[CS2] Ragna General Discussion

[VR-Raiden]

Just one thing though. Is it possible to do a double BE in that combo? And how can I know what combos can be double BE'ed and the ones that can't? Without memorising them I mean; is there a rule or something?

Yes double BE is possible with that combo. I don't know the exact reasoning behind being able to do a double BE, it's not as simple as number of hits because j.C into that combo works, but 5A/2A into it doesn't. Someone that knows can enlighten us. But in general you'll just have to remember when you can do it or not, and if you aren't sure, it's safer to not go for it than to go for it and drop it.

[Final Ultima]

Untechable time is determined by combo proration, that's why combos drop much earlier if they start off something like a 5A or 2A.

[OrionXElite]

Has anyone else seen a JP Ragna player do this funky Double BE combo:

xx>BE>Dash>6A>SJC>sj.D>dj.C>BE>Dash>5D>Whatever ender

I cannot find the damn video I saw it in all I remember is that it was from a-cho and it was a Black/Gold Ragna.

[TITANIUM BEAST!!!]

Bit old news. It's an interesting alternative that works much better midscreen than the 6D version, but it doesn't work off of every setup and it does less damage usually. Occasionally you get slightly better meter gain due to the height you do the BE at.

[Seifuuku]

i think it should work with all belial combos as long as you don't use 6a twice

[TITANIUM BEAST!!!]

Probably doesn't work off of any combo starting with A attacks. Just tested with 2A-5B-3C into 2B pickup and no dice.

EDIT: Some data from testing.

5B-3C, 2B-5C, HJC hj.C-D, JC hj.C -> BE, dash 6D-j.D, JC j.C -> BE, dash 5D -> 22C 3739 dmg, 48 heat

Goes to 3751 dmg and 51 heat if you tack on a 5B after the 22C.

5B-3C, 2B-5C, HJC hj.C-D, JC hj.C -> BE, dash 6A, HJC hj.D, JC hj.C -> BE, dash 5D -> 22C 3722 dmg, 50 heat

Goes to 3734 dmg and 52 heat if you tack on a 5B after the 22C.

This is a good example, although this is only one combo possibility. You sacrifice a tiny bit of damage for an extremely tiny increase in heat gain. I would say in most situations, it would make no real difference as far as heat, so aside from midscreen setups, 6D variation is the way to go.

[Yggjrasil]

yep, even on counter hit. It still will not work. It's exactly what Final said, any combo that starts with A usually prorates really badly and you can tech out of it early.

[bojador_pt]

TITANIUM what's HJC hj.C? What does the hj.C stands for?

[KayEff]

HJC means "high jump cancel," which means canceling a move into a high jump, and hj.C means doing a "C" move while in a high jump.

[bojador_pt]

Thx KayEff. I've never seen it wrote like that.

Cheers

Edit: Why is there some combos with 6A (HJC), J.C (JC), J.C, BE, some with 6A (HJC), J.C, J.D (JC), J.C, BE and even some with 6A (HJC), J.C, J.D (JC), J.D, BE?

Can I always go for (HJC) J.C, J.D (JC) J.D, BE?

If yes: Why do some people do J.C (JC) J.C?

If not: Why can't I?

Also, how about using J.B, J.C (JC), J.C, BE? I often see people do this aswell.

[advancedNoob]

It's all based on body alignment judgement. Sometimes jD will being your opponent too high, therefore BE will fail to combo correctly. It's mostly just memorizing what to use when, but sometimes you have to judge as you go. I think jB isn't viable to use in combos, not 100% sure though. Because of the extra hit, damage scaling reduces the damage and the combo does less damage than same thing without jB.

[bojador_pt]

Ok. And if I do 6A (JC not HJC), J.C (JC), J.C, BE will it work?

Regarding J.B in combos I get what you're saing but I've seen very good players using it. Mainly replacing the 6A (after a 5D for example) with the J.B and maybe in this scenario increases the damage. Maybe a FC or CH combo?

Combo @ 0:32: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbIEJOmYh1c

[RagnaXBL]

ok nub question here but i just noticed in some of my match vids some ragnas will do 5D>DC>JB>JC>JC>BE. is this really better than 5D>DC>6A>JC>JD>JD>BE? i dnt see the difference cept sumtimes my 6A's after the DC will whiff completely. do they do this in order to avoid the whiff or are my inputs just shit? i usually always use 6A. did i just answer my own question?

[FlyingVe]

It's the only way to do the combo in some situations, usually involving an airborne opponent. Examples:

GH(2)>Dash5B>5D(2)>(DC)>jB>jC>jC>BE>...

...>6C(2)>(DC)>5D(2)>(DC)>jB>jC>jC>BE>...

Also, 6A is usually the best option after 5D, but you can use 5C is you need the extra range. It only does slightly less damage.

[bojador_pt]

FlyingVe is that what happened here?

Combo @ 0:32: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbIEJOmYh1c

He uses J.B after the 5D DC because he hit his opp with the 6A while he was airborn?

[Seifuuku]

apparently 5b->6a gatling is removed in 1st loketest

any ideas on what to do after connecting 5b in bk?

[RagnaXBL]

It's the only way to do the combo in some situations, usually involving an airborne opponent. Examples:

GH(2)>Dash5B>5D(2)>(DC)>jB>jC>jC>BE>...

...>6C(2)>(DC)>5D(2)>(DC)>jB>jC>jC>BE>...

Also, 6A is usually the best option after 5D, but you can use 5C is you need the extra range. It only does slightly less damage.

thx dude. good to know. i thought my 6A's were just whiffing cuz they felt like it :p. ok so if their airborne u gotta J.B. now if any1 could give me some advice on ragna vs makoto that would greatly appreciated. the match up thread is a little lacking got a big money match on this

[FlyingVe]

Not always, sometimes you can and should still use 6A. Just keep practicing you combo's and you'll get it. Check the matchup board for matchup advice. Makoto isn't that bad if your spacing is good and you can block decently.

[RagnaXBL]

seems the thread on the makoto board was lil more helpful :p. now the big question how would i be able to tell when to 6A/j.B. atm using DC>j.B seems to be working a lot better for me. i havent whiffed even once. although the damage seems to be a lot less. but if u add up the number of times i could whiff the DC>6A, DC>J.B seems better.

[FlyingVe]

meh. That's alot of effort, it's easier and more effective to just learn which combo takes which move. Ragna doesn't really have alot of combo variation in CS so it isn't that bad.

[Sadeyo]

Are you guys really creative with your Ragna in combat or just flow chart your way to victory?

[VR-Raiden]

j.B after a 5D dash cancel is for when the 5D hits an airborne opponent. but 6A will still work on all characters except Arakune and Carl (any others I'm forgetting?) for slightly more damage. After the 6A from a 5D hitting an air opponent, you do 6A(HJC) > j.C(JC) > j.C > BE for it to connect.

If you aren't sure if 6A will connect after hitting an airborne opponent with 5D, just go for j.B. It works on everyone in any situation.

[RagnaXBL]

why cant i combo off gauntlet hades? i always input it as fast as i can but the opponent always touches the ground b4 my 5b comes out. what am i doing wrong?

[Yggjrasil]

Are you delaying the 2nd part of Gauntlet Hades? If not then, thats what you're doing wrong.

[RagnaXBL]

oh didn't knw u had 2 delay it *facepalm*