Shoto

I will try it once more but again I couldn't do it if I didn't do 5K, 2D, rensen FRC before.. that was why I was so confused when this topic came up.. I did 63214S against an cornered opponent and I couldn't do a Rashousen afterwards, only the 6H came out.. haven't tried a running Rashousen, maybe that makes a difference.. Menso uses this as an ender for B-Loops in his newer matchvids. Instead of tapping 2 he FRCs the last rensen and follows up with 63214S, then he does a meaty rashousen.

@ Digital Watches This sounds more than promising.. nearly too good to work out^^.. any ideas how a reliable setup could look like (maybe a combination of attacks that just leave you in the right distance afterwards)? ..but even that I'm at least as exited as you are over this discovery of yours I think it's still justifiable to put it into the regular combo thread :P now to something completely different: ..changed a combo in the starting post.. after any of the 214 catches you can follow up with 6K instead of 5P for a bit of extra damage.. (exept JO and RO) and fooled around with a variation of the basisc rensen FRC combo (guess you already seen it in the later matchvids) rensen FRC, S©, 2S, 6K (1), 2S, SJC, j.H, j.D, koku Should work against most standard weight charas and gives you 4 dmg more but you need to catch your opponent lower for the full combo to connect and makes the SJC, j.H part much harder.. (so I personally will stick with the easier variation for now) ..and a short note concerning the meaty Rashousen setup after a slide: It only seems to work if you hit the character while airborne with 63214S or you wont be able to charge the Rashousen just like after a normal knockdown (hasn't yet been stated, even that the setups posted had it like that).. so it actually seems to be some sort of bug..

Axl Pros: + has quite even matchups against all charas (even top tiers) + can interrupt player on long range (which forces them to do something) + 2K is a low profile move that allows to start pressure / combos but evades lots of stuff + quite safe offence; doesn't need to count on high risk setups + pressure / mixup / damage is not too tension dependant (even that it helps^^) + fastest counters in the game (1-3 frames startup) + his long range anti air pokes all need to be blocked with FD + can go into pressure / mixup sequences from quite a range + good abare potential against airborne charas + can combo directly from nearly all of his pressure options + can combo in nearly every situation (anti air, counters, throw, pressure, jump ins, even in some air to air constellations [but needs FB Bomber therefore]) + most standard midscreen combos are quite burst safe Cons: - takes slightly more damage than standard and has a bad guts rating - has only very situational defence mechanism (including his DAA) - no fast short range pokes (fastest move 6 frames startuo [5K]) - no good standalone mixup, everything he has is easy to be blocked on reaction - needs to be played very different depending on the match up (this counts as well for offence as for defence) - it's nearly impossible for him to fill the enemies guard gauge - has a hard time dealing with DAAs as he has no fast moves to bait them or good throw setups to avoid them - has priority problem with his long range moves - useless OD (or lets say very situational) - even that he may combo from many situations, the damage is always average (except against cornered opponents) - Bomber Loops are in no way Burst safe

hm.. since in AC Axl finally has enough tension to burn I should give that FRC another try in VS :P

Just a short note: I had to experience in VS that any 2H, 6H pattern allows to slashback the 6H easily and nearly riskfree, as the 2H in most cases allows no other mixup (which leads to an punishment combo).. so try to vary it (i.e. do the 6H after the first hit from time to time) or delay it (of course this means it is no real pressure trap anymore as he could jump out but if he focuses on SB he is not likely to do that anyway^^) and don’t overuse it in the first place :P (even that it is so good on so many levels^^).. will put a note in that in the guide as soon as I find the time..

I knew that.. what I'm not sure is if you can link from 3P (CH) to 3H instead of canceling in it as part of the chain (what should give you time enough for the confirmation)..

concerning the 3P CH 5K thing: I believe it's that sort of thing where you either continue with the combo or you don't. I don't think that you can train to either do the combo or not, but not to decide if you should go on with the combo or should keep rushing (but it still is usefull even without that). We Axl players are somehow spoiled as most of Axl mixup strings work as combos anyway^^ but I'd say that 3P CH, 5K basically is a hitconfirm in the classical sense (but if you say it's misleading I delete the note in the starting post that says this combo is confirmable).. ..but I don't think that 3P (CH), 6H is really hitconfirmable.. 3P (CH), 5K gives you much more time to figure out if 3P hits as CH as it is a link which means you have the whole active time and recovery or 3P.. but 6H seems to be done as gatling, which means you must input it right after the 3P hits.. (but to be honest, I havent checked )

