[CP] Yuuki Terumi Gameplay Discussion

[C0R]

If you are aware of your starter you can sneak in a D,6D. Like if it's 5B for sure you can do 5b,3c, stomppppppppp, 2c 5c 3c 5d 6d. I forget how much it hurts the scaling since apparently shoving in Ds in your combo lowers your damage quite a bit.

If you REALLY want to deal with back rolls you can 6c or super it. Sadly none of which can be done on a confirm. Though the best thing to do, is to put your self in a situation where you are able to punish a back roll with 5b. So that would be like.. after a 3c into nothing... I mean it too, no 3c 2d because if they delay tech you can get punished.

WHAT THE FUCK.

YOU'RE ALIVE?

YOU STILL HAVE THE SAME AVATAR?

[fogelstrom]

I'l take any advice or even some top matches to watch. Ive seen noze playint him not so well but I have hopes for the future. Any other good teru's? Thanks in advance

I can't say that I have found any universal way to go about playing Terumi, getting in, zoning and neutral. I use alot of j.D, j.2D and 5D to zone/keep away and feel about by opponent. Wether I'm going to be on the defensive or on the offense to "match" their play-style.

I feel that j.D is excellent to get in with. IAD j.D and you're in. It's not 100% safe but they blockstun on it is heavy (hence the 'lag' like Azrael's 236A). It's hard to deal with this for people and once you hit that 2A you have a ton of choices.

Also if you CH with it on grounded opponent you can link into 5D/2C/Messenga and more.

j.C is really good air-to-air and j.D really only for air-to-ground. His j.A is also good since you can mash confirm it to jc, j.C, j.2D for knockdown. Other than that I have nothing on his air game. However hitting that j.2D after any random air-to-air hit is crucial since it nets you oki.

As you mention 5D is good but you are not going to make anyone wet their pants with it's options. 2D they can just jump out of or press buttons for CH on you. Jagaku is -3 on block so -6 on IB and punishable, not that awesome either... if you are close you can actually do 6B but that also carries a risk but with a much better reward. However dat spacing... just do it if you are quite close.

6C I have found to be alot better then I initially thought. I use this to punish... as much as I can as it's a great combo starter. 13F startup same as 5D. The trouble with 6C RC is that it's obvious even just after the first one on block. Also if you use 6C RC on block as a mean to get in on your opponent for 50% meter... I just think you are wasting your meter.

For good playing Terumi's I seriously haven't found any... in EU I have yet to find another Terumi that's better than me. And the only "good" (a.k.a not totally worthless) on Nico is Kuro and dodo-anso. But I even feel that I'm better then them both. Hubris? Yes. But there really aren't any good Terumi players...

*EDIT*

You don't have any matches to post to give critique on?

I will try and upload a few replays I've saved during the last week.

[TD]

thanks for the advice. its alot like l envisioned; his neutral game is rather medicore. l recall someone asking if his speed was how he was supposed to get in, and its crappy for the answer to that to be yes. oh well..

l have a few vids, let me see if l can record via my laptop.

[fogelstrom]

I actually use the speed as a tool nowadays. Since I'm actually pretty good I get a decent amount of respect and for that I am able to dash in. The thing is also you really have to condition people with Terumi. If you auto-pilot you might as well throw your stick out the window because you are going to loose. You have to mix things up all the time.

For example if you do 1/3 screen dash 5B all day they will know what's up. If you then instead do full screen dash they are either gonna jump or sit there and take it because they don't want to press buttons and get 5D CH.

Also 5D, 6C is somewhat useful but it's not confirmable. If you have 100% meter it can be nice to get a free get in card. With that don't forget to "mixup" RC on second and third hit. If you always do it on third it's really easy to read and all of the sudden it's their mixups, not yours.

[pulsr]

WHAT THE FUCK.

YOU'RE ALIVE?

YOU STILL HAVE THE SAME AVATAR?

Yup, Alive and living in Japan.

Terumi just has to dance at poke range either gambling with a dash in or baiting a whiff.

2D is really good for those characters that air dash back and do a long ass normal as they retreat like haku or jin. It's pretty nice.

Anyways, someone tell me how to do more dmg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXrFIgxc3w0

[Diamond Dust]

I have a question about Terumi's Orochi Burensen (Stomp Super). I dont have the game so I cannot test it out.

Are you able to block it on reaction?

Say Player A Terumi is attacking and Player B is crouch blocking. Terumi then uses Orochi Burensen, is Player B able able to get to Standing block during the super flash or is it too late.

[natearistata]

Yes. The only way that it's impossible for something to go through after super flash is if there's 0 frames of start-up afterwards, which very few moves have (Tager's GETB is an example of this).

[TD]

No idea why his isn't. I mean why even have it as an overhead. Id rather it just have 17f startup.

[fogelstrom]

17+0F startup super overhead that you can combo after anywhere on the screen?

Would have been too sick man! Terumi for president :D

[TD]

its unsafe without additional 50 heat, costs 50 heat. and he only has jumpins for overhead and a slow command grab.

they could have even made it a short starter, so its only comboable in combos. it would do 2k which is medicore damage from a mixup, but mixup he would have loved. right now its merely combo fodder.

trying to flowchart from 5d blocked...

