[Xrd] Potemkin Gameplay Discussion

[dot_Nova]

So Kedako has updated the 1.1 pot's frame data weeks ago, do you guys want/let me edit the wiki or someone can do that. Pot players are so rare these days

update the wiki if you can

[Flick]

ok i'll do that

[Garalian]

I got the new OS to work with PB, but considering how many long range moves there are (Faust flashbacks incoming), I dunno how useful this is. Maybe you could catch someone doing a meaty?

[younghou]

i think the new OS can be useful in situation where the opponent it's negative(-1, -2 or +0) so if they mash a poke or move you get the potemkin buster but if they jump away or back dash you keep safe.
maybe it's useful in defense to, i don't know if you can use it to avoid get command grabbed (eddie, elphelt maybe).

anyway now we can wake up Gigantor and don't waste the meter if they do nothing. 

[Red Star]

 i don't know if you can use it to avoid get command grabbed (eddie, elphelt maybe).

Command grabs don't cause your character to guard so the OS does not work against them.

[younghou]

i test today and maybe the best use for pot it's to FDB fast projectiles (like i-no chemical love, some venom balls and some ky, sol projectile pressure), so if they do the move the FDB comes out other wise you are safe, discuss.

[Wiggleworm]

When I get free time I like to watch high ranking japanese Pot players on youtube. I've noticed a trend that doesn't really make sense to me and I'm wondering if anyone here knows why.

 

I rarely, if ever, see players like FAB or Konsome use Heavenly Potemkin Buster. I've seen several scenarios where they've got full meter and have an opponent at half health or less and the opponents are airborne nonstop, but they never use HPB. Is there a reason for this?

 

I understand that meter is valuable for extending combos, rejecting, perfect defense, etc. but I've found HPB to be very useful when I have jump happy opponents. Once they eat a raw HPB a few times they stay on the ground more.

 

 

[Flick]

When I get free time I like to watch high ranking japanese Pot players on youtube. I've noticed a trend that doesn't really make sense to me and I'm wondering if anyone here knows why.

 

I rarely, if ever, see players like FAB or Konsome use Heavenly Potemkin Buster. I've seen several scenarios where they've got full meter and have an opponent at half health or less and the opponents are airborne nonstop, but they never use HPB. Is there a reason for this?

 

I understand that meter is valuable for extending combos, rejecting, perfect defense, etc. but I've found HPB to be very useful when I have jump happy opponents. Once they eat a raw HPB a few times they stay on the ground more.

I think there's 2 reasons:

-First: because the opponent in that situation has a counter-measurement to HPB(HPB is not as godlike as you think-even weaker when you have to fight opponent who know how to jump safely vs HPB). Got a friend who saw FAB vs Ruu in XX and said why FAB didn't just HPB when Ruu's dancing around - just because Bridget can just press a button to stop HPB and make Po lose 50% tension

-Second: Maybe they just didn't see the opportunity. Watching the video is always easier than being in the video yourself - if you know what i mean :D

[Red Star]

Props to dot_Nova for taking 4th at CEO. Great to see Potemkin making top 8. Sucks that you had to fight blacksnake's Venom and elvenshadow's Faust but the whole top 8 was pretty stacked against Potemkin outside of the lone Leo. Hope the top 8 is up on youtube soon.

[dot_Nova]

vrraiden gave me a really good idea for an OS. I tested and confirmed a couple in my hotel room at CEO:

 

Against characters with short and fast backdashes:

After a knockdown (Pot buster, 2D), do a meaty jump in and input pot buster right when the move would've hit (example: j.HS > PB > pressure string stuff). If your opponent backdashes, the j.H will whiff and because you land while your move is still active, there will be no landing recovery and you will immediately get PB and catch them during BD recovery. If your opponent blocks, the game won't read the PB as you're still in the air and you can continue your pressure once you land. Note: This OS will lose to grab invul reversal supers and DPs. Do not use on characters with DPs unless you know your opponent prefers to mash BD. If they DP, your j.H will whiff and you'll get PB and eat the DP.