some random vs. Faust infos: - 5P doesn't hit a standing Faust, but if he throws out an item or does the scalpell pull he will get hit.. as the recovery is shorter than in Slash you can spam that move again if you believe he wants to do one of those things.. should he try to jump at you from that distance (and due to the fact that his air dash isn't any good) you can 6K him out of the air on reaction. Should he start running under 5P use 2P or 2H (into 6H if you hit or it gets blocked).. so he has to work to get something done in long range.. - If you have the chance to rush him, work with all you have (well exept the bomber if he ducks them^^).. he doesn't have any good defense options.. - If he pokes you out of UBs, only use short range UBs and set them up in a manner that he is unlikely to spot them (see the Lockdown threads for infos on that).. (btw.: even if he should be out of range to poke you out he simply can jump up and imideately do j.2K so he will stay too low for any 6K to connect; UBs in medium and long range are no real danger to him) - 6H beats 2P and his treasure chest OD - Axls 2D ducks under Fausts S(f) (one of the rare applications of a standalone 2D..)

I finally started writing something about Axls defence options.. but I'm not too confident with it and stuffs still missing.. (and I realized how matchup specific his defence really is).. I just had the feeling I finally have to start writing of I will never finish :P so hopefully it will at least get a discussion started^^

from what I've read: hold start during the versus screen (i.e. after selecting character and stage).. completely forgot about that.. never tested it tough..

Ok guys some new stuff to figure out: I tried to figure out a way to land B-Loops against Jam, as the second Bomber usually whiffed as Jams hitbox seems to be very "thin". So I tried dashing after a regular Bomber and it was quite easier than I thought it sould be (and yes with that you can get the second j.D, Bomber to connect on Jam). Now I tried it against some other charas and on some you could easily add a third loop (standard B-Loop).. It's a pity I'm so low on time these days.. Well nevertheless I will try to figure it out the next days^^, just thought you wanted to try for yourself^^.. (for a start try against Faust, it's easy to connect on him) ..oh and one strange thing: This one seems to be easier if done after an Rensen FRC than after a throw or a TK Bomber.. since I find the "TK Bomber in the middle" variation harder to do after a rensen FRC than after a throw (i. e. usually I don't get the knockdown as the rensen won't hit) this may be a worthy variation. (oh and compared to the Combo with a TK Bomber in the middle is does about 1 dmg more, so it's not for the damage but it seems to be more practical against some charas) Oh and find me a valid loop against ABA... She seems to be able to recover earlier than other charas (well, same as in Slash, but I guess it's gameplaywise to avoid knockdowns) I've seen throw, j.D, Bomber, j.D, Bomber in a matchvid.. is that really all one can get? (oh and some smaller updates in the combo and pressure posts..)

I think your getting me wrong.. I can't do a rashousen even that I have the charge in that situation (tried it against a dummy that ended up in the corner).. so there is no chance I will be able to do it meaty, not even that the opponent is only sliding..

Personlly I like 9(6)23H best.. I'd say choose the method you like best and practice it.

I tried that 63214S into meaty rashousen yesterday but couldn't pull it off.. can you explain me again how it can be done? All I get is the 6H..

(I always assumed that even after a slide you would have some kind of throw invincibility as you have it for a few frames after you get up from a normal knockdown.. should have checked) really cool stuff

Yeah, but the recovery doesn't matter.. for Baiken all that matters is how much block stun it causes.. and TK Bomber causes a lot.. but I promise I will try to cancel into 623P on reaction again next time I causally fight a Baiken if you guys are all that confident that it works ^^.

Doesn't work, as well as a cancel into a counter on reaction. Either you do one move and cancel into 63214S or a catch or you leave it. For the catch, if she delays her guard cancel she will always be able to hit you in the recovery of your catch. If you could counter her guard cancels on reaction this would be one of Axls easiest matchups.. btw.: Every of Axl moves can be guard cancelled without allowing you to block again. So two moves in a row, even that the recovery of the first got cancelled out, is more than she needs.. so no block strings against Baiken. Think so^^. If you find out about newer numbers let us know^^.

