bizarro

Do any of you know who's in charge of creating subforums? Maybe then I could send a PM or something...

I don't think its so much a matchup issue as it is adjusting to the player. If your j.2S continues to whiff because he likes to jump, try something else, like waiting for him to jump first and then airthrow. Also remember that you have plenty of time after an IAD j.2S to airdash again, summon a bubble, j.K, etc.

When you talk about j.H, do you mean using j.H after your first j.2S? Not too sure what you mean. But anyway, if you time it right the 2nd airdash into j.2S > j.H actually combos, but realistically this won't happen all the time. You can, however, hit confirm your first j.2S and if it did hit, just land and 2K which will continue the combo. BTW doing that IAD j.2S against May is very dangerous, as she can wake up with 6P and counterhit you regardless of the fish, and we all know what happens to Dizzy when you eat May's 6P

I see it the same way Wekk does, they're pretty much just a tweak on different timings, I've tried a few strings but they all seem inferior to the normal setups. [EDIT] Seems like glitch fish will have to wait... Oh and answer for Gonzales, the glitch fish is performed by hitting the 2nd fish input right at the end of the animation. If you time it right you get a fish that starts out performing the first command, then switches to the 2nd command, and afterwards immediately finishes the first command. BTW does anyone know if this was another "secret" that was meant to be in AC, or if they just screwed up?

I just came back from playing some friends, and yes, ino rapes dizzy for free

Very good insight into the matchup. Only thing I don't understand is the difference between Ino's S version and H version STBT. I like your recommendation about taking hits in the air so you can escape Ino's okizeme, similar to what some people I play do against my Dizzy by holding up after being knocked down (which works if I summon a split second too late). In my opinion, although it is true that Dizzy is fragile and will lose the bigger portion of her life with just one combo, Dizzy doesn't need health to win, she just needs one knockdown, solid okizeme, and the ability to read DAAs and bursts to win the round. It's entirely possible and happens very often where Dizzy has no life remaining but wins the round against a full-health opponent, all because she got a lucky throw during a reset attempt by the opponent. So if you are confident about your offensive strengths, you won't have to fear taking hits to escape (certain exceptions apply of course, such as Slayer + Jam who can win the round just by scoring a counterhit, and also require special okizeme patterns to keep them from escaping).

I read the staff thread for requests, seems like Nehle hasn't gotten a response yet. I put in my request too just now, so we'll see.

Yes, and it pushes them away for you to create space, or follow up with IAD since it is JCable

Best counter to pot j.D is gold burst :D

Wow I never knew j.2S was throw invincible

My bad. I saw the first link then didn't have time to see the rest, and eventually forgot about this post. I'll check it out. 1st Vid: Besides dropping all your dust combos it seemed well played. Venom is hard to deal with so try to end it with one knockdown. 2nd Vid: Good use of double air dash. Once again I wouldn't go for bubble loop on the first combo, utilize your knockdown+okizeme strength. Also at 1:10, if you're baiting his tech, throw out a f.S, it will destroy all back techs and give you enough time to survive a forward tech. Once again dropped combos will hurt you. 3rd Vid: Good use of imperial ray. I always find it best used as either a knockdown tool or to give room for summons. If you're able, try FRCing your icespikes whenever you have tension so you can put down a more solid okizeme, since tension isn't a big factor for damage. And once again, just say no to dropped combos!!! 4th Vid: Remember that venom is like you. He wants to be across the screen so he can set up his ball formations, which are actually superior to Dizzy's summons. Therefore, don't let him do it! If you see him retreating across the screen, airdash forward (use slashback for distance) and punish him. Also, this venom player likes to FD your pressure, so use pressure strings with more projectiles and less normals. Aaaand, get your combos down 2nd round was intense :p When you run away and land, you used imperial ray, i think necro would have been better since they're chasing you down and trying to score an antiair hit, necro would have punished those greedy bastards. It's the same buffer anyway. @ 3:20... come on, you shoulda seen that burst! Last round for him, last amount of life, burst available, it's coming for sure. 3:25, I woulda popped the bubble, but I think you woulda done the same in retrospect. 5th Vid: Glad you know about Dizzy's dash going over slidehead. Also remember that you have to use standing IB against Pot's 6H to avoid the slidehead trap. You need to hit confirm your pressure strings, you're dropping too many potential combos. Glad to see you finally pull off a dust combo And you know about IB the mega fist for a free throw 2:35 good f.S bait. And make it a habit to spam normals when you are up against hammerfall, a lot of people have an instinct to stop their attack and try to block, which means death. Can't believe you lost in the end though. End Note: remember that Dizzy is a character that can end the match with 1 knockdown, so practice your okizeme, and use combos that end with knockdown.

5S = f.S? The multi hit one I'm presuming. Yeah f.S is powerful against Ino's dash, but if you're within f.S range Ino can just use her stbt (low slide), and if you're out of f.S range a chemical will kill you. It's still a gamble the way I see it, which means knowing your opponent. If it's your first time playing against that Ino player you're at a disadvantage due to unsafe pokes, and a "wait-and-see" mentality will just give Ino time to put more mixups on you. All in all I feel this matchup is in Ino's favor, does anyone know what the tier charts say?