 

On a PB knockdown, I waddle forward just a tiny bit before doing a super jump and then do the OS. Moving forward slightly allows you to close the gap if their BD would normally put you slightly out of PB range. It also gives your opponent a slightly bigger window to BD: baiting them and giving you a free PB.

 

After 2D I immediately super jump and do the meaty j.H jump in. Against characters like I-No and May, this is not a true meaty giving them time to BD and allowing you to catch it.

 

Be careful when trying to bait the BD by doing a slightly delayed meaty as it will lose to 6P mash. If your opponent is willing to mash, mix it up with real meaties and BD baits.

 

This OS works on: Millia, Faust (beats wakeup dust too), May, Elphelt, Venom, Ky

Might work on but haven't confirmed: I-No, Zato, Axl, Sol

Will not work: Slayer, Potemkin, Sin, Chipp

 

Against characters with DPs:

After a knockdown, do the same thing as the previous OS except input BD. If your j.H whiffs due to their DP, you'll get BD and their DP will whiff. This OS is particularly useful against Sin as causing his DP to whiff puts him in a very dangerous position. Practicality and usage outside of the SIn MU needs to be tested though.

 

I speculate that players that like to DP and then RC it for momentum can be baited easily with this OS. Do not overuse this OS. Keep in mind that it's sometimes better to opt for a normal safejump or a blitz bait as this will give up your momentum if they choose to BD or blitz on wakeup.

 

 

In theory, you should be able to apply the same concept with normals. For example, inputting 5K to catch BD's with its long active frames. I'm surprised I never thought of this before especially since this is a very useful OS you often see in Street Fighter.

[dot_Nova]

When I get free time I like to watch high ranking japanese Pot players on youtube. I've noticed a trend that doesn't really make sense to me and I'm wondering if anyone here knows why.

 

I rarely, if ever, see players like FAB or Konsome use Heavenly Potemkin Buster. I've seen several scenarios where they've got full meter and have an opponent at half health or less and the opponents are airborne nonstop, but they never use HPB. Is there a reason for this?

 

I understand that meter is valuable for extending combos, rejecting, perfect defense, etc. but I've found HPB to be very useful when I have jump happy opponents. Once they eat a raw HPB a few times they stay on the ground more.

 

I think there's 2 reasons:

-First: because the opponent in that situation has a counter-measurement to HPB(HPB is not as godlike as you think-even weaker when you have to fight opponent who know how to jump safely vs HPB). Got a friend who saw FAB vs Ruu in XX and said why FAB didn't just HPB when Ruu's dancing around - just because Bridget can just press a button to stop HPB and make Po lose 50% tension

-Second: Maybe they just didn't see the opportunity. Watching the video is always easier than being in the video yourself - if you know what i mean :D

 

It's like flick said. HFB has a short duration of invul. If the opponent is somewhat high in the air, they can use a move with a vertical hitbox and stop Pot midflight. Your opponent can also opt to gold burst in the air to stop HFB as well or air dash backwards away from it if they haven't used all of their air options.

Also, the higher your opponent is, the less reliable it will be to use as if they're even slightly out of the flight trajectory it'll whiff and you'll lose 50 meter.

 

Unless your opponent is doing an obvious jump-in, messes up their oki safe jump, or use up all their jumps/airdashes, it is difficult and risky to use HFB. But if whatever you're doing is working on your opponent, then by all means go ahead and abuse it.