@ Digital Watches Speaking of 2S only the lower half of the chain seems to be hittable, so high up ion the air there shouldn't be chance to get a limp hit. May be different for 6K or 5P, but these aren't traditional anti airs anyway.. an airborne opponent it is unlikely to put out an attack that will beat the 6K chain.. but yes If been hit out of 5P and other long range pokes like 2H or 2P by a Volcanic Viper a few times. ..and I agree that projectiles are always a problem for your poke game.. as they travel towards you they reach the part where the chains are hittable sooner or later. @ RedBeard Since they usually want to attack you anyway I don't see the chance for an airthrow.. its not like they have to worry much about blocking. Using double jumps / airdashes to delay attacks lets counters whiff and allows instant punishment (without endangering the attacker too much), so Axls catches are not really that unbeatable choice. Don't get me wrong, I don't say that you are totally helpless in that situation, just that it is definitely is a situations which you want to avoid. Your enemy is in a much better position as you are. Especially true for Chipp and Sol from my experience.. against these to I have had this situation quite often and I always found it very hard to handle (and it's not that I did not try to use the stuff you suggested).

I'm not exactly sure what you mean with the first part of your question, so I have to guess^^: If you just wanted to know if you can hit them over and over every time that the tech out of either 6K or 2S or 5P: Clever teching or relying on air block (FD) after the tech should end such games very fast. In some situations when he techs towards you after being hit from 6K he may end up in reach for a 2S, but that is rather specific. Only against Pot you may be able to follow him with your pokes (and minimal position changes) from "tech to tech", but that is due to his huge hitbox and the lacking air dash (nevertheless blocking will again end such games, but will keep him away as well). Normaly their teching shouldn't be a problem except when they happen to end up directly above you. I had this situation Slash a few times, I believe it happened when my opponent teched towards me after being hit by a 2S high up into the air so I wasn't able to follow up with a combo. concerning the hitbox question: If done from quite a distance the worst thing that will happen is a clash (happens for example against some of Jams air normal's and against Pots "Butt Attack"), but if the chara jumping in on you is approximately in range to attack a "standing Axl" you usually get a hit trade. So the strength of Axl Anti Air game is that he can attack them before they come in that reach (plus they have to use FD to block it if airborne) and that you can combo directly from them, but yes, they are no high priority attacks.

No No, I'm pretty sure you're right^^, I fooled around with it in practice yesterday myself.. it really seems to depend on the frame on which you FRC.. guess it's the last of the 3 frames since I find it much easier to let it whiff than to let it hit [the hitting part actually never occured to me before until know that I tried to force it, so thanks for the information^^].. if you do it early it will whiff on every chara, including Pot.. weird stuff, is there anything similar in the Game for other charas?

@ Redbeard: koku throw bait: I think I get it, so you don't want it to hit meaty but a bit later when the opponent is still in the recovery of his HardSlash? I'll try it that way.. (even that I'm still not to confident about it) ..and the 4 frame crossup stuff is news to me either^^.. (as was your tension pulse post which was very helpful, so thanks^^). Where do you come up with this engine stuff? (it for sure wasn't on gamecombos and isn't something you come up simply by playing, do you? [if yes, my respect]).. It would explain a few meetings where I just seemed to block nearly every corssup a Chipp player threw at me..

It never worked as a throw bait for me.. it's just too slow (jump start up, time to reach the minimum height, actual startup of the move).. everybody will see that you are airborne and not try to throw you.. (which is very said as yes, you can get a huge combo from a low to the ground hit against a cornered opponent). but tell me more about the air throw thing ..

@ Digital Watches Ok, I think you're right.. it's quite useful in some situations; just the fact that you can't get good damage from it in most situations where it would fit and the fact that you have to pay 25% tension to use it safely makes it less favourable.. so saying it is generally not to useful is not fair to that move^^. and how do you connect the 63214S FRC on any other chara than Pot? ..and even for Pot it seems to need quite as specific distance.. I really could connect it only a few times..

Thanks *blush* I will try to cover that.. but I actually still have some combos to check, need to go trough the pressure and lockdown stuff and wanted to write something about the defence basics.. (and have to go trough the Move Analysis once more..).. and I still have a life :P I'll try to come up with keep away stuff as soon as possible, but as it was my weakest "guide" I'm not sure when I find the time to restructure it.. but I'll try my best^^ btw.: don't take my stuff as a gospel truth or something, just try to figure out what works for your play style and tell me if you think I'm wrong on things.. (I'm nowhere in a position where I could claim I know it all)

Honestly I don't had any problems connecting the rensen after a few days of practice (no matter if it's the standard and the more damage variation).. so while I think you should go with that combo if it suits you better I wouldn't say its too hard to do. (From my point of view the real challange is to get the TK Bomber and the follow up dash right (in the more damage variation)). From my experience you can buffer the recovery input, means if you do it a few frames before the untechable time ends, your chara will recover on the first possible frame.. yup that means mashing works in most cases (but makes you damn predictable if done in the wrong situations)