2d - + on hit, + on block, - on whiff, startup can be hit

214d - + on hit, + on block (UB), - on whiff slightly (have to jump/backdash/dp), startup can be hit

6b- + on hit, + on block, +- on whiff (have to dp), startup can be hit

236d- + on hit, - on block (must ib 5a to punish), - on whiff (have to dp)

theres 6, 6c, supers, and do nothing. besides 6 not sure where these fit in yet. this chart also doesn't seem very advantageous.

[fogelstrom]

If you had 17+0F startup (a.k.a 17F startup and +0F after flash so they can't stand up after flash) it would have been to great. And if it was short starter his bnb's would be worse. But he is what he is so.

"jumpins" for overhead kinda disagree since you can jc 5A, 5C(1) and 2C for j.2D overhead. Even if it's a short starter and bad proration it's enough to get other mixups going. 6B/Throw.

Just cancel into the command throw, that's how it's supposed to be used since it's so slow but with the added range. If you do 2A, 5C(2), 2C, 214D you'll catch people without purple, unless they don't block the 2C for whatever reason. Ofc they can jump out but it's always X beats Y beats Z in fighters.

Dunno how to actually read that chart of yours... and you can't expect Terumi to just be able to press buttons and be in peoples faces constantly with block strings. Going to 5D in every single blockstring is just too much auto-pilot and people just have to sit, wait for 5D then jump back barrier that beats everything.

Friend noted that 2B has very late cancel to 5B that can be used for frame trap/mixup since it's +2 on block so you're free to press more buttons after. Woop! :V

[TD]

short starter only affects the first hit of a combo. the rest is left to time for hitstun decay and proration for damage. the only thing it would affect realistically is his ability to do a fast ground overhead. but it is rather pointless to talk about.

the chart is just a brainstorm l had to mixup. it wasnt supposed to be just from 5d, just stemmed off your previous post. l wasnt aware jump barrier beat everything after 5d though, ill need to actually test this stuff.

the goal of that flowchart wasnt fully explained. it was really to see if he had mixup ability that isnt high/low. like, if you 2d and they block you can pressure, but if they know and try to jump you 6b, but if they know and mash you 236d, etc. again just a brainstorm, not even remotely perfect and apparently it all loses to jump barrier anyway

also, + means a combo or pressure for you, - means you can be punished/dont press buttons, +- means it has pros and cons. l am basically trying to put the pieces together in writing.

[Errol]

maybe jump barrier works if you Ib the 5d, but if you don't you get caught by 236D.

[Yuhoke]

So, a patch arrived. Notes about Terumi:

- Fixed bug with Messenga

- Fixed bug with Zanrouga

- Fixed bugs with jB, jC

Unfortunately, these weren't further explained. Could they be something useful, or just fixes for bugs that happen on a rare occasion? (Didn't even know that there were bugs with these moves, except Zanrouga, cause well... you know, that whole move is buggy )

[TD]

seems legit. pressure isnt even the problem for me, its getting in. in fact pressure is probably the easiest bit, l suppose it depends on who has a dp though. most chars in the game have a flowchart that allow them to beat any option from any normal given the right yomi, usually to beat mash/jump/dp, the rest, and finally, his one tricks. im just trying to flesh out terumi's. EDIT: patch stuff could have to do with ch. messenga does not ch ever, goes through jin dp with no ch. maybe jb and jc ch carry now like koko's ja. im not sure but it seems to make sense. dont take my word for it though.

Edited December 12, 2013 by TD

[fogelstrom]

short starter only affects the first hit of a combo. the rest is left to time for hitstun decay and proration for damage. the only thing it would affect realistically is his ability to do a fast ground overhead. but it is rather pointless to talk about.

Isn't hitstun decay removed in BBCP? From what I know everything boils down to X amount of frames depending on starter now. That's why you have to level down 22C for some combos to work and such.

It seems to be a mix now that I read up on it.

http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=Damage_(BBCP)#Hitstun_Decay

But the time threshold is new and from my experience the one thing that f*cks things up the most.

As you can see from the shart after 820F all moves have but one 1F hitstun regardless of hit...

*EDIT*

In the case of j.2D it has to be a minimum of Short starter so that's -360F of combo leaving 460F in time to combo. Now think about the amount of frames 63214B and 22C eats up.

If it's Very Short we're just left with a measly 280F! But that can't be the case. His cmd grab however is easily Very Short and you can't do anything after 63214B since they instantly tech.

maybe jump barrier works if you Ib the 5d, but if you don't you get caught by 236D.

This would depend on range when hitting 5D. I only assume people don't do 5D to close anyway since if you IB 5B that close you can probably be punished by alot of things. And at far range 5D, 236D is never tight which makes people able to air back barrier. Atleast you can press buttons after 236D on barrier air hit since it's +-0 on block and with them landing.

Edited December 12, 2013 by fogelstrom

[Errol]

236D is never tight which makes people able to air back barrier.