[Flick]

vrraiden gave me a really good idea for an OS. I tested and confirmed a couple in my hotel room at CEO:

 

Against characters with short and fast backdashes:

After a knockdown (Pot buster, 2D), do a meaty jump in and input pot buster right when the move would've hit (example: j.HS > PB > pressure string stuff). If your opponent backdashes, the j.H will whiff and because you land while your move is still active, there will be no landing recovery and you will immediately get PB and catch them during BD recovery. If your opponent blocks, the game won't read the PB as you're still in the air and you can continue your pressure once you land. Note: This OS will lose to grab invul reversal supers and DPs. Do not use on characters with DPs unless you know your opponent prefers to mash BD. If they DP, your j.H will whiff and you'll get PB and eat the DP.

 

On a PB knockdown, I waddle forward just a tiny bit before doing a super jump and then do the OS. Moving forward slightly allows you to close the gap if their BD would normally put you slightly out of PB range. It also gives your opponent a slightly bigger window to BD: baiting them and giving you a free PB.

 

After 2D I immediately super jump and do the meaty j.H jump in. Against characters like I-No and May, this is not a true meaty giving them time to BD and allowing you to catch it.

 

Be careful when trying to bait the BD by doing a slightly delayed meaty as it will lose to 6P mash. If your opponent is willing to mash, mix it up with real meaties and BD baits.

 

This OS works on: Millia, Faust (beats wakeup dust too), May, Elphelt, Venom, Ky

Might work on but haven't confirmed: I-No, Zato, Axl, Sol

Will not work: Slayer, Potemkin, Sin, Chipp

 

Against characters with DPs:

After a knockdown, do the same thing as the previous OS except input BD. If your j.H whiffs due to their DP, you'll get BD and their DP will whiff. This OS is particularly useful against Sin as causing his DP to whiff puts him in a very dangerous position. Practicality and usage outside of the SIn MU needs to be tested though.

 

I speculate that players that like to DP and then RC it for momentum can be baited easily with this OS. Do not overuse this OS. Keep in mind that it's sometimes better to opt for a normal safejump or a blitz bait as this will give up your momentum if they choose to BD or blitz on wakeup.

 

 

In theory, you should be able to apply the same concept with normals. For example, inputting 5K to catch BD's with its long active frames. I'm surprised I never thought of this before especially since this is a very useful OS you often see in Street Fighter.

I've experimented and applied this for a long time but now in Xrd when backdash seems to be really a bitch to Potemkin, and 5K got slower, it's harder than before.

Can you lab it and test what things work for what char with backdash catching OS, i will also do it and post it there when i have access to console

[younghou]

yeah dot nova, it's very good OS, from street figther, also you can use it vs slayer back dash, so input 5hs to beat the back dash or heat knuckle to beat his jump canceled backdash.

we can try to develop more good defensive option selects to deal with hard match ups for examples vs leo we can use 4hs+s after a blocked rekka, so if he go for the second rekka you throw him, if not you get flawless defense.

[Blade]

I got a question about Pot:

 

I was training against avoiding Millia's mixup the other day and I discovered you can essentially empty "High Jump" behind her, and do a land-behind Potemkin Buster in some situations.  Even a wiffed Mega-fist over someone's head will do this.

 

Exactly what sort of spacing tricks can you use to set these situations up?

[Flick]

 

I got a question about Pot:

 

I was training against avoiding Millia's mixup the other day and I discovered you can essentially empty "High Jump" behind her, and do a land-behind Potemkin Buster in some situations.  Even a wiffed Mega-fist over someone's head will do this.

 

Exactly what sort of spacing tricks can you use to set these situations up?

 

It was actually a part of AC Potemkin's "Vortex"

[jak d ripr]

So there's this thing I've been seeing some pot players do where they whiff a sj. p on their opponents wake-up. An example is at 3:40 in this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=932q7NeTa0c

 

Just out of curiosity, what is the purpose of this? I'd really like to add some more tools to my wake-up game so I'm trying to understand why(and when) I should(and shouldn't) be doing this.

[dot_Nova]

 

I got a question about Pot:

 

I was training against avoiding Millia's mixup the other day and I discovered you can essentially empty "High Jump" behind her, and do a land-behind Potemkin Buster in some situations.  Even a wiffed Mega-fist over someone's head will do this.