Your fish saves you from chemical love only if it's out already. The only situation where you have enough time to summon is after a knockdown... otherwise I-no will just c.love when she sees you trying to create distance and score a counterhit on you (short of full screen away). EDIT: if you see ino using note, you can use your scythe (236S) to eat the hits

Good points, and also a tip on round openers: use crouching bock. Ino can start with chemical love right away, punishing a backdash or IAD. CL will whiff your crouching block, giving you time to punish with an icespike afterwards for a CH* if you do it fast enough or dash > throw for a more solid okizeme setup (you can also open with icespike and CH ino if you know she'll open with CL, but if ino does anything else you're in trouble) Crouching block will also save you from stbt, dash, and her midrange normals. Just 2K/2H the stbt, and 2S the dash. EDIT: oh and also, if you try a meaty 2K on knockdown, keep in mind ino can wake with vertical chemical love and punish you for it. if you have a summon out it might take the CL hit but I'm not sure *EDIT: actually, you won't be able to get a CH if you duck under the chemical love. the only way to get the CH is to icespike at the same time.

to be honest i have a hard time against ino too. if you think the note is annoying try her chemical love, it can punish you for summoning anywhere less than a full screen away. you have no real counters to that short baiting your summon and icespiking instead but you're rarely close enough for that and even if you were ino usually "strokes her big tree" (seriously wtf name is that??) speaking of which, with no summons on the floor at mid range you have to constantly watch out for her tree or a simple dash forward for an insanely fast high hit rushdown, which itself can be a fake into a low kick or a j.HS animation fake into land and grab. once you're down the note meaties you down for 3(?) full hits giving ino plenty of time without using its FRC to do the high/low/throw mixup on you all over again. breaks in her high/low rushdown are usually just another dash j.HS, or dizzy's 2D range. the only viable way to punish this reset at midrange is to anticipate another dash and throw out f.S, or use 2D/icespike in anticipation of her stroking her tree which means death if ino decides to dash instead. at farther midrange she just chemical loves FRC > airdash in > pressure which also takes us to her pressure using chemical-love-FRC > dash as a pressure reset (similar to baiken's tatami-mat-FRC rushdown). your only option to counter is to use her 2S anti-air as soon as she does chemical love, which will counter hit her when she follows with FRC > airdash > j.HS (which you can follow up with 421S for a bubble loop). oftentimes though, the ino will fuck up her airdash after FRC and will fall instead, which means your 2S will be empty and ino will counter you instead. ain't that fucked up? my advice for blocking? FD the first 2-3 hits (2 hits if ino opens with j.HS) and then SUPERJUMP the fuck outta there. don't do this too often or you'll be read, mix it up with a summon/dash every now and then. if you try to read her offense and find holes, you're dead. it is just too hard to punish her rushdown, it has a major advantage against dizzy's normals. try to counter only if you know the player well enough, for example if he can pull off the cloveFRC>airdash, or has tendency to use certain rushdown strings. edit: it might not be j.HS i know the animation but i don't know what her normals are listed as.

Yeah, the pots I used to play around here do that quite often. And after j.p they tend to pb

Slayer imo is definitely a hard matchup. At evo I got humiliated by Kami-chan's slayer :D I have a friend who plays slayer sometimes. Don't try dry summons, especially bubbles, as slayer can shoot across the screen almost instantly. If he does that overhead kick a lot, you can counter with 5P on reaction once you get used to it (2S seems a bit slow on reaction). Your 2S will fail against his j.H 90% of the time, and your 6P will fail as well, although it fairs slightly better than 2S. I find that 214P~H setup is safest as it will stay near you to take hits, but watch out for his ( i don't know slayer moves ) charging double kick (the one that launches) as the 2nd kick will hit you after the 1st kills the fish. You can backdash a lot of his moves, so try that out.

Just a tip, dizzy flies when she dashes, so you can just dash forward -> free combo when potemkin tries a random slidehead. you'll dash right through the slidehead :D oh yeah, potemkin sometimes does slidehead as anti air, if you airdash > j.2S, your j.2S will whiff and he'll punish you badly, to solve this just do a delayed j.H in place of the initial j.2S

For setups like throw > HS fish, some characters are able to jump so that the laser hits them when they are in the air. If the person you play tends to do this, pause a split second after your HS fish summon and then just run up and use f.S, it'll catch them good :D You can also end with a pretty sweet combo if you used double HS fish and if the distance is right: f.S (4 hits) > HS > icespike > FRC > IAD > bubble > 2nd laser hits > j.H > land > 421 > bubble loop

Hey Kuro you played dizzy at evo? I didn't see any dizzy players when I was there (except during the finals, alex g.) but I only participated in the team tourney so I didn't see what happened in the singles. Good to know there were others :D

Which part of the fish does the 2S hit? The laser or when it bites?

I'd be freaked out if I had to play against a Dizzy... I've played DI vs DI matchups on reload before, but I don't really know reload. In reload it seemed fairly easy, just predict the summons and dash > 2D or IAD > j.p > jp > ... In AC 2D is much crappier

From my experience, using sound as a cue can be a weakness. I remember the very first tourney I been to (back in slash), I had learned baiken's tatami mat FRC off of sound, but in a tourney setting I couldn't hear shit and I missed every single FRC. Visual cues are dangerous as well because like excelence said in the corner/counter you sometimes won't be able to see clearly, or under other circumstances. However, if there is a screen freeze, visual cues will save your ass in those rare situations.

By the way I'm curious, do any of you play against Dizzy players???

Wow you guys know the matchup well, they all make perfect sense from what I've seen of Ky. I almost never play any Kys so I'm fairly clueless, but I've played some that open with greed sever which you can counter with a j.P