＾

Jumps have 4 frames of startup, that's Why/How you get hit out of it. You get hit BECAUSE it isn't tight. on the flip side logically thinking about it, that means IB jump is guaranteed to be safe, at range.

more simple logic. anything that combos on hit, can't be jumped out of on block. Does 5d have ranges that 236D doesn't combo? I haven't noticed that in matches against Terumi, but I don't think so.

[fogelstrom]

I can guarantee that 5D doesn't always combo on hit on standing opponents at far range. It happens to me quite alot and I haven't adapted enough to switch 236D to 6C in those cases unfortunately.

[TD]

Isn't hitstun decay removed in BBCP? From what I know everything boils down to X amount of frames depending on starter now. That's why you have to level down 22C for some combos to work and such.

That's what hitstun decay is. You defined it. It's how much frames a move's hitstun begins to subtract after a certain amount of time.

It seems to be a mix now that I read up on it.http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=Damage_(BBCP)#Hitstun_Decay

But the time threshold is new and from my experience the one thing that f*cks things up the most.

As you can see from the shart after 820F all moves have but one 1F hitstun regardless of hit...

*EDIT*

In the case of j.2D it has to be a minimum of Short starter so that's -360F of combo leaving 460F in time to combo. Now think about the amount of frames 63214B and 22C eats up.

If it's Very Short we're just left with a measly 280F! But that can't be the case. His cmd grab however is easily Very Short and you can't do anything after 63214B since they instantly tech.

I know this. It still only depends soely on the starter how long a combo lasts, and the rest of the moves, regardless of their starter wil aways follow the first cmbo's starter rating. Like, as you mentioned 214d is a vs starter, you basically can only combo into supers on hit. If you did 5b(ch) 214d as a purple grab, you would get a longer combo because 5b is an n starter. Likewise, if 63214b was 17 0 startup and vs starter, it would be a fast overhead that could not be comboed from if you started with it, bescause of the time it takes. If you were to do it in a middle of a combo, it would still be the same combo fodder that it is now.

This would depend on range when hitting 5D. I only assume people don't do 5D to close anyway since if you IB 5B that close you can probably be punished by alot of things. And at far range 5D, 236D is never tight which makes people able to air back barrier. Atleast you can press buttons after 236D on barrier air hit since it's +-0 on block and with them landing.

Parts in bold.

[Errol]

I can guarantee that 5D doesn't always combo on hit on standing opponents at far range. It happens to me quite alot and I haven't adapted enough to switch 236D to 6C in those cases unfortunately.

even if it doesn't combo you still got 4 frames where it'll catch jump outs. test it in training mode, I doubt it doesn't catch jumpouts unless you delay it.

[fogelstrom]

Parts in bold.

You are wrong. 2C CH, 214D, 63214B. You are still not able to combo.

Sorry man. Maybe 214D is special since it's a grab but I doubt it. I would assume any short/very short starter in a combo would add a huge amount of frames in hitstun decay so with your suggestion of 63214B being 17+0F as VS would most likely not make it the same combo fodder.

You are welcome to do your own laborations with other characers short/very short starters to prove this wrong however if you wish.

even if it doesn't combo you still got 4 frames where it'll catch jump outs. test it in training mode, I doubt it doesn't catch jumpouts unless you delay it.

You're right about the 4 frames but I will seriously not do any extensive testing on 5D at different ranges to 236D to see if you're able to jump. In theory we already have the answer that if the time between 5D and 236D is greater than 4F you will be able to be airborne and block so if that happens for whatever reason, range, delay cancel, what have you...

But you are indeed right.

[Lucalibur]

You are wrong. 2C CH, 214D, 63214B. You are still not able to combo.

That is because the 2C is not considered a starter. If you pay attention, it doesn't actually combo, but it purple throws because of the extra 'purple throw' frames after hitstun is over. Try doing a 6B FC as a starter. Sure, the purple throw and command grab's duration take a lot out of the time, but after that you can combo just fine.

[TD]

That is because the 2C is not considered a starter. If you pay attention, it doesn't actually combo, but it purple throws because of the extra 'purple throw' frames after hitstun is over. Try doing a 6B FC as a starter. Sure, the purple throw and command grab's duration take a lot out of the time, but after that you can combo just fine.

thanks for testing, yeah 5b and 2c doesn't link even on ch. admittedly l didnt test it before posting. to go a little further from lucalibur's post, l tested ch 5d 214d purple, you can do 63214b 22c 6d 236d in the corner. 5d is an n but as stated, cg, purple, and 63214b takes too much time. it still proves the starter ratings are just that - starters.

[fogelstrom]

2C CH links if hit on crouch. I missed that... so you were right in that TD.

Tried with 6B fatal also and then you can combo just fine.

That makes your idea actually good TD. Except 17+0F might be a bit good ^^ But if it was 25-26F and VS starter... would give him a nice much needed boost.

[Pharos]

I'm in the need of some assistance, I'm playing Terumi and I'm trying to understand how the who max charge stomp thing works. I usually spam my c button till its over but most of the time I end up with only the half charge. How would I succeed in getting max charge all the time?!