during Plat bubble oki either. Tiger Knee Swallow Moon is used by Plat in mixups to keep her in the air and do falling air normals.

Poking/Footsies/Normals:Plat 5B and jC(especially with jC having no landing recovery) are good pokes that Platinum has and therefore you should watch out for. I'm not sure about 3C/2B being used as pokes either but they're both lows with decent reach. As Ragna you can poke with your usual footsie normals, namely 5B, 5C, 2D. Plats that I've fought like to jump so make good use of 6A antiair or jA to beat her out because jC(air to air) and falling jB(her air to ground) are good. Platinum does have really good (2C(FC)/6A sometimes even 6C(FC) if they're crazy enough) (read: painful/fatal) antiairs as well so use an air approach sparingly because your grounded normals are better than her grounded normals anyway. Try not to be predictable with use of Dead Spike in this matchup in corner pressure, because while it is good, you're obviously in a much better position of controlling the match with Plat in the corner without the bat. Platinum's 5A is -1 and is her main pressure tool as it hits crouching. Her 6B is an overhead that is +1 and can be linked into a combo.

Tactics:At the start of the match, I'd like to say Platinum's gameplan is to press Drive to get her item game going so it's an option. How they do this exactly is up to the player, I've seen some people super jump/airdash away/toward and use drive. I've also seen other Platinums not do it until they're a safe distance away. Platinum can't really do anything to hit you at the start of the match if you decide to back up a bit and block/jump back and block, so that works too. Alternatively they can just choose to try to knock you down and then get an item. My advice would be to gain the momentum and keep it going. She's not too far from being somewhat helpless if you do this.

Defense:You can C Inferno Divider/5A/maybe even 6A Swallow Moon mixups. Other that I got nothing. I can't remember really actually blocking stuff against Plat since beating it out is an option too.

Most recent Platinum I've played was Xie at NEC in CS2.

EDIT: Watch out for random Mami Circular... 1000 damage, corner carry, rage/salt for getting hit with it anyway... goes over 5B if I remember correctly. 5k combo in the corner.

Edited February 23, 2012 by Troll Badguy

[Yggjrasil]

watch for 2A cross-unders on your wakeup and her 2B low profiles under j.C and Gauntlet Hades.

[Fistmaster049]

I've found Plat players aren't fond of Ragna's 6B either, without the bat she can't do too much about it unless she sees it beforehand

[VR-Raiden]

Block Punishes vs Platinum:

Guaranteed:

5D (Kitty/Kitty Special)

- IB > (dash) 5B

5D (Frying Pan)

- (dash) 5B

5D (Bat)

- (dash) 5B

5D (Bat Special)

- (dash) 5A

214A/B/C

- IB > (dash) 5A

236B

- FC 2C (not FC at max range)

Notes:

Depending on timing/distance, FC 2C may air-hit her, but canceling to 6C eliminates the need to confirm this.

Cure Dot Typhoon (wait until it's ending)

- dash FC 2C

- During flash BK > dash FC 2C

- CH DS (any time during super)

Not Guaranteed but Good to Know:

3C

- IB > (dash) 5B crouch hit

Notes:

She can special cancel on block.

Cancel to 236B, you get hit.

Cancel to pogo stuff, depends on which pogo attacks and range.

Cancel to 214A/B/C, you hit her.

---

Anyone let me know if something isn't true or feel free to add anything I miss.

Edited April 2, 2012 by VR-Raiden

[MashThat5A]

3C if you IB can be punished with 5B guaranteed (and I think 5C, but maybe HeartCar goes over it?).

Close range bubble you can IB dash 5A.

[Yggjrasil]

I've found Plat players aren't fond of Ragna's 6B either, without the bat she can't do too much about it unless she sees it beforehand

She can do 5A,dash 2A,and 2B him out of it...I'm pretty sure all characters can hit him out of 6B if they see it coming, it's not like it's instant.

Edit: Another note about this match-up, her 2B can beat/low-profile your low IAD jump-ins.

Edited April 2, 2012 by Yggjrasil

[Fistmaster049]

She can do 5A,dash 2A,and 2B him out of it...I'm pretty sure all characters can hit him out of 6B if they see it coming, it's not like it's instant.

Edit: Another note about this match-up, her 2B can beat/low-profile your low IAD jump-ins.

really? huh.. oh well maybe all the Plat players I've ever fought online didn't know that.....or could just be lag, wouldn't surprise me :3

[Moy_X7]

Her instant overhead j.D (Pan) is punishable by 5A but your timing has to be flawless, you'll have to advance input 5A.

[RagnaXBL]

whats the best way to punish mami circular on block, i have a hard time with that for some reason

seems the plat i'm playing against just seems to throw it out now cuz i can't punish it properly

[KayEff]

you can punish that with most of ragna's moves, but only fast moves like 5B will result in a CH, so you won't be able to get a whole lot off of that certain punish. if you block mami late enough in its active frames, then nothing will result in a CH, so all in all it's just better to use 5B to punish.

[RagnaXBL]

yea 5B>6A>whatever worked wonders, don't know why it didn't work when i first tried it.

guess i was just panicking a bit after getting blown up the previous day :p

one more thing, when plat is zoning with the bubbles is it worth jabbing them to pop them? i seem to get counter hit all the time, but if i leave them plat gets to mix me up for free, how do you guys deal with bubbles?

[-Kid]

Personally, I use 5A and 5C to get rid of bubbles. But then again, it depends on where the platinum is. If she is on the other side of that bubble, you may wanna go for something like 5C, so that you can stuff the bubble, and use the 5C as a poke at the same time, to stop Platinum's ground approach.

Other times, it's best to go for something with quick recovery, like 5A. I usually use 66 5A in that case. For some reason, everytime i dash with Ragna, platinum's get scared. Dunno why though, it's just something i've observed.

But yeah, generally 5A and 5C....sometimes 5B.

[Gramas]

she can always dash and whiff punish if you try 5b or 5c,not a good idea at the highest level

if she knows you are going to 5A she can simply dash to you and punish you even if you are using a fast recovery normal

[zero34]

funny thing for me is whenever I see Platinum use her bubbles mid to full screen i always hell's fang my way to her and so far i've always got paid for it. (i'm not saying it's the go to move for the bubbles, it's just one thing i notice.)

[Yggjrasil]

whats the best way to punish mami circular on block, i have a hard time with that for some reason

seems the plat i'm playing against just seems to throw it out now cuz i can't punish it properly

I believe if you IB it, You can even use 2C Fatal. Mami Circular is a god-awful move to just toss out against Ragna, especially if she doesn't have meter to make it safe. Best way to approach Plats who do random Mami Circulars is to stay at least 1 or 1 1/2 character spaces away and barrier break your dashes. This match-up is heavily based on how well you space yourself and how well your footsies are. A majority of your pokes > hers.

Edited September 25, 2012 by Yggjrasil

[NightShade]

In my experience this is one of the hardest match ups for Ragna due to Platinums ability with zoning, option selects, Combo damage, size, over heads, rush downs and those blasted bubbles