 

Exactly what sort of spacing tricks can you use to set these situations up?

 

what do you mean high jump behind her and when? Like when you're stuck in her mixup? Or after you knock them down?

[Blade]

It was actually a part of AC Potemkin's "Vortex"

 

That doesn't exactly answer my question.  I know a few of AC Pot's tricks to get a Buster but, not all.

 

This being GGXrd, he has to use other tactics to get close enough to buster.

 

I'd like some advice for that, if at all possible.

 

@dot_Nova: I mean in terms like, for example, she runs forward to do a mixup or a roll forward mixup, she's basically getting in my face... so instead of sitting there and blocking everything (and eventually getting mixed up by a high-low or a low-overhead), I jump over her and buster her from landing behind when she tries to do rushdown.  I know she could possibly anti-air me from behind if she was fast, but so far it sorta works against aggressive rushdown.

[dot_Nova]

That doesn't exactly answer my question.  I know a few of AC Pot's tricks to get a Buster but, not all.

 

This being GGXrd, he has to use other tactics to get close enough to buster.

 

I'd like some advice for that, if at all possible.

 

@dot_Nova: I mean in terms like, for example, she runs forward to do a mixup or a roll forward mixup, she's basically getting in my face... so instead of sitting there and blocking everything (and eventually getting mixed up by a high-low or a low-overhead), I jump over her and buster her from landing behind when she tries to do rushdown.  I know she could possibly anti-air me from behind if she was fast, but so far it sorta works against aggressive rushdown.

So you got the right idea about jumping. If she's not doing a meaty normal or special on your wakeup, you can jump out of her mixup. Landing and then doing a pot buster afterwards is far fetched though. She's not going to sit there and let you do that.

 

Whiffing megafist to do the same is also extremely unlikely. Megafist has recovery and you'll be close enough for her to grab you if it whiffs. Also H disc will punish your reversal megafist.

 

The times I get buster against Millia specifically is if there's a 3 frame gap in her mixup (example: IB S disc), if I hammerfall through the hair pin then YRC PB, or when I'm on offense and do tick throw stuff.

[Flick]

So you got the right idea about jumping. If she's not doing a meaty normal or special on your wakeup, you can jump out of her mixup. Landing and then doing a pot buster afterwards is far fetched though. She's not going to sit there and let you do that.

 

Whiffing megafist to do the same is also extremely unlikely. Megafist has recovery and you'll be close enough for her to grab you if it whiffs. Also H disc will punish your reversal megafist.

 

The times I get buster against Millia specifically is if there's a 3 frame gap in her mixup (example: IB S disc), if I hammerfall through the hair pin then YRC PB, or when I'm on offense and do tick throw stuff.

Yeah pretty much going to say the same things. If she's standing still for at least ~40frame inviting you to buster, then why not doing it 

[younghou]

i guys, somebody know set ups to use the meaty slide head (unblockable)>RC. I see FAB do it on elphelt after a ICPM, i test and it's work on leo to, maybe we can find others set ups to time it... 

[Flick]

i guys, somebody know set ups to use the meaty slide head (unblockable)>RC. I see FAB do it on elphelt after a ICPM, i test and it's work on leo to, maybe we can find others set ups to time it... 

Theoritically you can do it after almost every knockdown(and u can see FAB has done it many time)

[SupaSage69]

New Guy On Potemkim

Can anyone tell the main points on what is should learn for him? 

[dot_Nova]

New Guy On Potemkim

Can anyone tell the main points on what is should learn for him? 

Besides getting used to charging all the time and commands, learn everything you can about MUs in the game.

Are you familiar with GG/FGs or is this your first character?

[jak d ripr]

New Guy On Potemkim

Can anyone tell the main points on what is should learn for him? 

 

Check this video out, it covers a lot of basic info on how to play him. It helped me get started:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOLkXM8EODs